BoG 01- American Pride

[Bam-Bam]

I also continued on the upper half in the thought that the AI's are pursuing the lower half. Knowing that we are now kicking their butt on research (even at first civ costs)--we would get even more of a leap by either trading for their researched techs or researching a few of the lower halfs at second or third civ costs. I also wanted to get lots of 30shield horses built to help defray the shield costs of knights.

I like hitting rome, too, but agree that the iro should be the first hit. We should hit rome hard just about the time we run up the lower half to miltrad.

Suggest next player (Stormrider) throttle back on the research to bump up gold for horse upgrade. Also, many of the cities that were building infrastructure (with chop assists--I did LOTS of lumberjacking on my turn) that have at least 10spt should and rax should head straight into horse production.

Stormrider >> UP
Grimjack >> ON DECK

 

[Stormrider]

Duly noted.

My wife is going out for the evening, so I will have some unadulterated Civ time after work (providing the baby cooperates !!!)

In any case, I will post tonight.

 

[Stormrider]

0) 370 AD

* Slider to 6.3.1 Banking in 11 (was 6) gpt 200 (was 36)
* Richmond Court -> Settler : I do not want anyone else on our continent!!!
* I am sure it does not really matter, but it always sets me on edge when I have NO defenders in a city: i.e. most of the North lands

I)
* Several cities kick into WLTKD.
* ATL Lib -> Courthouse
* NO Temple -> Catapult. A horse would have wasted most of the shileds from the forest.

* Rome building Leo's - Invention

1) 380 AD
* MM cities with lumberjacks
* Workers work
* Settler in zululand dropped to site of former city b/t the two existing cities
* Settler on mainland moves North
* Horses continue to collect in Seattle

I)
* SF Temple -> Mktplc
* Zimbabwe expands
* St Louis Rax -> Horse
* Monglos start Sun Tzu's

2) 390 AD
* Pheonix founded in Zululand
* Zimbabwe chnaged from Granary to Settler. Either one will take forever, but a Settler will at least claim more land...

I)
* Philly Library -> Rax
* Seattle Library -> Horse
* Buff Granary -> Settler
* NO Catapult -> Horse
* Denver Horse -> Pike

3) 400 AD
* SD Granary switched to temple to expand borders to get game

I)
* St Louis Horse -> Pike
* KC Mktplac -> Temple

4) 410 AD
* Move workers around

I)
* Zimbabwe riots. No biggie as it is completely corrupt
* NO Horse -> Pike (I hate undefended cities)
5) 420 AD
* Not much noteworthy (treasury is at 1272 GP)
* Everyone up Monarchy on us. Rome still has monopoly on Invention, we have on on Monotheism

I)
* Seattle Horse -> Pike
* Denver Pike -> Temple
* Memphis Granary -> Temple

6) 430 AD
* Alberqerque founded -> temple

I)
* Miami library -> Rax
* Buffalo settler -> mktplc
* St Loius Pike -> Pike
* NO Pike -> horse (2 turns to produce)
* LA mktplc -> Library

7) 440 AD
* not much

IT)
* NY library -> mktplc
* Houston aquaduct -> library

8) 450 AD
* not much

I)
* Seattle Horse -> Horse
* Philly Rax -> Horse

* Germany builds HG
Cascade: Rome - Leo's
Monglos - Sun's

9) 460 AD
* Slider to 7.2.1 - Banking next turn
* Germany has invention. Rome / Germany will give Monarchy / Invention / WM / All gold (germany has none) for Monotheism.

