Asterix the Gaul -- Or: How to get the biggest bang out of the Gallic Swordsman

[Lanzelot]

Some submissions are still missing, but I decided to post my turnset now as well. For those who didn't submit yet: don't read...

T031, 2510 BC:
Worker is finished and moves to the plains 2SW. I would have liked to improve the river grassland first, but this takes to long: after pondering the situation for quite a while, I found that the fastest way to get into the 4-turn cycle, is to build a worker in 3 now, then a settler in 6 and then 4-turn settlers from that on. For this I need to have 5 fully improved tiles in 9 turns from now, and the sixth tile on turn 11. The only way to have these tiles in time, is to irrigate two more plains. At the same time, that plains tile allows the next settler reaching the cow one turn faster, another advantage compared to the river grass tile.
Following PaperBeetle's idea, I switch the BG to scientist for this turn, which allows me to set lux down to 0%, so that Entremont is making 13bpt now.
Alesia is founded and works on a river BG for 2s and 3b, starts on a warrior.
Scouting warrior 1SW on the hill.

T032, 2470 BC:
Worker starts a road, warrior 1W on the inland hill. Chinese borders are spotted.
In order to grow in the remaining two turns, the scientist is sent back to work on the BG, lux raised to 10%.

T033, 2430 BC:
Irrigation finishes, worker 1 starts road. Warrior 1W.
There are 17b left on Writing, I'm currently making 13b, so I lower the science slider to 60%, which results in 9b.

T034, 2390 BC:
Worker 3 finishes and starts mining the BG.
Warrior 1W and Shift-D establishes contact with the Chinese. They are up Warrior Code and Iron Working. We have nothing of interest to them.
In order to have the necessary 4spt for a settler in 6, Entremont is set as follows:

As Alesia would have overrun of 1 food anyway, I temporarily switch it from the river BG to the gold hill. This nets the remaining 8b for Writing at 60% science.

T035, 2350 BC:
Writing finished and Code of Laws started.
Worker 2 finishes road and starts irrigation. A barb warrior appears in the vicinity, so I'll need to send a warrior for protection next turn. Luckily the road from Alesia to Entremont will be done by then.

Warrior 1S. After I met the Chinese, let's get back to the coast again.

Of course, Alesia is switched back to the BG in order to finish growth in 3.

If I wanted to, I could probably get Wheel, Warrior Code, Iron Working and Mysticism from my three contacts now, but giving away Writing at this early point would jeopardize the Republic slingshot, so I'm holding it back for now.

T036, 2310 BC:
Warrior in Alesia finishes. Luckily the barb moved away again, so I can fortify the new warrior in Alesia for now. Worker 1 finishes the road and moves to the BG 1NW of Entremont in order to speed up the mine there.

Entremont has grown to 5 and picked up the forest. I switch that back to river grassland to keep 5fpt. 4spt is enough for the settler to finish in 4. Now luxury needs to be increased to 20%.

Warrior 1S, reaches the coast.

T037, 2270 BC:
Warrior 1W.

T038, 2230 BC:
The mine on the BG finishes. I send one worker to the plains S-SW of Entremont, as the irrigation there needs to be done in 4 turns from now (current settler still needs 2 turns, and 2 more turns Entremont will be at size 5, so doesn't need the extra plains yet. The other worker is sent to the floodplain NE of Alesia. I was thinking about what would be better, first mining Alesia's BGs or irrigating the floodplains. I decided for the floodplains, because of the following reasons:

• Entremont will need to run at size 5-6 for quite some time now, which means lux tax between 20-30%. So in order to not waste the lux tax in Alesia, it should grow to 5-6 quickly as well.
• The irrigation will be faster than the mines.
• Perhaps I can pop-rush 20 shields into Alesia's granary. Usually I'm not a fan of pop-rushing, because in my opinion it is nearly never worth the lost population and the extra unhappiness. But perhaps in this case it can be used with benefit. (Most probably it won't, though...)
• I can reach the floodplain without wasting a worker turn, something that is not possible with the BGs.

Entremont has grown to 6 now, picking up another forest. I switch it to the remaining river grassland and increase lux tax to 30%. Alesia has grown to 2. At first I thought, it would be good again to use the gold hill now for one turn to get the extra commerce, but then I realized: if I use +3 food now, I can grow one turn earlier: the irrigation on the floodplain will finish in 4 turns from now, so with 4 x 3f + 2 x 4f = 20f Alesia can grow in 6 instead of 7 turns. That one extra gold (one is lost to corruption and another one goes into lux tax anyway...) is not worth delaying growth by one turn. See the two screen-shots, Alesia without and with the gold hill:

I also wake the warrior in Alesia and send it to Entremont, moving another warrior from Entremont to protect the worker currently irrigating 2 SW of Entremont. Because meanwhile two warriors appeared on our borders, and I'm not sure, what they are up to:

Warrior S.

