Asset file hinting at future and/or cut content

To further hammer in one point. No one is bothered by Bulgaria because we know for a fact we will undoubtedly get the Byzantines eventually. But if we heard we would NOT get the Byzantines at all in favor of Bulgaria, I think a lot of people would get upset. I don't feel like most of us have the same confidence that we are guaranteed a Denmark if Iceland is in the game. There is a serious concern they skip it.
 
Xefjord said:
It's mostly relevant to the roleplayers that like either TSL Earth or continuous civ lines. From a TSL Earth perspective, there is still a gaping hole in all of Scandinavia. Having an island to the far northwest just feels like a technicality, not actual Scandinavian representation, and that Civ won't make a huge difference in the geopolitics of Europe. It's cool when paired with an another Scandinavia rep and a English rep, but by itself it feels like we are going on longer without that TSL niche being filled.

Regarding the continuous civ lines, Iceland is just kind of weird. It isn't really a predecessor or successor to any culture that would be on the map. It technically stems off of Denmark/Norway, but Denmark and Norway wouldn't be in the game until Exploration, and while Denmark/Norway could build into Sweden based off the many unions that saw them sharing territory, Iceland doesn't really build into anything.

That isn't to say that Iceland isn't cool, it's just a weird first pick that people are concerned may mean we don't receive another Age 2 Scandinavian Civ.
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I'm still open to the idea that we would eventually get an Antiquity Norse civ, that would be the "Viking" civ. From there the Norse could easily progress into the Normans, or any other Scandinavian civ like Iceland. I originally thought Kalmar Denmark would be the top pick, but it's a possibility that Iceland could fill that role. I do agree that Kalmar Denmark might make more sense progressing into a Modern Sweden.
 
I wish we could view the little diorama figures of the units and leaders (like in the last pic and as crop up sometimes in game) in a viewing mode, maybe unlocking them as we play through the game if they wanted to gamify it a bit. They put so much effort into them, it's a waste to have them so tiny on the map.
 
SeelingCat said:
Looking around the files, there are some mockups of what may have been earlier or alternative concepts for the event windows

Click to expand...
Can't help but wonder what made them redo half of the UI six months before release. Each of these three versions is more interesting than what we got, if you ask me. The third one is my favourite, though the book is a nice bit of flavour.

Our people are homeless. Our people are homeless. Our people are homeless. Our people
 
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Isca Dumnoniorum said:
I wish we could view the little diorama figures of the units and leaders (like in the last pic and as crop up sometimes in game) in a viewing mode, maybe unlocking them as we play through the game if they wanted to gamify it a bit. They put so much effort into them, it's a waste to have them so tiny on the map.
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Agreed. A trophy screen with unlocking those models would be a cool addition to the meta progression. Maybe if they add meta progression for playing specific civs instead of just for leaders.
 
I was shocked that there isn’t a model viewer when some of the promos showed close-ups of the models
 
Alexander's Hetaroi said:
I'm still open to the idea that we would eventually get an Antiquity Norse civ
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If this does happen then it would solve the problem, but I don't know what that antiquity era Civ would be. I have advocated for a Saxon/Franks civ in the antiquities, but I can't think of any well known groups that would represent the Vikings specifically in antiquities, and at least right now, I am happy we have specific names and not vague group names like "The Celts" or "The Vikings"

Best name I could think of is maybe "Norse" but that still feels a little weird. We did get the Khmer in antiquity though, so I suppose it isn't totally impossible. It would just be an odd dynamic seeing the Norse raid Rome and Greece. I still hope we get a Viking civ exploration age. Not just Iceland.
 
Splitting the Viking into the pre-1000 (or so) Viking Raiding civ (Call it Norse, Norwegians, Danes or whatever you will) in Antiquity and the post-1000 Trans-Atlantic exploration civ in the form of Iceland (who were pretty much the only ones to do it) make a lot of sense.

The presence of the Normans in Exploration already spelled out (very) loudly that we would need some Norse civ in Antiquity, and it being antiquity already made it clear this would have to be a civ about raiding and expansion along river, not an oceanic seafaring civ.

Iceland just confirms that.

(As to it being weird to have vikings raiding Rome and Greece, them raiding the Spanish or even the Normans is just as weird ; the people they want to raid - the Saxons and the Franks - aren't in the game yet. And if they are to be added, you and I agree on where they should be: in Antiquity. So if the Norse wants to raid them...)
 
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Xefjord said:
If this does happen then it would solve the problem, but I don't know what that antiquity era Civ would be. I have advocated for a Saxon/Franks civ in the antiquities, but I can't think of any well known groups that would represent the Vikings specifically in antiquities, and at least right now, I am happy we have specific names and not vague group names like "The Celts" or "The Vikings"

Best name I could think of is maybe "Norse" but that still feels a little weird.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I specifically meant calling them the Norse. It would be a vague name but at least it's better than calling them "the Vikings". Humankind used the term Norsemen

The other option which they could take is if they forgo having Denmark in Exploration, they could have Antiquity Danes.
 
Alexander's Hetaroi said:
Yeah, I specifically meant calling them the Norse. It would be a vague name but at least it's better than calling them "the Vikings". Humankind used the term Norsemen

The other option which they could take is if they forgo having Denmark in Exploration, they could have Antiquity Danes.
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The problem is, before 600 - 700 CE there really isn't anything to distinguish between the Scandinavian later polities: Danes, Swedes, Norwegians from the archeological record do not seem to be particulkarly different in any important (or noticeable) ways.

