Dynamic
But not hurry
Happy new year for you too!Happy new year! (If you are a Cristian)
Booga.
I'm atheist.
I've never been in Israel but my cousin (she) lives in Tel-Aviv.
Booga games diar..rhea
- Thread starter boogaboo
- Start date
I'm atheist.
I've never been in Israel but my cousin (she) lives in Tel-Aviv.
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
460AD !! That's 12 turns off my record..
Moses, Jesus and Muhammad help me! (I'm atheist 2, and I'm near Tel Aviv
)
I might just have to return to civ4, you cheeky bastard!
I'm level 9 with my Paladin..
Moses, Jesus and Muhammad help me! (I'm atheist 2, and I'm near Tel Aviv
)I might just have to return to civ4, you cheeky bastard!
I'm level 9 with my Paladin..
Dynamic
But not hurry
No, it's just 8 turns, because Marathon has 10 years per turn from 2500BC to 500AD.
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
I can almost feel relieved... but u're right.
Dynamic
But not hurry
Note, I discovered Ecology at the same turn with you!
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
Note, I discovered Ecology at the same turn with you!
You're "hiding" something!!
I think that "something" is the forests you keep to chop at the end.. am I right?
Dynamic
But not hurry
Yes, it's one of things that I've improved. Ideal game has SS launch 1 Turn After Ecology (TAE) (2 turns in log). But Rainforest contains too few Forests in comparing to other maps. For Quick to Epic speeds it's no matter, player can launch 1 TAE even without Forests, but with right multiple overflow. But Marathon requires Forests. In my previous game I've launched after 5 TAE (you have launched 10 TAE). This time I saved more Forests (used Lambermills) and launched just 2 TAE. Fast TAE launch especially hard for Settler level because science is too fast and some cities haven't time for max growth.
Dynamic
But not hurry
And, you use non-optimized (for non OCC) tech way on finish. So you should have more super-cities for fast finish. I need just 1 (or 2 if there are too few Forests).
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
I'll look into your game, and mainly last sciences order.
However, I still feel the need to be a Paladin in DDO.. so I may not start my attempts just yet.
Booga.
However, I still feel the need to be a Paladin in DDO.. so I may not start my attempts just yet.
Booga.
Dynamic
But not hurry
Good Luck!
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
Dynamic,
Finally I beat you.. 390AD, and it took me about 13 months
It was 5 turns after ecology.
I did it with 10 cities, no double/triple river, no copper (Musa had it), and no GA event, although I did build the Statue of Zeus expecting it as nearly usual
. Also quite a bad national city.
I did get a free scientist in my capital from an early event (with 3 health).
I also did get the "coal plants +4 shields" event quite soon.
Now, do you want me to meet your cousin, or is she not as intelligent as you?
Boogaaaaaaaaaa So happy at last)))))
Finally I beat you.. 390AD, and it took me about 13 months
It was 5 turns after ecology.
I did it with 10 cities, no double/triple river, no copper (Musa had it), and no GA event, although I did build the Statue of Zeus expecting it as nearly usual
. Also quite a bad national city.I did get a free scientist in my capital from an early event (with 3 health).
I also did get the "coal plants +4 shields" event quite soon.
Now, do you want me to meet your cousin, or is she not as intelligent as you?
Boogaaaaaaaaaa So happy at last
)))))
Dynamic
But not hurry
Congratulations!Dynamic,
Finally I beat you.. 390AD, and it took me about 13 months
It was 5 turns after ecology.
I stopped playing Civ4 year ago so can't beat you one more time...
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
Congratulations!
I stopped playing Civ4 year ago so can't beat you one more time...
This is good news for my HoF conquests.. now I can keep on conquering new slots!
I still think you may be back some day!
I learned much from your games, so my hat is off anyway
==============
I'm now moving on (still Duel size) to Noble, as I see I still hold the chieftain and warlord spots..
No settlers or workers from huts - It's been a long time since I had to think about building workers and settlers at starting stages.
My current starting strategy is that I need a scout on first turns, and Bronze working from a hut (I start with Mining).
This way I can chop (yes, painful) my first workers from my 2 cities, and these cities should have corn/rice on their immediate radius (2 for my capital, usually one on Delhi).
I'll have to test when Musa builds the Oracle to exploit it.
I'll try reaching Education with it, and see game after game when does Musa do it (he should have no Marble).
I'll also need to steal his first worker
The map is much worse than on Settler, after I do a good complete game, I'll check Terra to see how it goes there.
Booga. Out.
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
Well, it's been 7 years, and I'm back
I'm going to go head on and try many tactics and maps on one slot. I'll have them all later for reference and self admiration..
I won't do this to other slots..
The slot I'm conquering is {Duel, Noble, Space Colony}. I always play marathon.
I'm starting with specializing in Terra, and going in the corporations route (as opposed to communism).
All my 3 starting games are with Pacal, with Mining corporation first and then sushi
The top player on this slot is/was Sir Drake's with a record of space victory at 1448AD
My games :
First game : A very rusty player (me) went to the end and reached space colony at 1476 AD which I submitted to see all is in order. It still enters as #2.. 14 turns late.
Second game : Then I did a better game, but with many mistakes and why (the f) would I try to build all the religious buildings when I'm not Industrious?!...
1460 AD was the victory, but I don't want to submit anything later than 1448AD. Still 6 turns late.
Third game :
A record at 1388 AD, exactly 30 turns better than number 1 !!
I've just submitted it. Will write later as I'm very tired now..
I invested heavily in each turn, since this game had some... strange potential from the start
Had built very few irrigation improvements. Was preparing for sushi!
Still making some mistakes and still failing the ending with launch 5 turns after ecology, but most of it was good. Got my engineer for mining Co, but the last golden age (4GP) came late and
I did not get any of the 2 golden age quests I love so much Not even the +4 for the coal mines..
Anyway, I'll write in the coming day or 2 trying to describe the story of the game.
I think I'll try this settings one more time with floodplains in my capital instead of all the water I had this time around.
I also hope for some better random events!
Having fun, but still anxious as hell when nearing main objectives like sushi and chopping before launch.
Booga.
Crazy. Must sleep.
I'm going to go head on and try many tactics and maps on one slot. I'll have them all later for reference and self admiration..
I won't do this to other slots..
The slot I'm conquering is {Duel, Noble, Space Colony}. I always play marathon.
I'm starting with specializing in Terra, and going in the corporations route (as opposed to communism).
All my 3 starting games are with Pacal, with Mining corporation first and then sushi
The top player on this slot is/was Sir Drake's with a record of space victory at 1448AD
My games :
First game : A very rusty player (me) went to the end and reached space colony at 1476 AD which I submitted to see all is in order. It still enters as #2.. 14 turns late.
Second game : Then I did a better game, but with many mistakes and why (the f) would I try to build all the religious buildings when I'm not Industrious?!...
1460 AD was the victory, but I don't want to submit anything later than 1448AD. Still 6 turns late.
Third game :
A record at 1388 AD, exactly 30 turns better than number 1 !!
I've just submitted it. Will write later as I'm very tired now..
I invested heavily in each turn, since this game had some... strange potential from the start
Had built very few irrigation improvements. Was preparing for sushi!
Still making some mistakes and still failing the ending with launch 5 turns after ecology, but most of it was good. Got my engineer for mining Co, but the last golden age (4GP) came late and
I did not get any of the 2 golden age quests I love so much
Not even the +4 for the coal mines..Anyway, I'll write in the coming day or 2 trying to describe the story of the game.
I think I'll try this settings one more time with floodplains in my capital instead of all the water I had this time around.
I also hope for some better random events!
Having fun, but still anxious as hell when nearing main objectives like sushi and chopping before launch.
Booga.
Crazy. Must sleep.
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
Hello peoploids
This post will start describing my third game, record at 1388AD space race.
Done on Duel, Noble, Space, with Pacal on terra map (just cause it's the largest duel map!)
I have a.. game plan page on which I operate (and change if needed during the game).
On this page I kept track of some of the things that happened in the game, mainly which sciences and wonders I did and when.
This is where I write the dates I arrive at each tech or wonder, so I can know if I'm behind or not on later games and to improve my strategy for later games.
I've attached the strategy plan I had when entering into this game.
