Best/Worst UBs?

[vormuir]

I'm sure this has been discussed before, but I didn't see it.

My very tentative impressions:

Best

Hammam -- an Aqueduct that gives +2 happiness. 100 hammers for two smilies? By way of comparison, a Temple costs 80 for just +1 happiness. You'd build these even if you didn't need the Health boost.

Salon -- an Observatory that gives you a free artist specialist. Damn! Even if you're not going for a Culture win, _free specialist_. Money, sometimes research, and GP points. The only downside is that your science city may start popping Great Artists, and that's a small price to pay.

Seowon -- a University that gives 50% extra research instead of 25%. Rrowr.

Terrace -- a granary that gives +2 culture. Since granaries are an early build in most cities, this is almost like being Creative for free.



Worst

Citadel -- replaces Castle, gives +2 experience points to siege units. This is worth 150 production?

Cothon -- +1 trade route sounds great, but you can only get it in coastal cities. Almost useless in the midgame when the AI civs tend to switch to Mercantilism, reducing your trade routes to very low values. Also, why is this more expensive than the Harbor it replaces?

Research institute -- 2 free scientists sounds great, but it comes very late, and replaces a building (Laboratory) that many players never bother with.

Shopping mall -- Replaces Supermarket, one of the least popular improvements. Gives +10% wealth... the Malinese got this two thousand years ago with their Mint. Happiness bonus with certain resources, which probably won't be meaningful by this point unless you're playing at Deity+.


These are first impressions, so I could be completely wrong! What think you?


Waldo

 

[Glouglou]

I think the seowon only gives you 35% science ...

Madrassa (saladin's UB) are also great as they allow you to choose between popping a Great Prophet or a Great Scientist !!

 

[Leveler]

I like Assembly Plants. Builds 50% faster with coal and with Frederick +100% faster (Organized). AP allows 4 engineers instead of 2 which may help to get GEs for the Space Elevator.

 

[Cam_H]

I'm sure this has been discussed before, but I didn't see it.

The Comprehensive UB Guide by WilliamOfOrange may well be worth checking out and contains some interesting points and follow-on discussions.

 

[futurehermit]

I like the Roman UB quite a lot. Extra gpp? Sweet!

I personally think the terrace is stupid. Incas start with mysticism so you can't skip mysticism, which is something I would do with an early building that gives culture. Not to mention Incas are industrious so it's easy to build stonehenge. So what's the point of the terrace exactly unless you're pursuing cultural victories??? Sure it can be helpful in situations where you're fighting culturally over tiles, but I prefer to do my fighting with sharpened axes

So, yeah, to say that it's just as good as being creative is bogus because, for me, the benefit of creative is the ability to bypass mysticism, stonehenge, etc...

 

[czechdude]

The seowon only gives an extra 15%. the cothon is useless on pangea and the like, but is amazing for water maps. If you want to see the power of trade, look at Aelf's EMC #3.

 

[Immaculate]

The Zulu UB barracks rock hard. extra courthouse effect and REALLY cheap: sign me up!

 

[lilnev]

Agree on the Zulu barracks. Aztec's Sac Altar is also good (and cheap!).

I like Terraces because they relieve you from building monuments. Not spectacular (certainly nowhere near Creative), but a significant upgrade to an early and common building.

Research Institutes will help a space race somewhat. I'm building them anyway, and 2 scientists x 200% = 12 beakers/turn in each commerce and hybrid city (most of them in my empires). By the time I finish out the tech tree, that will have shaved several turns from my launch date.

I don't see the point of Salons. Why would I want an artist?

Worst? Things that replace buildings I (almost) never build anyway. I'm looking at you, Duns, Citadels, and Stock Exchanges. I'm also not thrilled by "extra priest slots", Madrassas and Obelisks.

peace,
lilnev

 

[Technocactus]

Personally my favourite is the Hammam. For the worst, I vote Citadel. I never build walls, let alone castles.

 

[Swein Forkbeard]

The Zulu Ikhanda is VERY overpowered!

And the Citadel makes the Spanish very good at fighting Medieval wars (although you do have to build Walls before it's available).

 

[flamingzaroc121]

Terraces are two buildings that i almost always build in one city at once. a Granary and a monument. it is really good IMO

 

[vb1]

1. Mint, a forge and a market in one? Sign me up! Especially to a leader who is financial!
2. Terrace, city growth + early culture for border expansion? insane!

 

[KMadCandy]

i love the terrace, <3 cyrus's apothecary, and i love the ikhanda. i am perhaps the only person who's never yet played the romans so i haven't experienced their UB. i like gandhi's traits, and his UU, but his UB seems like a total waste. madrassa is nifty keen. citadels seem so cool but the lifespan is so short i've never tried them.

research institute, i'm now (in small doses) playing a game i'm trying to win a time victory on, just to have done it once. man it rocks hard when you're not just using it for the last few turns before you launch to alpha centauri!

 

[kniteowl]

Citadel -- replaces Castle, gives +2 experience points to siege units. This is worth 150 production?

Actually it's +5XP with the 2.08 patch combined with barracks and any one of the early military Civics, Vassalage or Theocracy that 10XP in total to freshly produced Siege units (Level 4 Unit!!!)... CR3 Trebs anyone? although it becomes obsolete with economics, I try to ignore it and beeline to Steel for level 4 Cannons. I've heard some Players have Beelined all the way to Artillery although I wouldn't recommend it.

Although I only build the Citadel in One City and only one city, generally my production city so I guess you could call it weak in the sense that it'll only benefit very few cities.

 

[Technocactus]

Although I only build the Citadel in One City and only one city, generally my production city so I guess you could call it weak in the sense that it'll only benefit very few cities.

The same can be said of the Roman forum. Its GP bonus will only be of benefit in a few cities.

 

[kniteowl]

The same can be said of the Roman forum. Its GP bonus will only be of benefit in a few cities.

Not in a Specialist Economy... In a normal Cottage Economy with a GP Farm I guess... If only the Romans had traits that are more synergetic with the SE

 

[dragomaster]

I like the Roman UB quite a lot. Extra gpp? Sweet!

I personally think the terrace is stupid. Incas start with mysticism so you can't skip mysticism, which is something I would do with an early building that gives culture. Not to mention Incas are industrious so it's easy to build stonehenge. So what's the point of the terrace exactly unless you're pursuing cultural victories??? Sure it can be helpful in situations where you're fighting culturally over tiles, but I prefer to do my fighting with sharpened axes

So, yeah, to say that it's just as good as being creative is bogus because, for me, the benefit of creative is the ability to bypass mysticism, stonehenge, etc...

The terrace is awsome in my opinium, all though i got your point.
The second city most often build a monument but the third is most likely to build a terrace instead, you only need to wait to population 2 then use the whip for a granary with free culture.

 

[Swein Forkbeard]

The sacrificial altar might be a nice UB, but I haven't been the Aztecs yet.

Same with the terrace and mint.

The ger (or yurt) is awesome!

 

[Mehmed100]

I like the Hamman. It provides 2 and 2 . Mind you, I like everything Ottoman.

 

[Cephalophore]

My vote for the worst goes to the Shale Plant. It's a late arrival, the 10% prodution bonus seems negligible, and the base building is highly situational. On top of all that, it's borring. Most agree that that the Dun, Citadel, and Mausoleum are weak UBs but at least they fail in somewhat interesting ways.