T039, 2190 BC:
The irrigation on the plains finished, neither the Chinese nor the Romans attacked. Good.
The worker on the plains S-SW now starts irrigating. That irrigation will finish in the interturn after Entremont has grown to size 6, so Entremont can already use the food in that interturn and the irrigation doesn't need to be sped up. Therefore I can sent the worker now to the river grassland SE of Entremont. I want to replace the irrigated plains with mined river grasslands asap, in order to get the extra commerce. The two plains can in the long run be used by the cow town and by another town on the western coast (or perhaps by a temporary town on the gold hill?!).
The other two workers (plains and floodplains) now start irrigation.

Warrior S.

T040, 2150 BC:
Entremont finishes the settler (unfortunately wasting 3s) and drops back to size 5. Alesia finishes another warrior, which gets fortified in town. Consequently I can now drop lux tax to 20% again.

The worker starts a road SE of Entremont.
The warrior that has been camping outside last turn, is now sent into the forest 1W-2S of Entremont, in order to check, whether the coast is clear for the settler to follow. No danger to be seen, so the settler follows suit.

Warrior S. Spots a furs resource, but that is so far away, it will probably not make a difference in this game.

Entremont is now setup at 5fpt and 6spt and is therefore at the start of a perfect 4-turn settler factory. The last remaining 2f/1s tile for usage at size 6 (the plains at S-SW) will be ready in three more turns, just in time after Entremont has grown to size 6.

So in turn 40, the 4-turner starts operation, which is 11 turns later as in PaperBeetle's and templar's examples. This shows that their approach (basically farmer gambit combined with an early worker before the granary) is more powerful in terms of expansion. However, as I already built a settler "out of order", I'm only "one and a half" towns/settlers behind at the moment, and as already discussed earlier, I got something as compensation for the slower start: more security, a better view of the territory and more commerce: at this point I have already collected 53 beakers towards Code of Laws, compared to PaperBeetle, who just finished Writing this turn.
It will be interesting to follow, when the "break-even point" will be reached: before or after the slingshot.

 

[PaperBeetle]

Good set Lanze. As we theorized a couple of pages back, your route may have a little lag in getting settlers out compared to mine, but it is accruing noticeably more commerce, even without taking into account the 80g I gave to Mao.

Incidentally, following Templar's experience, what are we going to do with great scientists? I happen to know that I'll be getting one in a couple of turnset's time.

 

[Lanzelot]

nice that you did not point out that actually i did not do the usual MM-procedure! playing only by my feeling and not with a spreadsheet, i overestimated how early i needed all the mines on the grasses. when they finished, i believe i realized that 1 plains road could have finished before i had to move on. that was a couple of commerce lost.

Well, to be honest, I was too lazy to double-check your MM and took it for granted, that you omitted the roads for a good reason... But yes, once you have overcome the initial "phase of vulnerability", your start is much more powerful and should catch up easily. The only risk is perhaps that similar to what happened to PaperBeetle you are forced to give up some gpt in order to make a threatening neighbor peaceful. This leads me to the following question: assuming this would have been a game on Sid, would you have chosen the same strategy? Or would it have been too risky, considering the proximity of the AIs and the SID bonus units?

Incidentally, following Templar's experience, what are we going to do with great scientists? I happen to know that I'll be getting one in a couple of turnset's time.

I have to admit that I left on SGLs by accident... Usually I play without them (simply because most of my games are for the XOTM competition and they are disabled there). I guess the game I had just played prior to generating this game, happened to be the "Intersite Democracy Game" which is played with SGLs on, and the game settings just carried over to this one (except for the ones I remembered to change).

Let me add a general remark on SGLs. Of course in a way Spoonwood and templar_x are both right: an SGL in the early phase is a game deciding advantage (especially for 20K games), but on the other hand it is of course extremely unlikely to get an SGL on Sid (and therefore it just adds another advantage to the already considerable advantages of the AI, because in 99.99% of your games the AI will get all the SGLs...). In a HoF game, where you can just roll another game until you finally get one with the desired SGL, this is not so important. However, in XOTM competition, where you have only one shot and are required to play out that game to the end, it would be too unbalancing. One lucky SGL (with otherwise approximately equal playing skill of the competitors) would already decide the outcome of the competition; the luck factor is just too big. And this is probably the reason why they are disabled in XOTM. (MGLs are also a certain luck factor, but if someone really wants to generate an MGL, he/she can easily create a couple hundred combat events and there is a certain likelyhood that both competitors will get their fair share. The opportunities for an SGL however, are much scarcer, considering that on Sid most of the techs will be researched by the AI.

Anyway, to answer your question: I'll be a sadist now and decree: any SGLs shall immediately be disbanded.