NOTE that it is a plan that was based on the second game with religious buildings and dates of my records in the second game. It was not always followed, especially not followed in the ending techs.
I will also discuss a lot of strategy, not just this game.
So, let's start. Booga vs Ghandi vs Mansa Musa !
I'm not going to talk about the map so much, but the starting location was.. special -
End game screenshot of the area, showing the capital, marble location at the bottom left and the only crab I got in the bottom right :
I found myself at the start founding my capital with MANY water tiles, knowing I will Have to do MOAI in my capital for the hammers instead of the Globe theater for end growth. So be it.
It's all one big race, so let's call the parts accordingly
Part 1 - Race to Alphabet (turns 0-109)
[ABCDE אבגדה , whatever, ur sciences are belong to me!]
My first goal is to find and murder Ghandi while popping all the goody huts I can find, while reaching Alphabet as fast as possible.
I've bothered myself a lot if I should wait for his religion and worker and then take them, but decided that it is generally best to just take the city. I can do the worker myself, religion can come later, and the commerce I gain from the 2nd city will cost me some money... About half a goody hut money. I'll do it.
Also, with Ghandi dead early, he will take less goody huts!!
The first good indication that I might find Ghandi despite the terrible start location is that I found a scout
I did find him straight north from me, and killed him.
His city also contained 2 corn! One difficult to reach since it was on radius 2..
His city is renamed from Delhi to Nat.
It has many forests on a river and will be my national city - the one with national epic and national park, which will produce my GP (together with my awesome capital!)
My capital (Cap) built one warrior I think before building a fishing boat for the fish, and building a worker.
I now had 2 cities and popped many huts.
Stone and marble (a vital condition for a game) :
I found the stone near Nat, but I almost gave up on the game for lack of Marble until I saw this horrible location (see pic above). But I was soooo happy I have a nice start that it didn't matter.
A small glitch, there always are.
I will late found a city ON that marble so all I need to do is get a settler there a bit before the oracle starts.
Sciences-wise, I needed agriculture, before anything else, and since my world is... connected by sea, I decided to go for sailing even before pottery. then came writing and Alphabet.
I reached Alphabet at turn 109, so let the science trade begin!
Part 2 - Race towards a working empire (turns 109-183)
[currency and metal casting, expansion, academy]
I now trade sciences with Musa, but there are several goals now -
1. Academy - Building a library in my capital and getting 2 scientists out ASAP, so 50 turns later I have my academy.
2. Expansion - I must produce at least 2 settlers and some workers.
3. Techs - Get to Currency before settling cities 3 and 4, otherwise you can get broke fast
Then get Metal casting to start building non-granary buildings.
After Math I do start chopping when needed.
Let's expand on how and what I did on each front.
1. Academy -
I try to reach an academy in my capital ASAP.
Since Nat is whipping workers, my capital will have to build a library while preferably growing to max size, then get 2 scientists out and be half-paralyzed for the next 50 turns.
Only half-paralyzed, and the academy from that great scientist is worth it.
Academy was built at turn 180, 3 turns before metal casting
Now those scientists will just have to work those tiles like everybody else!
2. Expansion -
Settlers :
Building settlers actually comes last but only involves growing and whipping Nat and letting Cap build them while stuck with 2 scientists. Some chopping (post math) helps speed this up.
I built one city near the stone on a river. It will have low food, but is on a river, and will become my Ironworks city.
I built the second city near my capital (the upper right city in pic...)
Workers :
When building workers (besides the first one), I use my 25% worker bonus to double-whip on Nat. I did this 3 times I think.. perhaps twice..?
If you do not know double-whipping, it is whipping 2 population for 2 workers.
It can only be done when you have 25% bonus when building workers. Not 50%, not 0%.
It goes like this :
A. Grow city to size 4 (preferably 2-3 turns from size 5)
B. Place 2 workers in the queue, and make sure the city is building up to 7 hammers, but not more!
C. Press end turn.
D. whip the city of 2 population (and get the correct tiles back to work for top [hammers+food] )
E. Press next turn, and the first worker will come out, but also there is a huge overflow of hammers which will create the second worker the turn after that
3. Techs -
On the tech front we reached alphabet and I soon get Bronze working from Musa and revolt to slavery. I need slavery fast with the amounts of food I have in Cap and Nat
Math allows me to speed things up with some more effective chopping. I don't chop before Math. But Math is just a precursor for Currency and a helping hand for those settlers.
Currency reached at turn 164, which is not amazing, but my empire looks good.
I placed my 2 cities before currency, as one was near me and connected by water, and the other was place to not allow Musa to build near my stone! it was also tradely connected
After currency, metal casting the last tech to start building.
Metal casting was reached in turn 183, which is quite good.
Part 3 - Race for Oxford and the new world! (turns 183-297)
[Org. Religion + Bureaucracy , Oracle for Education for Oxford, Optics to sail for new world]
Key events:
Tech front :
The path is :
1. Code of Laws (religion) then Civil Service (revolution) then Paper for getting Education with the Oracle.
2. Some minor much needed techs (Calendar, Aesthetics, Literature)
3. A beeline for Optics to get a Caravel (we ARE on a terra map!), which includes Feudalism, Machinery and Compass. You will see what I do with the Caravel a few lines down on the "When I finally have Optics" paragraph..
I received Monotheism and Priesthood from Musa (and later Iron working and construction), but I won't change to organized religion just yet... I'll want to wait for Civil Service to switch 2-3 civics at once instead of getting penalized for each revolution.
With Code of Laws, I start a religious revolution for Confucianism, since I also get 1 missionary.
By the time I had Civil Service (turn 220) I was also given Monarchy, so it's a triple revolution for Org. Religion + Bureaucracy + Hereditary rule !
Now I have the correct civics running and can chop all this wood lying around like... well, wood
Chopping will greatly speed my 4 universities, because even with the civics and forge and slavery, building a university at this early point is painful.
Paper is painful too, but it is all worth the Oxford... eh, I mean prize.
I'll now do Calendar for the happiness, and Literature for wonders, and race towards Optics.
I still need slavery so I'm not moving to serfdom just yet!
When I finally have Optics, I will immediately send a caravel with a scout (I still have him) to find the new world continent and pop its' goody huts until I get Astronomy! and some cash too!
And sail around the world for the +1 sea movement! and sell the map to Musa to tease him! and use too many exclamation marks!
Story/Buildings front :
At the start point, my cities all start building their forge, but what is this forge for?
For building 4 universities needed for Oxford.
Every city's job is to get the forge (and 2 more libraries) ready for the time education comes.
The capital and Nat already have a library and are bigger - they can do a settler and a wonder each before I reach Education.
Of the settlers, one will take the Marble tile at turn 203 to be able to get started with the oracle, and the other will found the upper left city in the pic at turn 225.
Of the wonders, Moai will be complete in the Capital at 245, and will help it build... everything else later on.
The Oracle will be finished when I finally finish researching Paper - turn 238.
It's a gamble that Musa won't build the Oracle, but it is an important gamble.. the earliest I saw him do it on this setting is turn 218, so it is worth the try indeed
So at turn 238, Paper is done and the Oracle is complete that same turn.
Education is chosen, and it is up for 4 brave cities to build universities and Oxford.
Pre-chopping and growing the cities in population helps finish those universities in a timely manner.
I don't know when I finally had all 4 , but at turn 260, just 22 turns after education, I had Oxford built in my capital
Now I will have mainly courthouses and imporant wonders to build that will be finished mostly after Optics.
Some food-less cities will grow slowly and will have to build wealth to hold the economy together.
The only Wonder finished before Optics is the great library in Nat, which will be needed THERE and not in Cap, since I want them to be later affected by national epic more than I need the science.
Nat immediately starts working on national epic, but I have no record of the time it is built... around 300-310.
Cap is building the Great Lighthouse which will serve me a loooooooong time. It will be finished at 298.
[Next parts continue on next posts]
This post will start describing my third game, record at 1388AD space race.
Done on Duel, Noble, Space, with Pacal on terra map (just cause it's the largest duel map!)
I have a.. game plan page on which I operate (and change if needed during the game).
On this page I kept track of some of the things that happened in the game, mainly which sciences and wonders I did and when.
This is where I write the dates I arrive at each tech or wonder, so I can know if I'm behind or not on later games and to improve my strategy for later games.