Will hold off for next leader to make trades

I)
* Banking -> Chivalry
* Atl (forgot what it built) -> Bank
* St Louis Pike - Horse
* Balt Library -> Temple

* Iro / Germany -> Leo's


10) 470 AD

Summary:
* Mixed Horses with some infrastructure. 12 Vet / 1 reg at Seattle. NO producing one every 2 turns. St Louis/Seattle every 3 turns
* Can change research as no beakers yet
* Chivalry in 4 (no matter how much research) so slider is at 5.4.1 (163 gpt)
* Treasury ar 2415 gold. I did not spend a penny (maybe weed, but it allows flexibility for the leader who starts the invasion of Rome / Iroqois)
* Can get 2 for one for Monotheism (Invention / Monarchy) + gold + WM
* Settler in Northwest can settle in Northwest
* Settler next turn on Richmond can settle to the north. After that, we may have one or two more city spots

* Do not chop last 2 forests at NO (New Orleans) they allow 15 spt

Save is here

 

[Bam-Bam]

We should NOT trade for monarchy--w/HG built, there is nothing in it for us. It could have been nice, as it would have kicked off our GA. Now we have to wait until Hoover. I think we should try and win this before then (ok--being WAY aggressive here...)

Before we ready the invasion force--we should round up our various MPs and swords and make sure we send some vet MIs along with the knights. With all that jungle in the Iros area, there may be a couple of cities where the movement of knights will not make a diff. Probably should not delay the invasion past Shillen's turn--we should hit them hard and fast now--maybe even going into MOW (mobile oscillating war) with iro and then rome (i.e., go after iro---take several cities, get good peace deal, then rome--repeat ad nauseum)

 

[Shillen]

Now we have to wait until Hoover. I think we should try and win this before then (ok--being WAY aggressive here...)

I'll be disappointed if it takes us longer than cavalry to achieve conquest. That's kind of why I really don't agree with researching the top half of the tech tree. We shouldn't ever need those techs.

 

[Grimjack]

I got it.
Will see if I can establish a beachhead for Shillen to exploit. ( I assume we have transports enough for our forces. )

Do we have settlers for new cities, or should we use Iros citizens ?
If we have a definite culture advantage, then we might just as well try to keep the cities, but it would feel safer to just raze them, and build our own cities. With the distance to our capitol, flipping is a significant risk.

I will try to play tonight.
Grimjack

 

[Bam-Bam]

@ Grimjack--from my look at the save, we are still galley-poor (5). Need twice that for a effective massive troop transport.

@ Shillen--I think you are correct. We have such a strong position that taking it to the AI should not be a problem. I expect slow going with knights, but the moment we get cav--we should completely roll...

 

[Stormrider]

I realized my lack of galley building towards the end of my turn and forgot to mention it. As we probably need at least 12 more horses and some pikes for the assault, building the galleys should not slow down the invasion timetable. We have a nice cash situation and we can do some rushing if necessary.

ALSO forgot to mention:
If you prefer upgrading horses as opposed to building the actual knight, we should research something else before chivalry. Or build them like crazy for the next 4 game turns.

 

[bewareofgnomes]

i would go for upgrade like crazy and research something else at almost no science.

 

[Grimjack]

NO wars, no trades, and lots of troops built.
Save: http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads4/BoG1-560_AD.zip

Here is longish report:

470AD (1) Looking over the lay of the land, I see we have Chivalry in 9, and two harbours.
I can find only four galleys. I rush the aqueduct in Detroit, and the marketplace in Chicago
MM Atlanta for no food growth and 15 SPT, and switch to Pike. We will need pikes to.
Switch Buffalo into Worker/Settler factory. We need one, and Buffalo will have a hard time
amassing 10 spt, So I go for 5 food/ 5 shields strategy here. We severely lack workers. Our
best cities are working unimproved tiles. This is waste.

IBT: Switch cities finished with production into war-mode, trying to go for 10/15 spt, for
those fast horses/pikes/cats. Make a regular Galleon also

480AD(2) Move workers, trying to decide on where to launch. Observe a yellow galley going for
our far coast. Will have to cover most spots there fast.

IBT: Even more cities are switched into pikes/Cats

490AD(3) More workers. First troops are starting to mass at Philly.

IBT: Continue to produce units, Skim a worker out of size 12 cities with full food box.

500(4) Lower Science to 30 and Chivalry in one still.

IBT: A German galley also comes snooping. The Mongol galley disappears into the fog at our far eastern coast.
Chivalry->Invention. I still do not think I get enough payment for our monopoly tech oc MOnotheism, so I might
as well research this. It will cost us four turns of research, but it will cost AIs more, since we research at
last civ. This may of course be
Mongols are building Leonardo's.