(Just pretend that I did not forget to untick that check-box... In any case I think for the students of this game it will be much more beneficial to play without them. If you want to learn and understand the mechanics of multiplication, division, extracting a root, etc, you need to solve a couple of exercises with pencil and paper. If someone gifts you a pocket calculator, you will of course be able to solve these exercises much more easily, but the learning effect will be lost...)

Speaking of the learning effect: PaperBeetle, I noticed that you founded your first city far away on the coast at distance 5 (just like Aabraxan and splunge did). templar_x and myself on the other hand founded quite close to the capital at E-SE. What is your opinion on that topic? An early curragh will certainly be powerful, but is the closeby first town not better in terms of reduced corruption and quicker utilization of more land?

 

[templar_x]

This leads me to the following question: assuming this would have been a game on Sid, would you have chosen the same strategy? Or would it have been too risky, considering the proximity of the AIs and the SID bonus units?

on Sid, I may have well even left out the initial warrior. neither scouting helps much on Sid (they meet you faster, and when you get there you have nothing to trade normally), nor does 1 warrior do you any good when they can come up with 10 units in 3500 bc.

so since every approach can end like a farmers gambit, i practically will nearly always play one.

t_x

 

[PaperBeetle]

Speaking of the learning effect: PaperBeetle, I noticed that you founded your first city far away on the coast at distance 5 (just like Aabraxan and splunge did). templar_x and myself on the other hand founded quite close to the capital at E-SE. What is your opinion on that topic? An early curragh will certainly be powerful, but is the closeby first town not better in terms of reduced corruption and quicker utilization of more land?

My opinion is that you guys are probably right to have squeezed that extra town in, particularly as it does already access the two flood plains which my coastal town is using. I'm a PtW player at heart, where putting a town at RCP2 is pretty much a guarantee to spoil your ring system, so I'm just not used to looking that close to the capital for settle spots. Mind you, I don't think RCP5 is especially far out. I've had plenty of GotMs where my first ring was at RCP5.

 

[Lanzelot]

Ok, it looks like we've lost Glasnost and Sparthage on the way, but I want to go ahead now anyway. So here are my ideas & suggestions regarding your turnsets.


creamcheese:
The first thing to notice, is that creamcheese's approach also has a very high commerce! Already 40b collected for CoL and doing 14bpt, which is more than mine (though my 3rd city will be founded the next turn, when I should be at the same income). So this game is going pretty well, nothing to worry about.

The settler factory, however, is not yet operating smoothly, this may cause you to fall behind slightly over the next 1-2 turnsets. Here the question is: you still need one more 2f 1s tile, so why are you roading the forest? The extra commerce can't be collected on growth, and if you want to chop it, you had better done this before building the road. But the 10s from a chop would not be useful at this point of time, if I calculated correctly. (Entremont is already making enough shields for a settler - food is the problem.) Perhaps you can use the forest for producing an archer (instead of a warrior) after the current settler, while Entremont grows back to size?! So basically a 6-turn warrior/settler cycle would turn into an archer/settler cycle... And after that, Entremont should hopefully be ready to enter the 4-turn settler cycle.
So I think the worker management was not optimal here. Instead of going in the forest, the workers should perhaps have mined the river grassland instead in this game?!


Aabraxan:
I think the basic question of this turnset is: was pop-rushing the granary a good move or a bad move?
Comparing your 2150 save with creamcheese's and mine, I would say it was not good: you are already 1 town behind, and also you still need to run 30% lux compared to 20%.
Also: as the food box was empty, when you made the rush, there was no need to have the gran already at that time, was there? I don't have the save from that point, so I don't know the shield and food situation, but was it perhaps possible to exchange some food for shields and make 5-5-6-6 shields, while growing in 5 or 6 turns?
Also: you did not waste only 2s, you wasted 6 (because the 4 "regular" shields were not used, the box was already full anyway..) When rushing in a highly productive city (no matter whether it's pop-rush or cash-rush), one should try to "short-rush" instead of rushing the full object. I.e. when building a granary, and you want to speed it up by sacrificing one citizen, don't rush shields 41-60, rush 21-40 (by using a barracks or Longbow for example) or you could also rush shields 11-30 by using a settler. That way none of the precious "regular" production of the city is lost and the object usually finishes one turn faster.

Let's illustrate this with an example: for simplicity assume our town makes 5spt and we want to build a granary. If we don't rush, it will take 12 turns. If we let it collect 40s in 8 turns and then rush the remaining 20s, the granary will finish on turn 9. If we collect 20s (4 turns), then rush a barracks and then let the remaining 20s finish normally (another 4 turns), we will have the granary on turn 8!


You mention the "science makes me unhappy" effect. I have also noticed this quite often in my games. I think it is due to some strange rounding effects, when the game breaks the percentages down into integer numbers. This is done per town and not on the total income.