I've attached the strategy plan I had when entering into this game.
NOTE that it is a plan that was based on the second game with religious buildings and dates of my records in the second game. It was not always followed, especially not followed in the ending techs.
I will also discuss a lot of strategy, not just this game.
So, let's start. Booga vs Ghandi vs Mansa Musa !
I'm not going to talk about the map so much, but the starting location was.. special -
End game screenshot of the area, showing the capital, marble location at the bottom left and the only crab I got in the bottom right :
I found myself at the start founding my capital with MANY water tiles, knowing I will Have to do MOAI in my capital for the hammers instead of the Globe theater for end growth. So be it.
It's all one big race, so let's call the parts accordingly
Part 1 - Race to Alphabet (turns 0-109)
[ABCDE אבגדה , whatever, ur sciences are belong to me!]
My first goal is to find and murder Ghandi while popping all the goody huts I can find, while reaching Alphabet as fast as possible.
I've bothered myself a lot if I should wait for his religion and worker and then take them, but decided that it is generally best to just take the city. I can do the worker myself, religion can come later, and the commerce I gain from the 2nd city will cost me some money... About half a goody hut money. I'll do it.
Also, with Ghandi dead early, he will take less goody huts!!
The first good indication that I might find Ghandi despite the terrible start location is that I found a scout
I did find him straight north from me, and killed him.
His city also contained 2 corn! One difficult to reach since it was on radius 2..
His city is renamed from Delhi to Nat.
It has many forests on a river and will be my national city - the one with national epic and national park, which will produce my GP (together with my awesome capital!)
My capital (Cap) built one warrior I think before building a fishing boat for the fish, and building a worker.
I now had 2 cities and popped many huts.
Stone and marble (a vital condition for a game) :
I found the stone near Nat, but I almost gave up on the game for lack of Marble until I saw this horrible location (see pic above). But I was soooo happy I have a nice start that it didn't matter.
A small glitch, there always are.
I will late found a city ON that marble so all I need to do is get a settler there a bit before the oracle starts.
Sciences-wise, I needed agriculture, before anything else, and since my world is... connected by sea, I decided to go for sailing even before pottery. then came writing and Alphabet.
I reached Alphabet at turn 109, so let the science trade begin!
Part 2 - Race towards a working empire (turns 109-183)
[currency and metal casting, expansion, academy]
I now trade sciences with Musa, but there are several goals now -
1. Academy - Building a library in my capital and getting 2 scientists out ASAP, so 50 turns later I have my academy.
2. Expansion - I must produce at least 2 settlers and some workers.
3. Techs - Get to Currency before settling cities 3 and 4, otherwise you can get broke fast
Then get Metal casting to start building non-granary buildings.
After Math I do start chopping when needed.
Let's expand on how and what I did on each front.
1. Academy -
I try to reach an academy in my capital ASAP.
Since Nat is whipping workers, my capital will have to build a library while preferably growing to max size, then get 2 scientists out and be half-paralyzed for the next 50 turns.
Only half-paralyzed, and the academy from that great scientist is worth it.
Academy was built at turn 180, 3 turns before metal casting
Now those scientists will just have to work those tiles like everybody else!
2. Expansion -
Settlers :
Building settlers actually comes last but only involves growing and whipping Nat and letting Cap build them while stuck with 2 scientists. Some chopping (post math) helps speed this up.
I built one city near the stone on a river. It will have low food, but is on a river, and will become my Ironworks city.
I built the second city near my capital (the upper right city in pic...)
Workers :
When building workers (besides the first one), I use my 25% worker bonus to double-whip on Nat. I did this 3 times I think.. perhaps twice..?
If you do not know double-whipping, it is whipping 2 population for 2 workers.
It can only be done when you have 25% bonus when building workers. Not 50%, not 0%.
It goes like this :
A. Grow city to size 4 (preferably 2-3 turns from size 5)
B. Place 2 workers in the queue, and make sure the city is building up to 7 hammers, but not more!
C. Press end turn.
D. whip the city of 2 population (and get the correct tiles back to work for top [hammers+food] )
E. Press next turn, and the first worker will come out, but also there is a huge overflow of hammers which will create the second worker the turn after that
3. Techs -
On the tech front we reached alphabet and I soon get Bronze working from Musa and revolt to slavery. I need slavery fast with the amounts of food I have in Cap and Nat
Math allows me to speed things up with some more effective chopping. I don't chop before Math. But Math is just a precursor for Currency
and a helping hand for those settlers.Currency reached at turn 164, which is not amazing, but my empire looks good.
I placed my 2 cities before currency, as one was near me and connected by water, and the other was place to not allow Musa to build near my stone! it was also tradely connected
After currency, metal casting the last tech to start building.
Metal casting was reached in turn 183, which is quite good.
Part 3 - Race for Oxford and the new world! (turns 183-297)
[Org. Religion + Bureaucracy , Oracle for Education for Oxford, Optics to sail for new world]
Key events:
- 196 : Revolution to Confucianism
- 203 : Marble (city #5) founded
- 220 : Civil Service
- 220 : Org. Religion + Bureaucracy + Hereditary rule
- 225 : A2 (city #6) founded
- 238 : Paper + Oracle + Education
- 260 : Oxford
- 287 : Great Library at Nat
- 288 : Optics
Tech front :
The path is :
1. Code of Laws (religion) then Civil Service (revolution) then Paper for getting Education with the Oracle.
2. Some minor much needed techs (Calendar, Aesthetics, Literature)
3. A beeline for Optics to get a Caravel (we ARE on a terra map!), which includes Feudalism, Machinery and Compass. You will see what I do with the Caravel a few lines down on the "When I finally have Optics" paragraph..
I received Monotheism and Priesthood from Musa (and later Iron working and construction), but I won't change to organized religion just yet... I'll want to wait for Civil Service to switch 2-3 civics at once instead of getting penalized for each revolution.
With Code of Laws, I start a religious revolution for Confucianism, since I also get 1 missionary.
By the time I had Civil Service (turn 220) I was also given Monarchy, so it's a triple revolution for Org. Religion + Bureaucracy + Hereditary rule !
Now I have the correct civics running and can chop all this wood lying around like... well, wood
Chopping will greatly speed my 4 universities, because even with the civics and forge and slavery, building a university at this early point is painful.
Paper is painful too, but it is all worth the Oxford... eh, I mean prize.
I'll now do Calendar for the happiness, and Literature for wonders, and race towards Optics.
I still need slavery so I'm not moving to serfdom just yet!
When I finally have Optics, I will immediately send a caravel with a scout (I still have him) to find the new world continent and pop its' goody huts until I get Astronomy! and some cash too!
And sail around the world for the +1 sea movement! and sell the map to Musa to tease him! and use too many exclamation marks!
Story/Buildings front :
At the start point, my cities all start building their forge, but what is this forge for?
For building 4 universities needed for Oxford.
Every city's job is to get the forge (and 2 more libraries) ready for the time education comes.
The capital and Nat already have a library and are bigger - they can do a settler and a wonder each before I reach Education.
Of the settlers, one will take the Marble tile at turn 203 to be able to get started with the oracle, and the other will found the upper left city in the pic at turn 225.
Of the wonders, Moai will be complete in the Capital at 245, and will help it build... everything else later on.
The Oracle will be finished when I finally finish researching Paper - turn 238.
It's a gamble that Musa won't build the Oracle, but it is an important gamble.. the earliest I saw him do it on this setting is turn 218, so it is worth the try indeed
So at turn 238, Paper is done and the Oracle is complete that same turn.
Education is chosen, and it is up for 4 brave cities to build universities and Oxford.
Pre-chopping and growing the cities in population helps finish those universities in a timely manner.
I don't know when I finally had all 4 , but at turn 260, just 22 turns after education, I had Oxford built in my capital
Now I will have mainly courthouses and imporant wonders to build that will be finished mostly after Optics.
Some food-less cities will grow slowly and will have to build wealth to hold the economy together.
The only Wonder finished before Optics is the great library in Nat, which will be needed THERE and not in Cap, since I want them to be later affected by national epic more than I need the science.
Nat immediately starts working on national epic, but I have no record of the time it is built... around 300-310.
Cap is building the Great Lighthouse which will serve me a loooooooong time. It will be finished at 298.