Which means any attempt to give them a later title like Danes or Swedes will inevitably also include a bunch of later attributes that may or may not be appropriate at all, and also runs the risk of precluding having any of those in a later Age when they would be more appropriate (like Cnut's Denmark in Exploration, or the dominating Swedes of the late Exploration/early Modern Ages).

The better possibilities are, possibly, the more generic term 'Norse' which was applied to anybody from Scandinavia with anti-social tendencies, or possibly 'Nordic' which is used to describe both the Scandinavia Bronze and Iron Ages (everything prior to about 700 CE when 'Vikings' enter the historical record)
 
Xefjord said:
If this does happen then it would solve the problem, but I don't know what that antiquity era Civ would be. I have advocated for a Saxon/Franks civ in the antiquities, but I can't think of any well known groups that would represent the Vikings specifically in antiquities, and at least right now, I am happy we have specific names and not vague group names like "The Celts" or "The Vikings"
Click to expand...
The Danes as depicted in Beowulf or the Burgundians as depicted in the Nibelungenlied could both work as Antiquity Age civs (even if Beowulf took place extremely early in the 6th century):

TheSpaceCowboy said:
Danes
Antiquity Age civ

The gameplay of the Danes revolves around small scale raiding and pillaging while avoiding full scale war.

Unique Ability - Weregeld
Melee units can enter and pillage the territory of civs with which the Danes have a neutral or hostile relationship.
Dane units inside neutral or hostile territory may be attacked without incurring diplomatic penalties.
Whenever the Danes kill a unit from a civ which they are not at war with, the Danes pay that civ Gold equal to the cost of the unit.
The Danes cannot acquire Resources through Trade Routes

Unique Military Unit - Gesith
Infantry unit.
Pillaging cost no movement, and can move after pillaging

Unique Civilian Unit - Scop
Unique Commander
Units in its command radius gain Gold when pillaging any tile.
When stationed on a Sal, gains Culture per turn for every tile pillaged by a unit in its stack

Unique Infrastructure
Borg - Unique Quarter. Counts as a Fortification
Sal - Must be built on a hill. Influence base. Food adjacency with Farms and Fishing boats. Happiness adjacency with Wine.
Høj - Changes the terrain to a hill if not so already. Gains the same yields as the Alter based on the Pantheon selected. Can only be bought with Gold, not built. The number of Høje is limited to the number of Dane units killed.

Civics

“Hwæt!”
Tier 1 - Unlock the Sal. Unlock the Sceaf Tradition.
Sceaf - Pillaging Farms automatically heals the unit and grants Food to the Capital​
Tier 2 - Unlock the Høj. Unlock the Scyld Tradition
Scyld - Pillaging Mines automatically Fortifies the unit and grants Production towards units in the Capital​

Danegeld
Tier 1 - Pillaging a Town Center steals its Bonus Resource(s); pillaging a City Center steals its City Resources. Pillaging a Capital steals its Empire Resources.
Tier 2 - Unlocks an Endeavor which prevents the agreeing civ from being Pillaged by the Danes for a set number of turns in exchange for Gold.

Fróðafrið
Tier 1 - When not at War, the Danes take no damage from Natural Disasters and domestic Trade Routes receive a significant amount of Gold per tile traveled
Tier 2 - Unlock the Heorot Wonder

Associated Leader - Hrothgar

Associated Wonder - Heorot

Unlocks the Anglo-Saxons in the Exploration Age
Unlocks the Vikings in the Exploration Age
Unlocks Sweden in the Modern Age
Click to expand...
 
I have been looking at maps of 1 AD Europe and it does seem like the Danes as a tribe did exist during this time. They just didn't get big until the Viking age. So I do think an antiquity age Danes could be acceptable. We could have a Norway in the Exploration age if we wanted another Exploration age Civ, or a Denmark in contrast to Danes. Norse is OK. I just want /something/ for antiquity Germanic peoples.
 
Norse *would* be antiquity Germanic people, though. (But I agree they shouldn't be *all* of it, and we should have more).
 
stealth_nsk said:
Ok, variety of opponents in multiplayer is third perspective, but it's still leader+civ combination. Each leader has very powerful abilities, which are often game-changers, like additional resource slots and the like.
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It's not just in multiplayer, it's singleplayer too

If I'm for example, trying to play an all Asian or Middle Eastern, let alone all Indigenous American match, then even in solo play, it doesn't matter if the game has like 6-7 total civs from those regions across all the eras, because I only play one era at a time and then I can only have 2-3 other civs in the game (if even that) else for some eras there will have to be non fitting ones.

I also think you, like Firaxis, might be overestimating how much the people into the series for the history set dressing care about Leaders: I have always seen leaders just as a figurehead proxy for the civilization they are representing. From that historically minded perspective, the gameplay combinations you get by mix and matching leaders and civs is, I guess, neat, but it is vastly outweighed by the negatives of not every civ having a fitting leader and especially the fact that even the ones which *do* have a fitting leader, will be forced to have them not fit in specific eras where they are a different civ, or because two civs might share the only somewhat sensical leader option and only one of them can use it

Anyways, at this point the conversation is becoming less about the merits or downsides of a fourth "Atomic" era, and more about the civ switching and leader mechanics in general, which isn't what this thread is about, so I think maybe we should leave it here, ahaha
 
GjiZ4scWMAARWMT.jpeg


This is from Twitter
https://twitter.com/x/status/1889429552331640996
. Seems another UI version was in the works, or this is a very early version.
 
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