Ok, one more point I don't understand: Entremont has a granary, but then starts building a barracks?! At the same time Alesia is building a regular archer. In the early game, no town needs both, a granary and a barracks. The towns with granaries build settlers or workers, the towns with barracks build military. So Entremont should have started settler production immediately, and Alesia (or even better the third town, as Alesia with its 5fpt will be perfect for worker production, so needs a granary as well) should get a barracks.

And finally: why did you give Writing away? Ok, you don't want to go for Republic, but still you could have gone for Mysticism first, then Philo and pick Polytheism for free. Or, if Writing is still unknown by the time you get Mysticism, be bold and do Polytheism first and then pick Monarchy as free-bee!

But anyway, I think Monarchy is not necessary in games like these. We are the ones who do the dishing out, so war weariness is not going to be a problem. And we'll soon have enough towns so that unit upkeep won't be a problem either. In my opinion, Monarchy just doesn't have enough income for a successful speedy military game. And in addition it usually takes much longer to get into Monarchy than it takes to get to Republic, so we are looking at a much longer Despotism phase and a higher risk for a long Anarchy (ok, in this case we are religious, but in general that's a factor). And Monarchy is not going to catch that up.


splunge the 2nd:
Research is a bit slower than in other games, but the slingshot should still be doable. After all you got Writing the same turn as PaperBeetle (though he'll now accelerate quite a bit due to his settler factory, so you'll probably fall behind a bit from here).
However, both towns are quite far away in this game, and it will be very hard to defend in case those roaming Roman or Chinese warriors decide to attack! BTW, Lugdunum should have been built on the river, not on the coast. With 4fpt it would already have 5-turn growth instead of 7-turn! (And some extra commerce.)

And you don't have enough workers. Instead of that settler that is going to finish next turn, I would first have built one or two more workers. Firstly for getting the 4-turner up and running, and secondly for connecting Lugdunum.

The production in Entremont is not well-optimized at the moment, wasting quite a lot of food and shields! At least make sure to set it up like this, before you continue:

That way you earn 6 more commerce and Entremont will still grow & produce the settler next turn. Alesia can also pick up an extra coin by working a coast tile this turn. Research can then turned down to 40%. (But remember to increase lux to 20%, otherwise Entremont is going to riot!)


Ok, I'd say "clear the ring for round 4"!
We'll save at the end of turn 50 (1750 BC).

 

[creamcheese]

creamcheese:
The first thing to notice, is that creamcheese's approach also has a very high commerce! Already 40b collected for CoL and doing 14bpt, which is more than mine (though my 3rd city will be founded the next turn, when I should be at the same income). So this game is going pretty well, nothing to worry about.

The settler factory, however, is not yet operating smoothly, this may cause you to fall behind slightly over the next 1-2 turnsets. Here the question is: you still need one more 2f 1s tile, so why are you roading the forest? The extra commerce can't be collected on growth, and if you want to chop it, you had better done this before building the road. But the 10s from a chop would not be useful at this point of time, if I calculated correctly. (Entremont is already making enough shields for a settler - food is the problem.) Perhaps you can use the forest for producing an archer (instead of a warrior) after the current settler, while Entremont grows back to size?! So basically a 6-turn warrior/settler cycle would turn into an archer/settler cycle... And after that, Entremont should hopefully be ready to enter the 4-turn settler cycle.
So I think the worker management was not optimal here. Instead of going in the forest, the workers should perhaps have mined the river grassland instead in this game?!



Ok, I'd say "clear the ring for round 4"!
We'll save at the end of turn 50 (1750 BC).

Okay I'll get started tomorrow.

As far as the worker, I moved him there and then realized what you did, that chopping would be pointless, I didn't want to waste the move, so I just roaded. Less than optimal, I know, my workers I always sort of flail around with without any coherent plan. I am aiming to get my 4-turner up soon, but you are right, I will suffer for my lack of MM.

 

[Lanzelot]

As far as the worker, I moved him there and then realized what you did, that chopping would be pointless

I know that problem from own experience... Therefore you should calculate before you move a worker on a forest: "when will the timber fall and will it do me any good at that point of time?"
If not, improve another tile instead.

 

[Spoonwood]

I know that problem from own experience... Therefore you should calculate before you move a worker on a forest: "when will the timber fall and will it do me any good at that point of time?"
If not, improve another tile instead.

In Conquests, a non-industrious worker takes 4 turns to chop a forest, while an industrious worker takes 3 turns (in Despotism or Republic, or Monarchy... I don't know about Democracy and Fascism). Forests take longer to chop in Vanilla.

 

[templar_x]

3 more towns, the worker pump on its way, and i pursue some commerce goal as well.

somewhere in between i was able to buy a precious slave, however for the steep price of Myst+4gpt+11 gold. this does not really foster my research, but i hope to be able to maintain high research until the slingshot. maths is around, which is a nice thing. CoL in 1 turn, Philo next.

t_x

 

[splunge the 2nd]

I hope I can make the slingshot...