[Next parts continue on next posts]
Last edited:
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
Part 4 - Golden ages, Expansion and race for Mining Co. (turns 298-422)
Part 4 is long, so here are the main events :
At this point I have a 8-city empire and just received optics.
This means a caravel is in production and I'm betting on finding astronomy from a goody hut.
I will in fact pop astronomy in turn 323 Along with 480 gold.
But the main plan is to map the world and settle it in time for the corporations to kick in.
We'll need a great engineer, and also important is to get the first golden age when getting Banking - to be able to switch civics and expand fast.
I think it is best to look at this part in 2 parallel chronological fronts -
1. The tech front - reasoning in digestible chunks and themes.
2. The story front - events, buildings, GP, GA, thoughts.
Tech Front (in the order I finished them) :
Chunk 1 : Guilds, Drama, Music and Banking (finished turn 310) -
Guilds is not only a prerequisite of many things (including banking), but also gives you the +1 hammer on a workshop, and I build many many many workshops (expecting sushi to sweep in at some point). Grocer is not really needed yet.
** A NOTE :
Banking... I want it now, but I can't yet! I have to divert for drama and Music.
Why? My caravel is soon to arrive to the new world.
It will encounter only a few goody huts in the new world continent (5-6 usually).
The chance of getting a tech is 2/17 if I understand correctly the CIV4HandicapInfo.xml file without barbarians (can anyone confirm?).
Even assuming I have 6 goody huts, the chance of NOT getting any tech is (15/17) to the 6th = 47.19%
Thusly, if I want to have Astronomy, I can't gamble on popping Drama or Music (which are poppable).
I need to research drama and music NOW, and then pop huts for the 53% chance to get Astronomy. This is good, because I need the artist from Music to start the first GA.
Drama I don't really need at this point, but it's cheap and makes Music cheaper and theaters available, so I do it anyway.
Music is important for me for the great artist and for not popping it in the new world. Nothing else.
I don't usually want culture. I live in a tight duel world!
Now that I have Music, I can start popping huts to get money and Astronomy.
Banking is badly needed for the Mercantilism civic (for the one free specialist per city).
I want my first GA to occur when discovering Banking.
Also, my soon to be vast empire acutely needs serfdom so my workers can be more effective.
Slavery can get a rest.
I'll need 4 banks for the WallSt city, so I'd better start building them too.
See more about money and my economy in the story part.
Chunk 2 : Philosophy, (Astronomy), Nationalism, Printing Press and Constitution (finished turn 350) -
Goal : I was actually going for Printing Press (PP) blindly according to the plan (see PDF in previous post), when I realized third way through PP that my GA won't last forever, and that I need Taj Mahal and representation far more than I need the PP boost of my 5 cottages..
Philosophy is first, just to get to Nationalism.
It doesn't give much other than that. Ankor Wat isn't important for me yet.
It is much cheaper than researching the useless Divine Right (which I leave to Musa) for Nationalism.
Astronomy is popped from a goody hut at this point - turn 323.
It gives me the observatory to pump up the science, and for 200 gold I also upgrade my galley to a galleon that can carry settlers and whatever to the new world continent.
Nationalism gives me both Taj Mahal (which I start building immediately) and opens the road to Constitution.
Printing Press is finally being done now instead of doing Constitution, since I will have to wait until Taj Mahal is complete for the revolution to representation (and serfdom).
Doing Constitution now will not contribute anything. PP will at least give me my cottages bonus. Now.
Constitution, needless to say, but I say it - REPRESENTATION! (especially since I am on Mercantilism)
The 2nd GA and revolution will sadly only happen in 367 due to slow building of Taj
Chunk 3 : Gunpowder, Engineering, Chemistry, Replaceable Parts, Steam Power (finished turn 393) -
Goal : I don't really need many of these techs right now. It's a boring chunk.
I'm really after getting railroad and corporation for Mining Co.
I do get a small bonus for happiness from Notre Dam, and +1 for workshops and watermills.
Steam power the most important tech in this chunk - for the levees, and for the +50% worker speed, and it comes only at the end.
Gunpowder - I do this first to get a chance to get the Guns butter quest and get a free GA. I didn't get it.
Engineering - Notre Dam, which I do build early this game, to not be happiness-wise pressed when the sushi comes.
+one road movement is nice too.
Chemistry - +1 from workshops!
Replaceable Parts - +1 from Watermills too. And for all my ZERO windmills..
Steam Power -
A. Workers start to work more effectively
B. Cities with rivers can start building levees, although I wait for small rivers until mining co is established and running.
C. Coal is revealed, bringing blackness into our lives.. for the soon to be coal plants and Ironworks!
Chunk 4 : Steel, Liberalism, Railroad, Economics, Corporation (finished turn 421) -
Goal : For Mining Co, I need Railroad and Corporation. Steel and Railroad give me more than Economics and Corporation, so I do them first.
I always used to get Assembly Line from Liberalism, but Assembly Line is only slightly bigger than Railroad..
Getting to Mining Co a 6-8 turns faster matters more than getting factories faster later on (when I'll already have Mining Co).
So Liberalism is used for Railroad.
Steel - I can start building Ironworks in the.. city I now call Iron. it is mostly a river and workshops there.
Liberalism - free tech - get railroad NOW!
Railroad - Enables me to do railroad over some roads, but really.. really.. Mining Co enabled!
Economics - 2 important things : Great Merchant to save for sushi , and Free Market to soon use when starting to spread Mining Co.
Corporation - in order of increasing importance :
A. The great lighthouse becomes obsolete so -2 trade routes in coastal cities, but I get +1 trade routes in all cities, so I lose only a bit commerce-wise.
B. Wall Street can be built.
C. Can and will immediately FOUND MINING CORPORATION, and spread it too! (turn 422)
Story Front :
We just got optics and going for banking, and I have 3 main objectives, timelined something like this :
To get my first GA, I'll have my Music artist start it, but I also have to finish Maus of Maus (MoM!) first.
I never do GA without MoM.
Banking is finished at 310. MoM is finished at 314 ==>
First GA starts at 315 and so does Mercantilism and Serfdom (finally without the anarchy).
Astronomy popped at 323 gives my capital and a few others a green light for observatory.
Many settlers are also built and settled around this time, but I won't track each city..
One turn before the GA is over, at 338, I went back to slavery since I had whippings to do.
All cities by now should have or start immediately with courthouses.
I need the forbidden palace placed correctly, and there isn't a building city in the correct place for it... But there is a location with river and lots of forests...
So I founded a city for the forbidden palace and chopped all the wood around it to do it. [granary, forge, courthouse, forbidden]
The forbidden palace was finished at turn 353
Note about money and my economy :
I keep myself either at 100% or 0% science except on rare exceptions.
I did not built any marketplaces or grocer up to this point. (!!)
The reason is they take long to build do not give as much money for hammers as a bank does, and I don't need the happiness or health ATM.
Now, I will build 4 banks - in my capital, in the future WallSt city which has commerce, and in 2 other cities that have commerce.
Once they are built, I'll start market and grocer in WallSt, awaiting the corporations to settle their headquarters there and then build WallSt with the Mining Co help
The Representation civic is available at turn 350, but I can't switch to it yet, since my first GA is long over and the Taj is yet to complete
Taj is completed in 367, and my second GA starts.
I immediately switched to Representation and back to Serfdom.
Much of the GA was spent on settlers, workers, missionaries and completing my 4 banks.
The second GA ended at 391, when I was nearing Steam power (393).
A turn before the GA ended, I switched to Caste system for the extra hammer on workshops. It can be debated if mercantilism is better, but I already had my engineer (see GP appendix in a few lines), so hammers rule.
I don't remember what exactly I was building at this point apart from more settlers and 2-3 levees.
Notre Dam and Hanging gardens started, but finished only at 430 and 428 respectively (part 5 of the game).
When Steel was discovered, I started on Ironworks even without Mining Co.. it is a large project anyway, each hammer counts.
After discovering Railroad at 411, I started a third GA (2GP) at turn 412.
I started this GA because I could, and because it was important to rush to Corporation, establish Mining Co, and spread it through executives FAST.
All this while keeping the economy intact somehow..
I didn't get an extra GA from quests so I also did it to not fall behind.