510AD(5) Decision time. I draw uop a dotmap, and think for a while.

Sorry about teh crappy quality. Paint messed pic up.
Grey dot is dismissed, as that would leave us with the entirety of the jungle to traverse.
Green dot can be landed upon in first turn. This would leave us with four squares of jungle before
we can reach first Iro City.
Red dot is good. Would get us close and good. This would force us to wait until we have entire fleet
collected though, since we would have a long time to get reinforcements.
Brown dot seems like it would make logistics a nightmare.
I will land at green dot, and build at Pink dot. This will let me shuttle
troops before I need to declare war, and we could even have a road through the jungle
before it was time to use it.
Spend 80*13 to upgrade horses. Two horses left unupgraded. I had sent them away to our eastern coast
to have a looksee what the Mongols are about.

IBT: This is ironic. This very turn, an Iroq settler moves up to pink dot. Sigh

520AD(6) Change of plans. I will take the long lines, and instead set up for us to go for the jugular,
hoping Iro would cede us the jungle cities in a future peace deal. I start to move towards brown dot.

IBT: Bribe caesar 250 Gold to renew our luxuries deal. This is hopefully last time for that one.
I will not trade him mono, nor chivalry. Iros settle at Pink dot.

530AD(7) STart to unload troops by White dot. Settlet, two*Medieval and a warrior. Notice a Mongolian landing force
They have landed a spear/settler combo by our easternmost wines.

IBT: Mongols found Ceyr on our continent Iros doesn't like our ships in their territory. I say I will move them
Germans sail hither and tither with their galley. Possibly Mongols took their intended landing site.

540AD(8) We are still monopoly for monotheism and Chivalry. I will see if Germany has Gunpowder after I get
invention and trade for that. I set a few cities on courthouses in order for them to go to 15 shields per turn.
Found Pittsburg in Iro country. Disband a warrior and rush walls. Their mounted warriors could make some serious
dents into our PIkemen otherwise. With this city on hills and having walls, losses should be small.

IBT: Get Invention, set sights on Gunpowder.

550AD(9) Looks at AIs. Caesar seems to be the AI powerhouse. He now has Chivalry somehow. He also has gunpowder.
He doesn't have Theology though. He wants spices, theology, world map and 510 gold for
Gunpowder. This is a heavy trade, so I set my research to this for GunPowder in four at +66 gpt. )

IBT: Rome demands spices. I tell him to stick it, and he counters that he was only joking. He really is broke,
as he has no money, and wouldn't even pay 2 gpt for spices with the large empipre he has.

560AD(10) Move lots of ships. ooo, just discovered some weed. I have upgraded some regular warriors to Medieval inf.
Leave here for next leader to decide. I am fairly certain we could declare and raze the size 6 Iro city, and after that
turtle for three turns until reinforcements come.
I didn't want to trade with Romans, since I thought he would gain more than we, since we research so fast now,
when we follow him. We should perhaps start a wonder or two. Sistines, Leos and Sun Tzu are all good, but I
personally would prefer Leos over SunTzu. Most of our fighting would be at other continent, so we would gain more
money with leos.



Grimjack

 

[Grimjack]

We are still sorely lacking in workers. I would have liked to use workers to flesh out our least corrupt cities. I think we have enough troops, we just need to get them to front. Plan is to strike at core, and get Iros to cede jungle cities to us.

 

[bewareofgnomes]

uhh. grimjack, neither the saves nor the pictures work, but it looks like you had a good turn establishing a beachead. i think that maybe the mongols should go after the iros, as they are impeding on our manifest destiny.

 

[Grimjack]

There. It was very late last night, and I didn't check closely enough. HOpefully both save and pictures work now.
Grimjack

 

[bewareofgnomes]

they work now thanks. why did you settle all that way south? it seems too far wawy for reinforcements (forgive me if im missingf something obviuos)

 

[Grimjack]

I had intended to settle on pink dot, but indians beat me to it. I wanted to settle somewhere and start to ship troops over while I had peacetime.