Next turn set maybe Wednesday. Family's coming in for the holiday.

 

[creamcheese]

Okay, set done before departing for Thanksgiving.

Turn Log:

Spoiler :

Turn 0, 2150BC; everything as I left it, hit enter.

IBT; roman warrior goes south, yay!

Turn 1, 2110BC; Alesia worker-->worker. New worker to cow.

IBT; zzz

Turn 2, 2070BC; worker irrigates cow near alesia. Scout goes south, looking for another civ to trade with. MM entremont for one more gold.

IBT; zzz

Turn 3, 2030BC; Entre settler-->settler. I see a legionary in Veii as I pass by. Rome is a bad target now. Workers chop forest by Entre. Slider to 90% science.

IBT; get booted by Rome, fine with me, I get a free square of scouting.

Turn 4, 1990BC; Adjust slider to fix lugdunum.

IBT; zzz

Turn 5, 1950BC; Alesia worker-->granary. Forest by Entre chopped, start irrigating. MM Entre for 4 turn settler. Found Camulodunum SE of gold hill on river -->warrior.

IBT; zzz

Turn 6, 1910BC; zzz

IBT; zzz

Turn 7, 1870BC; Entre settler-->warrior. Lugdunum warrior-->worker. MM for shields. Find city of Rome in the south, has furs near capital.

IBT; zzz

Turn 8, 1830BC; Alesia workers to forest. Found Richborough 2w of Entre -->warrior.

IBT; zzz

Turn 9, 1790BC; Entre warrior-->settler. Warrior goes south for MP duty in Alesia. Alesia workers start forest chop. Entre workers irrigate plains. See pink borders in the south.

IBT; zzz

Turn 10, 1750BC; Camulodunum warrior-->worker. Entre workers start road. Slider to 50% CoL in 2! No one we know has writing, although America Just got math. We see pink borders to our south, contact next turn.

Okay, the slingshot is probably safe, CoL in two, no one has writing. Hopefully the other continent isn't ahead. America just got math last interturn, I will think about trades to get me back up to parity next set.

Two more cities, and my factory is up and running with alesia working on a granary for another.

Most important Rome has Legionaries! Lanzelot suggested hitting them before they hook up iron, too late . I think America is my for sure target now, from the looks of the map, that will give us a protected back, so we can turn our full attention (and hopefully some catapults!) on the Romans later.

 

[PaperBeetle]

Normally, I try not to sell Writing until I am done researching Laws, but on this turn, Mao has a pretty good deal available: he still has 1gpt free from our deal last turn, plus I can get 8g and any two of (a) a slave, (b) Wheel, (c) Ironwork. Do I take the deal, and if so, which of the three options do I take?

2150bc
... yes, I take the deal, opting for the slave and Ironwork. This reveals iron near Camulodunum which I should be able to claim without much squabbling. The slave starts roading north from Entremont in anticipation of settling in that direction too.

2110bc
New builds: settler from Entremont, axe, curragh from Alesia on the east coast.
The settler heads south to claim the iron. The curragh also heads south, to map the continent by circulating clockwise.

2030bc
The curragh sees there is coast heading east away from the home continent. I decide to go check it out. Either it will lead somewhere interesting and I get to see it sooner rather than later, or it won't and the curragh can paddle back to the continent.

1990bc - 1950bc
New build: settler from Entremont, 2 axes.
Richborough is founded on the eastern coast, just beyond the iron, and as it is pretty corrupt, starts a worker. Meanwhile the new settler heads to the mountains north of Entremont, to scope out the area I plan to claim. It isn't very exciting; mostly just plains. Still, land is land, and fresh water isn't too far away.

1910bc
Mao has Mysticism.
I colony the dyes in the southwest. It's expensive to use up a worker on this, given that I plan to settle further in this direction soon anyway, but it saves me nine turns of extra luxury spending, so I think it will be worthwhile.
The curragh is exploring a medium-sized but very soggy island over in the east. Hardly a priority for settling, but it still might lead to the other continent.

1830bc
New builds: axe, curragh at Alesia.
The new curragh heads anticlockwise to check out the American lands, while the curragh exploring the eastern island spots more coast just out of reach, further east. Should I risk an attempt at crossing?

1790bc
New builds: settler at Entremont, worker.
The older settler founds Verulamium on the west coast, next to a fish, and starts another curragh. The new settler heads southwest, to settle beyond the dyes colony, and secure it from any marauding barbs or AI settlements. The curragh attempts its risky crossing, but finds only a 1-tile island.
There is a twofer available now: Writing > Abe for Mysticism, Mysticism > Jules for Wheel. But there's no hurry to make this deal as I'll be getting Laws soon enough, then Philosophy, and then I'll be able to trade in anything I please. I pass.