At 421, 9 turns into the GA, I discovered Corporation, and at 422 Established the Mining Co headquarters, ending part 4 of the game story!!!
Coming ahead - economically stressful times with Corporation.
Spreading it included many 0% science turns and reliance on banks already built.
WallSt will start after 2-3 executives are produced and will eventually (and ironically..) save the economy! (when completed at 451)
Appendix about Great People:
I'll describe what I got (in order of appearance) and then explain my plan.
[GP with asterisk are born with less than 100% certainty of their type]
The Economics Merchant is sure to come.
The one big issue with this list is the uncertainty of the Engineer.
It is a big bet - I need him for Mining Co at turn 422.
Otherwise the game is as good as dead.. I had that
I get a sure engineer at Fusion, but that's like spitting in my strategy's face!
So I gamble.
I gamble one of those 5 asterisks is born an engineer.
4 are born in Nat and one in Cap.
No Engineer wonders fit my plan early, sadly, so I'm really left with placing constant engineers from forge and from mercantilism (in Nat) and hope for the best.
I didn't do the math here. I just try whenever possible to get those engineers up in Nat
Cap is harder to do as it favors a scientist by far, and produces only one of the 5 GP, so it is relieved from engineer duty.
The gamble becomes : 1 of 4 GP in Nat must be an engineer.
Next game, I may keep track of my chances for each to be an engineer
Appendix about Apostolic Palace :
At turn 400 (that's 500 AD for humans), I was not surprised to see the apostolic palace built by Musa. He's the kinda guy that does this.
I was surprised to find out that he was nearing religious victory, and forgot all about it!
He had several religions, and I couldn't know in advance which one he'll go for, right?
Or does the AI always go for the state religion as AP religion?
In any case, it was Hinduism, and I had only 2 hindu cities...
I checked some data online about the AP - what would bring me more votes to prevent my loss?
Well, I'm not converting to hindu, but the other route is big cities with hindu in them.
So, I built a few hindu missionaries from the cities that were hindu, spread hinduism a bit and relax.
I should remember for future games that it can happen..
OTOH, I did went on to give most cities hindu temples for the 2 hammers
Part 5 - Getting to MAX power for the space race (turns 422 - 508)
Goal :
This part is all about achieving the maximum power I can have before spaceship parts start coming in.
Production wise, it's adding to the Mining Co with factories, coal plants and Industrial Parks.
Science wise, it's Labs ASAP.
For all this to work, the cities must grow to an enormous size fast. Sushi.
From here on I diverted from the original PDF plan.
I would have gone directly to Sushi, but breaking the Scientific Method barrier will obsolete my great library and there's still one tech I need badly - Assembly Line to start the factories and coal plants and be ready to really BUILD.
I am not certain this is the right choice, but that's my favorite, even before sushi.
So the tech plan becomes : Assembly Line, Scientific Method, beeline for Medicine for Sushi, then for Superconductors for Labs.
I end with Industrialization for the Aluminum and Ind. Park. and communism to start a 4th GA.
Main events :
Tech front :
443 - Assembly Line.
For Factories and coal plants, of course
It took me a long while to get there because of the Mining Co expansion drain on my economy.
WallSt is built at turn 451 and there will almost always be 100% science turns from there on.
454 - Scientific Method.
All mainland workers go to preserve forests at Nat, waiting for it to build the National Park.
Oil is NOT needed nor connected.
463 - Biology.
Build National Park in Nat, and make it the city with 20 specialists it deserves to be!
473 - Medicine.
Finally. Sushi incorporated at 474. When fully active, all mainland cities (besides a polar one) will grow every 2-3 turns
Sushi is a lot of culture, so I'm super-aware of where it should not go, since borders are important on a Duel world.
Mining Co went everywhere
480 - Physics. Nothing in it but a great scientist.
484 - Electricity. +2 commerce on watermills
490 - Refregiration.
Supermarkets. I build them on most cities.. what the heck, I have the build power and it makes me grow even faster!
498 - Superconductors.
Labs. The final piece of the science.. eh, puzzle. and they come with no culture and spaceship parts bonus. A real treat.
I build them all over.
504 - Industrialization.
Even these polluting insustrial parks are no match for sushi growth. build them on mainland!
507 - Communism.
For the great spy, since I have to get into a 4th GA now. and I'm still with 2 GP waiting for a third.
At 508, I start the 4th GA.
Story front :
We start in 422, the 10th turn of the 3rd GA.
Mining Co has just been incorporated. I now expand it with executives ASAP.
Since I'm in a GA, I soon switch to Free Market (425) to lower corporation costs.
At 428, I finally pay off a bet with Musa and build the Hanging Gardens he didn't.
I have all my cities founded (except Crab), and it's still before sushi.
It's the only situation where it is really worth my effort to build the Hanging Gardens.
I may be repeating events but trying to add sense here...
At 430, I complete Notre Dam to be happy
At 436, my golden age ends - before factories, but after Mining Co. has expanded to nearly all cities.
At 443, Assembly Line. Factories and coal plants for all! Except Nat. It will wait for a hydro plant. After these are done, cities can build whatever they need very fast.
They will build all they need, and when nearly all are done building, I will finally let go of Organized religion and go for free religion.
At 451, both Ironworks and WallSt are complete.
I can place Ironworks on wealth soon to balance nearly everybody else when needed!
All my cities are now building like crazy, golden age or not. (not, currently)
At 471, National Park ready with 12 forests preserves, 2 corn, 6.. other tiles! soon with sushi!
At 473, Medicine. This means 474 is Sushi time.
Sushi wins games. It grows your cities fast to incredible size if you have enough resources.
I had more last game, but this game I had "only" 30 food from sushi. and 36 production from Mining Co (looking at victory save..)
Since Sushi is now spread and growing my cities fast, I built Broadway at 492.
I also decided to do Ankor Wat (494) since they enable to get more builders out (priests).
At 498, Superconductors. Labs pop (nearly) everywhere.
At 504, Industrialization - the final push for hammers with industrial parks.
Now I only need a 4th GA to speed everything up and hope I have enough GP for a 5th.
To get it now, I have to go for Communism for the spy alone, and it is done in 507.
My 4th GA (3GP) starts at 508, with intentions of part 6 to be drilling science hard - to Apollo, and then build ship parts.
I now have all the buildings I need to build, research, and generally rule
Appendix : Handling Musa (Emancipation)
All my relationship with Musa is built on fear of Emanciption. :|
I'm trying to prevent the horrible scenario I had in my previous game ("game 2"), where I gave Musa too much and he went for emancipation, wrecking my plans for orderly masses of scientists
He seems to always want to do this, so I measure the techs I give him, and only give them (for money) when he's in the last few turns. Near the end I give him the finger.
He also steals my techs, the MF. (M is not for Mansa, and F is not for finger)
I actually had to counterespionage a few times and build 2-3 jails!
He took my jobs!
I did allow him to reach Emancipation 5 turns before victory... what d'ya want? I was testing limits and AIs and stuff.. go away!
Part 4 is long, so here are the main events :
- 310 - Banking.
- 314 - Maus of Maus.
- 315 - GA1 starts (from artist). Mercantilism + Serfdom.
- 318 - Academy in Nat too.
- 323 - Astronomy popped.
- 338 - Back to slavery.
- 340 - Great Engineer born!
- 353 - Forbidden palace.
- 367 - GA2 starts (from Taj Mahal). Representation + Serfdom.
- 390 - Caste System.
- 393 - Steam Power.
- 411 - Railroad.
- 412 - GA3 starts (merchant and scientist).
- 421 - Corporation.
- 422 - Mining Co.
At this point I have a 8-city empire and just received optics.
This means a caravel is in production and I'm betting on finding astronomy from a goody hut.
I will in fact pop astronomy in turn 323
Along with 480 gold.But the main plan is to map the world and settle it in time for the corporations to kick in.
We'll need a great engineer, and also important is to get the first golden age when getting Banking - to be able to switch civics and expand fast.
I think it is best to look at this part in 2 parallel chronological fronts -
1. The tech front - reasoning in digestible chunks and themes.
2. The story front - events, buildings, GP, GA, thoughts.
Tech Front (in the order I finished them) :
Chunk 1 : Guilds, Drama, Music and Banking (finished turn 310) -
Guilds is not only a prerequisite of many things (including banking), but also gives you the +1 hammer on a workshop, and I build many many many workshops (expecting sushi to sweep in at some point). Grocer is not really needed yet.
