[BNW] New civs

[Noxius]

Hey guys. As I'm typing this I'm downloading BNW on steam. I've been wanting to ask all you people that got bnw, are the new civs op in anyway? Shoshone and Venice look really good.

Moderator Action: Moved to BNW.

 

[otaman1]

This should belong in the Brave New World subforums. Anyhow, to answer your questions, yes, they're OPed (though I haven't got BNW yet cause I'm vacationing in Sweden and Steam denounced me for betraying Canada). Unlike Austria, Venice doesn't have to pay a lump of god to purchase a city-state ... OP! And as for the Shoshone, they start with 8 additional tiles from a newly built city and the pathfinder can choose any ancient ruin options and after 3 turns those options chosen earlier will reset ... OP-ish.

What I would change for Venice is that purchasing a city-state would cost gold.
Angry City-State = €2000+
Afraid City-State = €1000-€2000
Neutral City-State = €750-€1000
Friendly City-State = €250-€750
Allied City-State = €0-€250

The way I would change the Shoshone is newly built cities start with 4-6 additional tiles and the options in an ancient ruin will reset every 6 turns.

 

[Noxius]

It costs no gold?!!! WOOOOW

 

[Pouakai]

Thing is, unlike Austria Venice requires a GP for it to happen, which doesn't happen that often

 

[Noxius]

How do you even get that great person they have?

 

[UGM 133 Trident]

How do you even get that great person they have?

The Merchant of Venice is a straight replacement for the Great Merchant, though you do get a free one after researching optics.

 

[Noxius]

Is Venice's capital annexed?

 

[DudewiththeFood]

It's just like a regular city you found yourself. They get Merchants of Venice in Liberty instead of a settler, can get get them finishing Liberty, getting Optics and by then, the balls may start rolling.

 

[Ulthwithian]

Oh, and incidentally, while the direct cost is 0, the opportunity cost is AT LEAST 800g, and more if you choose the 'correct' policies (Commerce).

I'm still honestly puzzled why you'd want to be with friends with Civs and take over CSs when you can be friends with CSs and take over Civs. After all, the CSs can't win the game.

 

[BShaftoe]

Oh, and incidentally, while the direct cost is 0, the opportunity cost is AT LEAST 800g, and more if you choose the 'correct' policies (Commerce).

I'm still honestly puzzled why you'd want to be with friends with Civs and take over CSs when you can be friends with CSs and take over Civs. After all, the CSs can't win the game.

With the latter strategy, if you are doing your warmongering in the later stages of the game, your CS delegates will should be enough to avoid any resolutions that may negatively impact your civ. As Venice, it will be ideal to purchase a few CS's and have the rest in your pocket if you are going to warmonger the rest of the world.

 

[IAmOzymandias]

you get 2 for completing liberty, 1 for optics, and then whatever you can pump out, which, between Market, Banks and Stock Exchanges, and whatever Wonders you shoot for that would increase great merchant spawn rate, could easily end up taking most if not all of the CS on a small or even standard map by the end of the game.

Played on a small map and a human venice player had 9/12 CSes by the time I was researching Flight. It gets old quick. The biggest downside, as an earlier poster said, is the opportunity cost. You may be forced to build a wonder that generates a GM when you could go for something more useful, and of course if you focus on GM you ignore most other GP.