1750bc
The curragh sinks.

 

[splunge the 2nd]

Here's my next turn set. Had to pay Rome tribute, but felt it was safer.
Starting to pay more attention to tiles worked. Maybe I'm playing smarter...

Spoiler :

End of tunr 40- as per Lanz's

reccommendations, change tiles worked to

squeeze some more gold out and turn down

research to 40 to finish writing.
Turn 41
Finish Writing, start COL. No cash for

embassies.
Currough finishes in Alesia. Not sure what

to build. Settle on Warrior for future

upgrade to sword.
Entremont settler>worker
Settler heads south. Southern warrior

heads north. Currough sets sail for

adventure!

Turn 42
Roman warriors move into our turf. What

are their intentions?
Currough moves NE, staying coastal for now.
Settler SE. Warrior NE towards mountain,

skirting chinese territory. Worker mines.
Crud, realize I forgot to turn up research.

Research to 90, COL in 17. Everyone is

more advanced than we are and America and

Rome have writing. Before they get it

elsewhere, trade China writing for iron

working +4 gold (all of theirs).

Turn 43
There's iron SSW of Alesia! Rome has iron

near Veii, not hooled up and China doesn't

seem to have any iron.
Lugdunum warrior>worker Settler SE
Currough heads east to deep water
Southern warrior moves onto mountain

Turn 44
2 Roman warriors are flanking Entremont
Enterment worker>settler
Currough sinks
Found Camulodunum on hill on river. Iron

is out of our cultural borders. Starts

warrior.
New worker heads to plains near Lugdunum.
Southern warrior heads north into Gobi

desert.

Turn 45
Worker2 roads. Warrior heads north through

desert.

Turn 46
Roman warriors pass Entrement south
Alesia warrior>curragh Keep working coast

allows CoL in 10 not 11 and with waste,

curragh finishes same time. Move new

wwarrior to unprotected Camolundum (maybe

should have done that sooner with Romans

around)
Still figuring MM- in Enteremont I can work

the forest andf get settler in 5, growth 1

or work the gold- settler in 6, growth in 1

but shave 2 turns off CoL. Do the latter

and hope I don't mess up my settler factory

(which I still haven't quite got down).
Southern warrior sees volcano and incense

in desert outside of China's cultural

borders.

Turn 47
Romans keep going south and don't attack

undefended Camolundum.
Warrior moves into Camolundum. Warrior

moves north.
Turn up luxury tax and turn down research

to 80, CoL in 8.

Turn 48
Romans pass through
Lugdunum worker>curragh (growing slowly,

should have made worker elsewhere). Worker

moves to sugar plains. Other worker

irrigates.
Alesia worker moves south to BG next to

iron. BG on river is stronger, but I plan

to road iron for future city.
Southern warrior moves north

Turn 49
Rome demands 20 gold. We can ill afford it

but they have archers and have warriors in

our neighborhood. Give in.
Camulondum warrior>barracks
Alesia worker roads BG
Lugdunum worker roads sugar
Southern warrior east to mountain out of

Roman cultureal borders and sees more

desert.

Turn 50
Camulondum warrior starts to Enterment

(should have started last turn) for MP

duty.
Southern warrior north into Antium's

neighborhood.

 

[templar_x]

I colony the dyes in the southwest. It's expensive to use up a worker on this, given that I plan to settle further in this direction soon anyway, but it saves me nine turns of extra luxury spending, so I think it will be worthwhile.
The curragh is exploring a medium-sized but very soggy island over in the east. Hardly a priority for settling, but it still might lead to the other continent.

I was asking myself whether I would have done this. And I think clearly no.
How much is the 10% lux or so worth at this point of time in terms of gold? I would say 2gpt. Let us assume it would be 3 gpt. Then you would barter 1 worker for 27 gold.
I am usually willing to BUY, and SLAVES, for 100+ gold. That is why I would not have wasted the worker in that situation.

t_x

 

[Lanzelot]

Had time this weekend to finish my set as well:

Spoiler :

T041, 2110 BC:
warrior/settler pair moves 1S.
Scouting warrior 1S.

T042, 2070 BC:
Entremont has grown to size 6, picking up the forest. Now lux needs to be increased to 30%. I change the forest to the plains tile as indicated in the screenshot. The irrigation on that tile will finish during interturn, so Entremont will have the required 5fpt and 7spt for finishing the settler in 2 turns:

Alesia also needs to change its tile assignment:

The irrigation on the floodplain will also finish this turn, so Alesia can grow in 2 instead of 3 turns. At the same time the third shield would be wasted anyway, because Alesia only needs 4s to finish its current project. Therefore I switch the BG to the floodplain.
Also, after some consideration I decided to switch the warrior to a worker. With the current high lux tax, Alesia doesn't need an extra MP warrior yet, while there are still a lot of tiles (2 BGs and 1 FP), that need improvement. So a worker is more important at the moment.