** A NOTE :
Banking... I want it now, but I can't yet! I have to divert for drama and Music.
Why? My caravel is soon to arrive to the new world.
It will encounter only a few goody huts in the new world continent (5-6 usually).
The chance of getting a tech is 2/17 if I understand correctly the CIV4HandicapInfo.xml file without barbarians (can anyone confirm?).
Even assuming I have 6 goody huts, the chance of NOT getting any tech is (15/17) to the 6th = 47.19%
Thusly, if I want to have Astronomy, I can't gamble on popping Drama or Music (which are poppable).
I need to research drama and music NOW, and then pop huts for the 53% chance to get Astronomy. This is good, because I need the artist from Music to start the first GA.
Drama I don't really need at this point, but it's cheap and makes Music cheaper and theaters available, so I do it anyway.
Music is important for me for the great artist and for not popping it in the new world. Nothing else.
I don't usually want culture. I live in a tight duel world!
Now that I have Music, I can start popping huts to get money and Astronomy.
Banking is badly needed for the Mercantilism civic (for the one free specialist per city).
I want my first GA to occur when discovering Banking.
Also, my soon to be vast empire acutely needs serfdom so my workers can be more effective.
Slavery can get a rest.
I'll need 4 banks for the WallSt city, so I'd better start building them too.
See more about money and my economy in the story part.
Chunk 2 : Philosophy, (Astronomy), Nationalism, Printing Press and Constitution (finished turn 350) -
Goal : I was actually going for Printing Press (PP) blindly according to the plan (see PDF in previous post), when I realized third way through PP that my GA won't last forever, and that I need Taj Mahal and representation far more than I need the PP boost of my 5 cottages..
Philosophy is first, just to get to Nationalism.
It doesn't give much other than that. Ankor Wat isn't important for me yet.
It is much cheaper than researching the useless Divine Right (which I leave to Musa) for Nationalism.
Astronomy is popped from a goody hut at this point
- turn 323.It gives me the observatory to pump up the science, and for 200 gold I also upgrade my galley to a galleon that can carry settlers and whatever to the new world continent.
Nationalism gives me both Taj Mahal (which I start building immediately) and opens the road to Constitution.
Printing Press is finally being done now instead of doing Constitution, since I will have to wait until Taj Mahal is complete for the revolution to representation (and serfdom).
Doing Constitution now will not contribute anything. PP will at least give me my cottages bonus. Now.
Constitution, needless to say, but I say it - REPRESENTATION! (especially since I am on Mercantilism)
The 2nd GA and revolution will sadly only happen in 367 due to slow building of Taj
Chunk 3 : Gunpowder, Engineering, Chemistry, Replaceable Parts, Steam Power (finished turn 393) -
Goal : I don't really need many of these techs right now. It's a boring chunk.
I'm really after getting railroad and corporation for Mining Co.
I do get a small bonus for happiness from Notre Dam, and +1 for workshops and watermills.
Steam power the most important tech in this chunk - for the levees, and for the +50% worker speed, and it comes only at the end.
Gunpowder - I do this first to get a chance to get the Guns butter quest and get a free GA. I didn't get it.
Engineering - Notre Dam, which I do build early this game, to not be happiness-wise pressed when the sushi comes.
+one road movement is nice too.
Chemistry - +1 from workshops!
Replaceable Parts - +1 from Watermills too. And for all my ZERO windmills..
Steam Power -
A. Workers start to work more effectively
B. Cities with rivers can start building levees, although I wait for small rivers until mining co is established and running.
C. Coal is revealed, bringing blackness into our lives.. for the soon to be coal plants and Ironworks!
Chunk 4 : Steel, Liberalism, Railroad, Economics, Corporation (finished turn 421) -
Goal : For Mining Co, I need Railroad and Corporation. Steel and Railroad give me more than Economics and Corporation, so I do them first.
I always used to get Assembly Line from Liberalism, but Assembly Line is only slightly bigger than Railroad..
Getting to Mining Co a 6-8 turns faster matters more than getting factories faster later on (when I'll already have Mining Co).
So Liberalism is used for Railroad.
Steel - I can start building Ironworks in the.. city I now call Iron. it is mostly a river and workshops there.
Liberalism - free tech - get railroad NOW!
Railroad - Enables me to do railroad over some roads, but really.. really.. Mining Co enabled!
Economics - 2 important things : Great Merchant to save for sushi , and Free Market to soon use when starting to spread Mining Co.
Corporation - in order of increasing importance :
A. The great lighthouse becomes obsolete so -2 trade routes in coastal cities, but I get +1 trade routes in all cities, so I lose only a bit commerce-wise.
B. Wall Street can be built.
C. Can and will immediately FOUND MINING CORPORATION, and spread it too! (turn 422)
Story Front :
We just got optics and going for banking, and I have 3 main objectives, timelined something like this :
- Get golden ages.
- Expand my empire drastically.
- Establish Mining Co. for production to skyrocket!
To get my first GA, I'll have my Music artist start it, but I also have to finish Maus of Maus (MoM!) first.
I never do GA without MoM.
Banking is finished at 310. MoM is finished at 314 ==>
First GA starts at 315 and so does Mercantilism and Serfdom (finally without the anarchy).
Astronomy popped at 323 gives my capital and a few others a green light for observatory.
Many settlers are also built and settled around this time, but I won't track each city..
One turn before the GA is over, at 338, I went back to slavery since I had whippings to do.
All cities by now should have or start immediately with courthouses.
I need the forbidden palace placed correctly, and there isn't a building city in the correct place for it... But there is a location with river and lots of forests...
So I founded a city for the forbidden palace and chopped all the wood around it to do it. [granary, forge, courthouse, forbidden]
The forbidden palace was finished at turn 353
Note about money and my economy :
I keep myself either at 100% or 0% science except on rare exceptions.
I did not built any marketplaces or grocer up to this point. (!!)
The reason is they take long to build do not give as much money for hammers as a bank does, and I don't need the happiness or health ATM.
Now, I will build 4 banks - in my capital, in the future WallSt city which has commerce, and in 2 other cities that have commerce.
Once they are built, I'll start market and grocer in WallSt, awaiting the corporations to settle their headquarters there and then build WallSt with the Mining Co help
The Representation civic is available at turn 350, but I can't switch to it yet, since my first GA is long over and the Taj is yet to complete
Taj is completed in 367, and my second GA starts.
I immediately switched to Representation and back to Serfdom.
Much of the GA was spent on settlers, workers, missionaries and completing my 4 banks.
The second GA ended at 391, when I was nearing Steam power (393).
A turn before the GA ended, I switched to Caste system for the extra hammer on workshops. It can be debated if mercantilism is better, but I already had my engineer (see GP appendix in a few lines), so hammers rule.
I don't remember what exactly I was building at this point apart from more settlers and 2-3 levees.
Notre Dam and Hanging gardens started, but finished only at 430 and 428 respectively (part 5 of the game).
When Steel was discovered, I started on Ironworks even without Mining Co.. it is a large project anyway, each hammer counts.
After discovering Railroad at 411, I started a third GA (2GP) at turn 412.
I started this GA because I could, and because it was important to rush to Corporation, establish Mining Co, and spread it through executives FAST.
All this while keeping the economy intact somehow..
I didn't get an extra GA from quests so I also did it to not fall behind.
At 421, 9 turns into the GA, I discovered Corporation, and at 422 Established the Mining Co headquarters, ending part 4 of the game story!!!
Coming ahead - economically stressful times with Corporation.
Spreading it included many 0% science turns and reliance on banks already built.
WallSt will start after 2-3 executives are produced and will eventually (and ironically..) save the economy! (when completed at 451)
Appendix about Great People:
I'll describe what I got (in order of appearance) and then explain my plan.
[GP with asterisk are born with less than 100% certainty of their type]
- 180 - Scientist builds academy in Cap.
- 305 - Artist (from Music) waits to start the first GA (315).
- 318 * - Scientist born in Nat. I get enough scientists later on, so I sent this one to do a second academy, in Nat. I think it is worth it, with the ~20 scientists that Nat will have..
