At what point will a Civ vote for you rather than itself?

[NintendoTogepi]

I was playing a game recently and I was so close to getting a Diplo victory. I just needed to get Joao II on my side. I did everything, gave him tons of stuff, signed a defense pact...I added up all of the little numbers and the total came to 13 positive and 3 negative. It wasn't working and he was starting to build a spaceship, so I had to launch mine. (getting ANOTHER space race victory)

But yeah, at what point will a Civ vote for you rather than itself?

 

[AmazonQueen]

I was playing a game recently and I was so close to getting a Diplo victory. I just needed to get Joao II on my side. I did everything, gave him tons of stuff, signed a defense pact...I added up all of the little numbers and the total came to 13 positive and 3 negative. It wasn't working and he was starting to build a spaceship, so I had to launch mine. (getting ANOTHER space race victory)

But yeah, at what point will a Civ vote for you rather than itself?

I don't think your rival in an election will ever vote for you (and nor will their vassels if any)

 

[BalbanesBeoulve]

Right, a civ will always vote for itself. Absolutely no exception.

A vassal will always vote for their master, unless they're the other candidate, th en they'll vote for themselves.

 

[NintendoTogepi]

Well, if they won't ever vote for you, then how are you ever supposed to win a diplomatic victory in OCC?!

 

[r_rolo1]

^^Make ppl hate them/ love you more ..... religion helps

And ,of course , build the UN... Otherwise you'll not even be a candidate

 

[bestje]

enabling permanent alliances might help if you can't build the UN you can team up with the biggest civ, though a few negative modifiers for this
but if the opposing civ in the election is big enough they can have enough votes to block a diplomatic victory for you

 

[LlamaCat]

Right, a civ will always vote for itself. Absolutely no exception.

A vassal will always vote for their master, unless they're the other candidate, th en they'll vote for themselves.

other civs will of course vote for you... just not your biggest rival for the election. I've won plenty of UN games where I was not big enough to have enough votes myself or even with a vassal. I think they need to be Friendly for a sustained period but I don't know the exact mechanics. I've never had someone vote for me who was just Pleased.

 

[bestje]

I think the AI can vote for you at pleased it depends on how much they like your rival compared to you

 

[Mesousa]

I was playing a game recently and I was so close to getting a Diplo victory. I just needed to get Joao II on my side. I did everything, gave him tons of stuff, signed a defense pact...I added up all of the little numbers and the total came to 13 positive and 3 negative. It wasn't working and he was starting to build a spaceship, so I had to launch mine. (getting ANOTHER space race victory)

But yeah, at what point will a Civ vote for you rather than itself?

They will vote for themselves, so you have to get all the rest on your side that can't vote for themselves (haven't build the UN, haven't got the most population). +13/-3 isn't too impressive - gift them stuff, give in to their demands indiscriminately, adopt their favorite civic, adopt their religion, try to get them to stop trading or even attack the other candidate if they're undecided between you two ... and don't just start working on relations when you're close to building the UN. Many boni build up over time, so pick your buddies early and carefully, and truly become BFF with them.

 

[NintendoTogepi]

+13/-3 isn't too impressive - gift them stuff, give in to their demands indiscriminately, adopt their favorite civic, adopt their religion

But, I did adopt their favorite civic (Didn't provide a benefit) and he was running Free Religion. Plus I gave in to every demand throughout the whole game and gift'd him 6000 gold and all of the 8 technologies I had in advantage over him. Didn't provide a single (+)

 

[Gooblah]

Basically, Diplomatic Victories (UN!) are the hardest (in my opinion) in the game.
Diplomatic Bonuses include:
Religion
Trade
Open Borders
Defensive Pact (leads to a negative with other Civs..)
Favorite Civic (only if you and target Civ are running Civic)

Now, Trade bonuses stack. So instead of gifting some techs and a lump sum, try using Gold/Resource for Resource trade, and gifting of crappy techs (which will usually give an automatic +4 modifier). Also, pay attention to other Civ's relations with one another (enter Foreign Screen, click on other leaderhead to see how other Civs react to that Civ). Don't trade with the guy everyone hates! It'll get -4 "You traded with our worst enemies!" modifiers with everyone that guy is Annoyed or Furious with. Thus, if you discover another continent, wait till you find all the Civs on the continent before trading with any of them.