Lugdunum is founded on the river 1E of the cow and starts another worker: we still need a lot of worker power for improving the cow, the BG and connecting the dyes down there.

Scout 1W on the hill.

T043, 2030 BC:
As expected, the irrigations have finished, so Entremont will grow next turn, pick up the missing 2s from the forest and finish the settler:

The worker on the FP starts roading, the one on the river grassland starts mining, but I was not sure for quite a while, what the worker on the plains should do. The plains tile will be needed only for the current turn, and then for 2 more turns out of the next 4-turn settler-cycle. After that the mined river grass (2/1/2) will be ready for use. Consequently a road on that tile would yield only 2g now. On the other hand, Lugdunum, while the BG is not yet ready, and later another town could use the 2/1/1 plains tile?! So in the end I decide to go ahead and put a road on that tile as well.

Scout 1W.
Rome has Writing now! I still have 11 turns left on CoL, but should go down significantly with the next town.

T044, 1990 BC:
Entremont settler -> settler. Alesia Worker -> granary.

The new worker moves on the second FP. If I start irrigating there now, Alesia needs 5 turns for the next growth, and afterwards only 4 turns, as the irrigation will be finished by that time.

Now where to move the new settler? Some have founded by the fish on the eastcoast, however, it would take 3 turns to travel there. Others settled by the sugar on the westcoast. After some thinking, I'm going to try something completely different from what PaperBeetle and templar_x have done. Don't know whether it's any good, but I just wanted to try it out. The reasoning is as follows: what is a very powerful tile in our empire, that is still unused? The gold hill! However, neither Entremont nor Alesia will be able to use it, as they need to maintain 5fpt for quite a while. The best way to turn the gold hill into a 2-food tile is planting a town on it... So settler moves on the gold hill. Of course once all towns in the core will have grown to size, this is going to be a bit too crowded, so obviously this can only be a temporary town, which will need to be disbanded later on. Not sure whether sacrificing a settler for this is really worth it?! I have never worked with "temporary towns", so lets try it and see whether it's any good.
As there is a Roman warrior close by, I send a warrior from Entremont along for escort and move the warrior from Alesia to Entremont. Lux can now be reduced to 20%. CoL down to 9.

Scout 1W.


T045, 1950 BC:
Camoludunum founded on the gold hill, CoL down to 6 turns. Camoludunum builds MP warriors for now.
Worker on FP starts irrigation.
Scout 1N.

America knows Writing. I could as well sell it to China now, but I better don't.

T046, 1910 BC:
Entremont grows, lux to 30%, same procedure as usual.
Worker on plains tile finishes road and moves onto the sugar.
Worker on FP moves to BG 1S of Alesia.

Scout 1N.

T047, 1870 BC:
Lugdunum grows and picks up forest. If I keep the forest, the worker would finish next turn, but I would only get 3f and the irrigation on the cow would not finish on time to make up for it. So I switch the forest to the BG and get the worker in two turns, wasting one shield, but keeping 4f.

Worker on BG starts mine, worker on sugar road.
Scout 1N.

T048, 1830 BC:
Entremont settler -> settler. Moves to west-coast 1N of sugar, As there is an American warrior next to it, I send an escort from Entremont along. The warrior from Camulodunum can move back to Entremont, so lux goes down to 20%.
As the mine on the river grass will finish IBT, Entremont can now use this nice 2/1/2 tile.

Scout 1N onto the mountain in Chines territory.

Ok, a quick science check: I'm currently making 17bpt, and CoL still takes 43 beakers. If I use a scientist in Lugdunum now, I have 20b, and next turn the sugar town will hopefully add another 3b, so I could get CoL in 2 turns. However, growth in Lugdunum would take one extra turn. As two nations already have Writing, I take that option. Nothing would be worse than loosing the Philo race.

T049, 1790 BC:
Lugdunum worker -> barracks.

Alesia has grown to 3 and needs MP now. Richborough is founded on the west-coast and the escort warrior moves back to Entremont, a warrior from Entremont to Alesia.

Richborough starts a curragh.
Worker from Lugdunum goes to the cow, worker from 1SE of Entremont to forest N of Lugdunum and worker on FP starts road.
Lugdunum currently doesn't need 4f, so it switches to the 2/1/1 plains tile. Alesia picks up the second FP. In total we are currently making 21bpt, so since Lugdunum lost its scientist, when producing the worker, we need another scientist elsewhere. I chose Richborough, as that delays growth only by one turn.

Scout 1W.

IBT: Lincoln comes and demands my entire treasury of 15g! As I'm currently at -1gpt, I can't give it to him, so I tell him where the door is... He declares and moves his warrior back into the territory of Richborough.