- 340 * - Engineer born in Nat. YEY!!!!!! He will found Mining Co. This and astronomy are by far my largest gambles in any game on this setting.
- 376 * - Scientist born in Nat. He will wait until needed for third GA (of 2GP).
- 410 * - Merchant born in Cap. Will start the third GA in 2 turns (with the scientist from turn 376). I got him just before Economics, so I WILL have a merchant for Sushi.
- 416 - Merchant (from Economics). His traditional job is to wait and found Sushi! He will.
- 420 * - Scientist born in Nat. yet another one. for later use.
The Economics Merchant is sure to come.
The one big issue with this list is the uncertainty of the Engineer.
It is a big bet - I need him for Mining Co at turn 422.
Otherwise the game is as good as dead.. I had that
I get a sure engineer at Fusion, but that's like spitting in my strategy's face!
So I gamble.
I gamble one of those 5 asterisks is born an engineer.
4 are born in Nat and one in Cap.
No Engineer wonders fit my plan early, sadly, so I'm really left with placing constant engineers from forge and from mercantilism (in Nat) and hope for the best.
I didn't do the math here. I just try whenever possible to get those engineers up in Nat
Cap is harder to do as it favors a scientist by far, and produces only one of the 5 GP, so it is relieved from engineer duty.
The gamble becomes : 1 of 4 GP in Nat must be an engineer.
Next game, I may keep track of my chances for each to be an engineer
Appendix about Apostolic Palace :
At turn 400 (that's 500 AD for humans), I was not surprised to see the apostolic palace built by Musa. He's the kinda guy that does this.
I was surprised to find out that he was nearing religious victory, and forgot all about it!
He had several religions, and I couldn't know in advance which one he'll go for, right?
Or does the AI always go for the state religion as AP religion?
In any case, it was Hinduism, and I had only 2 hindu cities...
I checked some data online about the AP - what would bring me more votes to prevent my loss?
Well, I'm not converting to hindu, but the other route is big cities with hindu in them.
So, I built a few hindu missionaries from the cities that were hindu, spread hinduism a bit and relax.
I should remember for future games that it can happen..
OTOH, I did went on to give most cities hindu temples for the 2 hammers
Part 5 - Getting to MAX power for the space race (turns 422 - 508)
Goal :
This part is all about achieving the maximum power I can have before spaceship parts start coming in.
Production wise, it's adding to the Mining Co with factories, coal plants and Industrial Parks.
Science wise, it's Labs ASAP.
For all this to work, the cities must grow to an enormous size fast. Sushi.
From here on I diverted from the original PDF plan.
I would have gone directly to Sushi, but breaking the Scientific Method barrier will obsolete my great library and there's still one tech I need badly - Assembly Line to start the factories and coal plants and be ready to really BUILD.
I am not certain this is the right choice, but that's my favorite, even before sushi.
So the tech plan becomes : Assembly Line, Scientific Method, beeline for Medicine for Sushi, then for Superconductors for Labs.
I end with Industrialization for the Aluminum and Ind. Park. and communism to start a 4th GA.
Main events :
- 428 - Free Market
- 428 - Hanging Gardens
- 430 - Notre Dam
- 443 - Assembly Line
- 451 - Ironworks and WallSt
- 471 - National Park
- 473 - Medicine
- 474 - Sushi
- 492 - Broadway
- 494 - Ankor Wat
- 498 - Superconductors
- 504 - Industrialization
- 507 - Communism
- 508 - GA4 starts (3GP)
Tech front :
443 - Assembly Line.
For Factories and coal plants, of course
It took me a long while to get there because of the Mining Co expansion drain on my economy.
WallSt is built at turn 451 and there will almost always be 100% science turns from there on.
454 - Scientific Method.
All mainland workers go to preserve forests at Nat, waiting for it to build the National Park.
Oil is NOT needed nor connected.
463 - Biology.
Build National Park in Nat, and make it the city with 20 specialists it deserves to be!
473 - Medicine.
Finally. Sushi incorporated at 474. When fully active, all mainland cities (besides a polar one) will grow every 2-3 turns
Sushi is a lot of culture, so I'm super-aware of where it should not go, since borders are important on a Duel world.
Mining Co went everywhere
480 - Physics. Nothing in it but a great scientist.
484 - Electricity. +2 commerce on watermills
490 - Refregiration.
Supermarkets. I build them on most cities.. what the heck, I have the build power and it makes me grow even faster!
498 - Superconductors.
Labs. The final piece of the science.. eh, puzzle. and they come with no culture and spaceship parts bonus. A real treat.
I build them all over.
504 - Industrialization.
Even these polluting insustrial parks are no match for sushi growth. build them on mainland!
507 - Communism.
For the great spy, since I have to get into a 4th GA now. and I'm still with 2 GP waiting for a third.
At 508, I start the 4th GA.
Story front :
We start in 422, the 10th turn of the 3rd GA.
Mining Co has just been incorporated. I now expand it with executives ASAP.
Since I'm in a GA, I soon switch to Free Market (425) to lower corporation costs.
At 428, I finally pay off a bet with Musa and build the Hanging Gardens he didn't.
I have all my cities founded (except Crab), and it's still before sushi.
It's the only situation where it is really worth my effort to build the Hanging Gardens.
I may be repeating events but trying to add sense here...
At 430, I complete Notre Dam to be happy
At 436, my golden age ends - before factories, but after Mining Co. has expanded to nearly all cities.
At 443, Assembly Line. Factories and coal plants for all! Except Nat. It will wait for a hydro plant. After these are done, cities can build whatever they need very fast.
They will build all they need, and when nearly all are done building, I will finally let go of Organized religion and go for free religion.
At 451, both Ironworks and WallSt are complete.
I can place Ironworks on wealth soon to balance nearly everybody else when needed!
All my cities are now building like crazy, golden age or not. (not, currently)
At 471, National Park ready with 12 forests preserves, 2 corn, 6.. other tiles! soon with sushi!
At 473, Medicine. This means 474 is Sushi time.
Sushi wins games. It grows your cities fast to incredible size if you have enough resources.
I had more last game, but this game I had "only" 30 food from sushi. and 36 production from Mining Co (looking at victory save..)
Since Sushi is now spread and growing my cities fast, I built Broadway at 492.
I also decided to do Ankor Wat (494) since they enable to get more builders out (priests).
At 498, Superconductors. Labs pop (nearly) everywhere.
At 504, Industrialization - the final push for hammers with industrial parks.
Now I only need a 4th GA to speed everything up and hope I have enough GP for a 5th.
To get it now, I have to go for Communism for the spy alone, and it is done in 507.
My 4th GA (3GP) starts at 508, with intentions of part 6 to be drilling science hard - to Apollo, and then build ship parts.
I now have all the buildings I need to build, research, and generally rule
Appendix : Handling Musa (Emancipation)
All my relationship with Musa is built on fear of Emanciption. :|
I'm trying to prevent the horrible scenario I had in my previous game ("game 2"), where I gave Musa too much and he went for emancipation, wrecking my plans for orderly masses of scientists
He seems to always want to do this, so I measure the techs I give him, and only give them (for money) when he's in the last few turns. Near the end I give him the finger.
He also steals my techs, the MF. (M is not for Mansa, and F is not for finger)
I actually had to counterespionage a few times and build 2-3 jails!
He took my jobs!
I did allow him to reach Emancipation 5 turns before victory... what d'ya want? I was testing limits and AIs and stuff.. go away!
Last edited:
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
Part 6 - Race for space (turns 508 - 559)
This is the part I always can't do quite right.
I really tried to do better, but reached the launch 5 TAE (turns after Ecology).
Goal :
Do I have to say it? Finish the damn ship and launch ASAP.
First is to get to Apollo, then to Satellites, to Fusion, and finally Genetics and Ecology.
I planned so the ending would be Fusion, Genetics, Ecology - a decreasing amount of hammers required for space parts.
The corresponding space parts (2 engines first, stasis, life support) require 9600, 9600, 7200, 3000 hammers respectively.
This is actual project size, with Alum/copper bonus thought of.
I could also chop down about half the stasis and Life support, but only 1-2 forests in cities building the damn engines.
The engines were just too big, and held the whole race back until their completion at 5 TAE.
Less forests needed to be cut on the stasis and life support as a result.