Also, isolated starts are (surprisingly) good for Diplomatic Victories. You show up too late to be involved in any long-standing feuds, but early enough to make diplomatic relations.

 

[BalbanesBeoulve]

other civs will of course vote for you... just not your biggest rival for the election. I've won plenty of UN games where I was not big enough to have enough votes myself or even with a vassal. I think they need to be Friendly for a sustained period but I don't know the exact mechanics. I've never had someone vote for me who was just Pleased.

I didn't say they wouldn't vote for you. I said a civ will always vote for itself. Elections always have just 2 candidates. If a civ is a candidate itself, it will never vote for you, it will always vote for itself, no exceptions.

 

[BalbanesBeoulve]

But, I did adopt their favorite civic (Didn't provide a benefit) and he was running Free Religion. Plus I gave in to every demand throughout the whole game and gift'd him 6000 gold and all of the 8 technologies I had in advantage over him. Didn't provide a single (+)

Giving gold really won't raise the diplo bonus much. It might get you up to the +4 our trade relations have been fair, but once you hit that +4, giving them anymore won't raise it higher. Gifing techs might give a few for "you've shared your technological advances with us", but those are hard to get, you could give them 10 techs and you might only get +1 or +2 from that.

 

[Morgrad]

A civ will never vote for you in place of voting for itself.

Remember that only two Civs are eligible to get voted for: the builder of the UN, and the biggest civ by population. If these are the same civ, then the second-most population civ steps in.

Otherwise, you need a net +8 diplomatic bonus to have a civ vote for you to win, as well as your opponent in the vote having less than +8 (including the invisible bonuses) with the voter.

So what do you do when Joao is your opponent? Get his friends up above +8 with you and do everything you can to get them to like Joao a little bit less than they like you. The only way Joao will ever vote for you if he's on the ballot is to remove him from the ballot.

 

[NintendoTogepi]

Well I just want to say that the game was unwinnable by Diplo victory, Joao II's population is so high that it will always be a stale mate. (everyone else was voting for me but his population was high enough that it was still a stale mate)

However, I did start up a OCC on a Tiny Islands, High Sea Level, Archipelago map a few hours ago just to mess around and...

It was tough. The person I was running against kept changing. For a while it was Qin Shi Huang and ending in stale mates each time as a few of the leaders didn't like me, then Gilgamesh started to run (he was my best friend in the game so this did not make me happy) and then pretty much every leader except for Isabella was Friendly with me (Isabella was constantly changing from Annoyed to Cautious with me, and was pretty much hated by all), but it was still ending in stalemates as Mehmed II kept not voting.

And then FINALLY I ran up against Mehmed II. All of the leaders began to vote and walah, the German City State of Berlin became the capital of the world and I had won a Diplomatic victory!

P.P.S. I also passed most of the other resolutions while hoping that Qin Shi Huang and Gilgamesh would lose population. I passed the No Nuclear Profileration, the One Currency, the Trade Routes for every city, the Environmentalism Universal Civic, the Emancipation Universal Civic and I think that's all. I couldn't pass Universal Suffrage and Free Religion because that stupid Isabella kept defying them.
P.S. I hate tiny islands maps, espesically with high sea levels.

 

[LlamaCat]

I didn't say they wouldn't vote for you. I said a civ will always vote for itself. Elections always have just 2 candidates. If a civ is a candidate itself, it will never vote for you, it will always vote for itself, no exceptions.

I was just clarifying because what you are saying is not precise enough. Yes, a civ will always vote for itself ... IF it is a candidate for election. But we are talking about generally getting other civs to vote for you (those that are eligible).

you guys quickly got off topic from the original poster's question, and this confused the issue for him. read the original post and the question is basically very clear.