T050, 1750BC:
CoL is finished, start on Philosophy.
I go to F4 to check available trades. China would give us only 4g for Writing, so they are probably doing it themselves now. But they have a worker on sale, which I could perhaps pick up for CoL? I give them Writing for 4g. Then I offer them CoL, and they are willing to give IW, Wheel and the worker. Excellent!

Next I ring up Rome. They are willing to give WC or Mysticism, but not both. Ok, I take Mysticism.

Camulodunum warrior -> warrior.

I move two warriors from Entremont to Richborough for protection. The new warrior from Camulodunum goes to Entremont for MP. But in spite of the war happiness, this is not enough to keep Entremont happy. Darn. Need to increase lux to 30%.

Chinese worker goes to river grass 2SE of Entremont. The two workers at Lugdunum start irrigation the cow and chopping the forest. Big question now is: what is the worker on the sugar tile going to do? During Despotism of course a mine would be best, but I expect to finish Philosophy in 5 turns, and in Republic Richborough would be at 4fpt instead of 3fpt, if I irrigate the sugar. Ok, I go for the irrigation.

Scout 1W.

 

[Lanzelot]

Ok, this turnset should illustrate, how the settler factory works in principle. If there is something unclear, please ask!

Comparing the current situation to templar's start, we can notice that already now you have caught up in commerce: only one turn behind, so it is to be expected that we get Republic at the same time and your farmer's gambit start has really payed off big time! (I already applied that advice in COTM86, where I played the start quite differently from what I normally do... )

I was asking myself whether I would have done this. And I think clearly no.
How much is the 10% lux or so worth at this point of time in terms of gold? I would say 2gpt. Let us assume it would be 3 gpt. Then you would barter 1 worker for 27 gold.
I am usually willing to BUY, and SLAVES, for 100+ gold. That is why I would not have wasted the worker in that situation.

This reasoning makes sense to me. So basically, sacrificing a worker for a colony at this early point in the game is good only, if you otherwise can't connect the luxury for a really long time - like 30 turns?
Or, of course, if you are under attack and urgently need to connect iron/horses.

Most important Rome has Legionaries! Lanzelot suggested hitting them before they hook up iron, too late .

Don't be afraid of one single Legionary. It depends on how many they can build until you are ready for war. Let's say, they have about 5 by then, then it will still be better to attack them right away instead of waiting until they have 15...
For this reason it is also important to keep them up to date in technology: while they are able to build markets and libraries, they won't build that many Legionaries...

 

[creamcheese]

Don't be afraid of one single Legionary. It depends on how many they can build until you are ready for war. Let's say, they have about 5 by then, then it will still be better to attack them right away instead of waiting until they have 15...
For this reason it is also important to keep them up to date in technology: while they are able to build markets and libraries, they won't build that many Legionaries...

I am afraid because I know I won't have enough GS for an attack for 20-30+ turns, probably longer. and in that time they can build a lot of Legions. I'd rather hit US first, take lots of land and build some farms, then hit Rome with a much strengthened military (including some catapults to kill the legions easily).

 

[templar_x]

Comparing the current situation to templar's start, we can notice that already now you have caught up in commerce: only one turn behind, so it is to be expected that we get Republic at the same time and your farmer's gambit start has really payed off big time! (I already applied that advice in COTM86, where I played the start quite differently from what I normally do... )

always happy to be at your service. if you only would always listen to me like that!

t_x

 

[PaperBeetle]

I was asking myself whether I would have done this. And I think clearly no.
How much is the 10% lux or so worth at this point of time in terms of gold? I would say 2gpt. Let us assume it would be 3 gpt. Then you would barter 1 worker for 27 gold.
I am usually willing to BUY, and SLAVES, for 100+ gold. That is why I would not have wasted the worker in that situation.

t_x

well I did say it was expensive...

Looks like 4gpt at the time I made the colony (when it saves only 10% lux), up to 6gpt by 1750bc (when it saves 20% lux for some reason). So I'd hope to save over 40g on the deal. There's also a saving in that the extra gpt is going to get me to the slingshot a couple of turns earlier, so I'll have a couple more turns in republic, and maybe a shorter anarchy if I have a town fewer at the point of revolt.
What its really all about is catching back up to where I feel I should be if I hadn't made that cowardly gpt trade to Mao. Throw in the facts that I sold him Writing and that his economy is floating on my cash, and I'm really nervous about hitting that slingshot.

Nothing would be worse than loosing the Philo race.

In a similar vein, what I forgot to do was give Mao even more gpt to buy back my own cash, to be able to run negative gpt, once within striking distance of the slingshot. Sounds like an over-stimulated economy, resulting in anarchy and/or bancrupcy? Where have I heard that before?