Should those living preserved forests make me feel happy?
They did not make me feel happy. 5 TAE
Main events :
508 - GA4 starts (with the communism spy, remember?)
510 - Free religion.
514 - Rocketry, Apollo started.
522 - Apollo complete.
527 - Satellites
532 - GA4 ends
548 - Fusion
549 - GA5 starts (late).
551 - Genetics
553 - Ecology (the logs are always one turn early for techs..)
559 - Send spaceship!
Tech front :
Since I get next to nothing from these techs apart from ship parts, this will be a quick recount -
Rifling + Artillery + Rocketry are done at 514. Apollo can start.
Combustion + Plastics + Radio + Satellites are done at 527. [plastics gives Nat its' hydro plant]
Composites + Laser + Fiber Optics + Fission + Fusion done at 548.
Genetics at 551.
Ecology at 553.
Story front :
This whole part is just one big micromanagement mayhem for the cities to produce more of what they need.
More science for a city which is building wealth/science, more production for a city which is building a space part.
An example of needed micromanagement is Iron, the Ironworks city.
When not doing anything (doing science/wealth), it can build science better working a 5 hammer workshop tile than with a scientist This is because of Ironworks, and does not happen in other cities.
Since nearly all buildings are already built at the start of the GA (508), I move to Free Religion at 510.
This was planned ahead, and many missionaries went to propagate religions so that each city has 3-4 religions.
Now I can enjoy the 10% science boost from free religion too. And the happiness.
At 514 I start with Apollo. 8 turns
The sciences and space parts ahead are quite boring, but still managed to fail twice :
Once to get the correct GP to start my 5th GA (with 4 GP).
Had to wait from 532 until Fusion at 548. shaking my head all the way.
The second time I failed is the 5 TAE launch, but I don't know how to fix that yet.
I went for Fiber Optics through Laser and not through Computers to keep my priests powerful with Ankor Wat. It is debatable if this is the right choice.
It's really a small amount of science, for a small amount of hammers..
I also pre-chop everything to get ready for the last 4 ship parts.
I don't remember which, but I did use a GP or 2 for bulbing a science.
Much less than usual, but I had to save most of my GP for my 5th and last GA
If got into the 5th GA only with Fusion.
In the end, it were the engines that couldn't do it fast enough. SAD! (2 puns in one sentence)
Launch was done at 559.
Part 7 - Race for some more score and fun (turns 559 - 589)
Yes, this is the last 30 turns. Never understood what exactly is best for score, so I build all the world wonders (do national count too??) except Eiffel tower and Sistine chapel.
Eiffel and Sistine give too much culture, to all cities.. I do them on the very last turn, not even knowing if they count.
I also do all sciences and get 2 future techs before the game is over.
2 F.T. give 2 more happiness and 2 more health, and allow me to grow my cities to even bigger size.. for points
Recycling plants help a lot too, and are the first thing most cities build after launch.
When I see a city cannot grow in size until ship arrival (at 589), I stop it's growth and maximize science
======================================== GAME REPORT END!
Any remarks on my game report would be appreciated
Booga. Out.
This is the part I always can't do quite right.
I really tried to do better, but reached the launch 5 TAE (turns after Ecology).
Goal :
Do I have to say it? Finish the damn ship and launch ASAP.
First is to get to Apollo, then to Satellites, to Fusion, and finally Genetics and Ecology.
I planned so the ending would be Fusion, Genetics, Ecology - a decreasing amount of hammers required for space parts.
The corresponding space parts (2 engines first, stasis, life support) require 9600, 9600, 7200, 3000 hammers respectively.
This is actual project size, with Alum/copper bonus thought of.
I could also chop down about half the stasis and Life support, but only 1-2 forests in cities building the damn engines.
The engines were just too big, and held the whole race back until their completion at 5 TAE.
Less forests needed to be cut on the stasis and life support as a result.
Should those living preserved forests make me feel happy?
They did not make me feel happy. 5 TAE
Main events :
508 - GA4 starts (with the communism spy, remember?)
510 - Free religion.
514 - Rocketry, Apollo started.
522 - Apollo complete.
527 - Satellites
532 - GA4 ends
548 - Fusion
549 - GA5 starts (late).
551 - Genetics
553 - Ecology (the logs are always one turn early for techs..)
559 - Send spaceship!
Tech front :
Since I get next to nothing from these techs apart from ship parts, this will be a quick recount -
Rifling + Artillery + Rocketry are done at 514. Apollo can start.
Combustion + Plastics + Radio + Satellites are done at 527. [plastics gives Nat its' hydro plant]
Composites + Laser + Fiber Optics + Fission + Fusion done at 548.
Genetics at 551.
Ecology at 553.
Story front :
This whole part is just one big micromanagement mayhem for the cities to produce more of what they need.
More science for a city which is building wealth/science, more production for a city which is building a space part.
An example of needed micromanagement is Iron, the Ironworks city.
When not doing anything (doing science/wealth), it can build science better working a 5 hammer workshop tile than with a scientist
This is because of Ironworks, and does not happen in other cities.Since nearly all buildings are already built at the start of the GA (508), I move to Free Religion at 510.
This was planned ahead, and many missionaries went to propagate religions so that each city has 3-4 religions.
Now I can enjoy the 10% science boost from free religion too. And the happiness.
At 514 I start with Apollo. 8 turns
The sciences and space parts ahead are quite boring, but still managed to fail twice :
Once to get the correct GP to start my 5th GA (with 4 GP).
Had to wait from 532 until Fusion at 548. shaking my head all the way.
The second time I failed is the 5 TAE launch, but I don't know how to fix that yet.
I went for Fiber Optics through Laser and not through Computers to keep my priests powerful with Ankor Wat. It is debatable if this is the right choice.
It's really a small amount of science, for a small amount of hammers..
I also pre-chop everything to get ready for the last 4 ship parts.
I don't remember which, but I did use a GP or 2 for bulbing a science.
Much less than usual, but I had to save most of my GP for my 5th and last GA
If got into the 5th GA only with Fusion.
In the end, it were the engines that couldn't do it fast enough. SAD! (2 puns in one sentence)
Launch was done at 559.
Part 7 - Race for some more score and fun (turns 559 - 589)
Yes, this is the last 30 turns. Never understood what exactly is best for score, so I build all the world wonders (do national count too??) except Eiffel tower and Sistine chapel.
Eiffel and Sistine give too much culture, to all cities.. I do them on the very last turn, not even knowing if they count.
I also do all sciences and get 2 future techs before the game is over.
2 F.T. give 2 more happiness and 2 more health, and allow me to grow my cities to even bigger size.. for points
Recycling plants help a lot too, and are the first thing most cities build after launch.
When I see a city cannot grow in size until ship arrival (at 589), I stop it's growth and maximize science
======================================== GAME REPORT END!
Any remarks on my game report would be appreciated
Booga. Out.
Last edited:
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
Ok, long story told.
Now I'm planning on another such game with Pacal.
I want to be happy with the game, and only then move to Huayna Capac and try as industrious.
This time I hope for better quests and want cottages in my capital, which ideally would be full of floodplains and grasslands on river.
This may speed up science significantly, making my third game (the last one, with the story) obsolete.
I know I can do better. Especially the start and the ending GA. and please more food.
The tech plan file was updated, and the current version attached here.
I also use a printed tech tree I made, it's the basic set from :
https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/tech-tree-versions-and-discussion.646677/
If you want to see how it looks, I recommend it over the dumb F6 tech tree.
Booga.
Now I'm planning on another such game with Pacal.
I want to be happy with the game, and only then move to Huayna Capac and try as industrious.
This time I hope for better quests and want cottages in my capital, which ideally would be full of floodplains and grasslands on river.
This may speed up science significantly, making my third game (the last one, with the story) obsolete.
I know I can do better. Especially the start and the ending GA. and please more food.
The tech plan file was updated, and the current version attached here.
I also use a printed tech tree I made, it's the basic set from :
https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/tech-tree-versions-and-discussion.646677/
If you want to see how it looks, I recommend it over the dumb F6 tech tree.
Booga.
Dynamic
But not hurry
boogaboo
Josef Popper 4ever
Hey, Dynamic!
Got back to playing too?
Remember when we were young?
Got back to playing too?
Remember when we were young?