I also wanted to cripple Iros as soon as possible, and then take care of their jungle cities at our leisure. Having a 15 Knight SoD would let us steamroll Iros two/three productive cities, preventing counterattacks. They do have their riders, and will get a golden age if the win a battle. ALl the more important to have a hard hammer in their core.
I realize reinforcements will be slow and few. ALternative would have been to settle in grey dot. This would have led to a slow offensive.
Grimjack

 

[bewareofgnomes]

i havent looked at the save, but how close is pittsburg to the iro core? als, we will want a reax their asap.

 

[Shillen]

I got it.

 

[Grimjack]

Pittsburg is two squares from their next biggest city, and five or six from their capitol.
We will need to strike quickly, or we may get flipped, since we are very close.

Grimjack

 

[Shillen]

Preturn: First order of business is pillaging our iron sources. City window shows 2 sources but I see 3. I check diplo screen and we’re trading iron to Mongols? Why are we trading a strategic resource to a future enemy? Boston switched to Leonardo’s. Lots of cities switched to barracks/horsemen. We have courthouses in core cities for some reason.

570 AD (1): Move units around. Lots of knights/horsemen built.

IT: Mongol deal ends. I trade silks, spices, wines, 18gpt for ivory. Probably the last time we’ll need to trade for luxuries since we’ll be capturing some from Iroquois.

580 AD (2): More troop movements, pillage the other iron source. Disbanded all regular warriors. Science down to 40 (gunpowder in 1).

590 AD (3): We learn gunpowder. Research set to chemistry at 70% (4t/-13gpt). We have saltpeter but it’s not connected, I’d suggest not connecting it since muskets are very expensive. Connect it for cavalry. Iroquois have saltpeter but they’d have to road both jungle and a mountain to connect it, so that will take them a while, not to mention they don’t have gunpowder yet. Rome does not have saltpeter. Germans and Mongols do.

600 AD (4): Iron reconnected. We have 18 knights, 13 horsemen, and more cities building horsemen. Tampa Bay founded on NE tip. Harbor rushed in Pittsburg.

610 AD (5): Orlando founded on second continent. Ok it’s time for war. Allegheny captured with no losses. German town founded on saltpeter on second continent (where Seoul was). Science down to 60%.

IT: Germans and Romans building Sistine Chapel.

620 AD (6): Temple rushed in Pittsburgh to grab gems. St. Regis captured with no casualties. Salamanca captured with no casualties, but lots of retreats (demonic spearmen). No sign of pikemen yet even though they do have iron.

IT: We lose a knight to an Iroquois knight.

630 AD (7): We learn chemistry. Set to metallurgy at 60% (6t/+116gpt). We could get it in 4 but I still have horsemen to upgrade and need the cash. We’re also going to need cash when we get military tradition. Too many injured knights to attack another town (we need a leader to rush Sun Tzu on this continent).

IT: Rome declared war on Mongols.

640 AD (8): Regular knight loses to 2hp spearman. Lose another knight to Iroquois knight.

650 AD (9): Lot of troop movements.

660 AD (10): Tonawanda captured with no casualties. We attack Grand River, swordsmen kills 2 of our knights, didn’t bring enough troops I guess. Iroquois’ only connected iron source pillaged.

Ok we have 32 knights and 2 horsemen to upgrade. I left most of the fun for BoG. We’ll have gems connected next turn. Capture grand river and rush a temple for the incense connection in 7. We’ll get cavalry in the first half of Bam-Bam’s turn probably. I’m hoping we can finish the Iroquois and Germans before the AI gets cavalry. Don’t worry so much about the Zulu continent. Let the AI settle there if they want, they’ll just be corrupt cities anyway and they won’t be able to produce any units there. We can take those cities at our leisure.

Upload server isn't working, I'll post the save in a bit.

 

[bewareofgnomes]

alright, nice tuen shillen. i like the pillaging of the iron. i do that alot. why build knights when you could build horsemen for half cost?