Booga games diar..rhea

Hey, Dynamic!
Got back to playing too? :)
Remember when we were young? :smoke:
No, I didn't open Civ4 for 8 years... and don't remember details. Still play Civ5 PBEM with a small community, Civ 6 pass.
But I was subscribed for this thread so enjoyed by reading it. :)
 
Good to be in touch.
I was wondering who likes to read these things ;)
Sometimes I feel like I'm giving thought material to some future AI, since no human would care.

In these 7-8 years, I still mainly handle my anxiety issues and try to relax, but also wanted to check out many other games (even a small period on civ5), but now I'm in love again.
With Civ4, who would have guessed? :love:

Go on and enjoy what you enjoy, we're all different! :hug:

Booga. Out.:thumbsup:
 
I think I solved my space parts issue :)
I've pushed Satellites and Composites after Fusion!
So the end is Fusion, Satellites, Composites, Genetics, ecology.

This is only possible because I can choose Computers over Laser for Fiber Optics. I didn't have (almost) any reason to choose computers until I saw this.
This means enough time for the engines, engineer will come a bit sooner, and only 2 cities in the end would have to chop wood in theory (for genetics and ecology parts).
Why in theory? because 5 other cities will still have to work very hard to complete the 5 casings in time. They will have around 5-7 turns.. still would end up at 2-3 TAE, which is much better.
The one clear way I can see to do it 1 TAE is to gamble on less than 5 castings. Still 30 years I think, but not 100% it will get there ;)

Attached my new plan!

I also fixed the bad calculation for the ship parts.. it's now in base hammers.
The bonuses are :
100% (normal production)
+25% forge
+25% factory
+50% power
+50% labs
[+50% on parts where Copper/Alum give bonus]

So a city gets a 2.5 multiplier, or a 3 multiplier if Copper/Alum are involved [Iron gets a 3.5 or 4 respectively]
If we exclude the Ironworks city, 2.5/3 multipliers should apply to all other cities building space parts.
So if a space part costs 3600 and needs Aluminum, it actually costs 3600/3 = 1200 base hammers.
This is important to know the actual size of space parts and how many forests are needed for each.

A sumup of base hammers ("true" price) needed in all cities except Iron :
Thrusters/Castings - 1200
Cockpit - 1000
Engine - 1920
Docking - 2000
Stasis - 1440
Life support - 1000

Now I can actually try finding a game :)
Booga.
 

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Thank you, Kaitzilla, really glad to hear :)
Never wrote so much except perhaps in this thread, years ago.

It took my whole energy for a few days, but I felt compelled to do it.
I tried to organize my game, but I keep wanting to edit parts I wrote...
That's not healthy, the mistakes of the past should be reckoned with and stay written, however bad they are.
And that game itself wasn't really perfect, but writing it organized my neurotic thoughts :)

Happy you (and others) enjoy it.
I'm still trying to find a good start.
Lack of stone on main Terra continent is too common :(
Food in the middle of the continent is too uncommon, but I guess that's Asia for you ;)

I didn't write this before, but I currently think Terra may be the only good map to do ANY Duel Space race.
Just because it is larger. I actually have space after 15-16 cities, where I once tried to cram 10-11 not to go over the domination limit.

EDIT : Not to bother other threads, but I see no HoF update for 2 months.. just a few games submitted or something else..?

Booga. Doing something.
 
You can have about a dozen more cities on Terra. The number of available tiles becomes irrelevant when you go for corp, thus you should settle as many cities as posssible. Single-tile islands are the best, because they add only 1 unit of land while corps have the same effect. Care to fill all the gaps too, they add no land at all.

There were a lot of games submitted over last two months. I think there will be update this weekend, Noble Zarkon probably was too busy to do it last month.
 
Hi :)

You can have about a dozen more cities on Terra. The number of available tiles becomes irrelevant when you go for corp, thus you should settle as many cities as posssible. Single-tile islands are the best, because they add only 1 unit of land while corps have the same effect. Care to fill all the gaps too, they add no land at all.
I find myself not in trouble with the domination limit since producing a settler for every location I CAN occupy becomes counter productive at some point.
It is a space race, so I rather place cities where there are 2 or more resources (ones I don't have or are corporation related).
If there's only one resource, I let it go. No settler needed. Then focus on what really matters at that point - the last segments of the race.
And yes, small Islands can be awesome ;)
[mimicking colbert..==>] Sometimes, audience, sometimes I like to build such a Island city with lots of fish, and give it sushi and mining co. And then, just when it's about to pass 30 pop, I also give it the globe theater :) or Moai :) depending what's planned for my capital..

There were a lot of games submitted over last two months. I think there will be update this weekend, Noble Zarkon probably was too busy to do it last month.
Just glad to know the important people ( :bowdown: ) behind the cogs and wheels are not falling apart.
I'm a happy banana :banana:
 
Just finished a game at 1350 AD , cutting 19 turns from the last record (1388AD game above).
Same slot and setting.
Will tell the story soon, but not now :p
Now I go be a human for a few hours with my friend in front of the TV. :cool:
Then to sleep. And tomorrow.. we'll see!

Booga.
 
Well done! I haven't dabbled too much with smaller maps. One point worth considering is pre-chopping the last part or two. That's another way of saying that launching the ship during a golden age isn't necessary. The last golden age can expire and the last part, pre-chopped, will finish in normal time since forest chops don't get any golden age bonus.

On larger maps on lower levels, Darius is better than Pacal but Asoka looks to be better than Darius. Even Zara might be able to outperform Darius. (Asoka beats Zara.)
 
One point worth considering is pre-chopping the last part or two. That's another way of saying that launching the ship during a golden age isn't necessary.
I did chop wood - a bit on the Genetics part and a lot on Ecology :) got there 2 TAE this time!

I like to understand the smallest example of a problem/system to understand it and then go to larger examples.
This is why Duel is sufficient (and less of a headache) and I'm still quite a noob militarily... I started at the lowest level, moving up.
In Civ3 I knew military good too. In Civ4 I also used it, but not as much and it was another decade...

Now starting to write the story of my 1350AD game on notepad, will post later.
Booga, livinalie!
 
Hello, peoploids.

This is the story post for the game of 1350 AD space race on Duel, Noble, with Pacal on Terra.
I'm not going to pass over each tech like last time, but I will name important checkpoints.
It will be more of a chronological story :)

The strategy page I used was finally very good, and is the one posted on post 143.
The tech order I used relates to the tech order on that page unless I say so :p
And I always can be off by one turn.. these game dates are frustrating.


Game story:


Chapter 1: Non-Humble beginnings (0-99)

I wanted to find a place with more cottages than last time, and was looking for a flood plains and river location, but some map starts are irresistible.. and I will still have my cottages, not the sea capital of last game.

Here is my.. "victory shot" of the starting location.
Cap is on the left, Nat on the mid-right, both identifiable by their sea clams.
Forbidden is on the right, Iron is on the bottom and Wall(Street) on the top, with a filler city in the upper left.

1350AD.jpg



At turn 8, I conquered Ghandi. Delhi is renamed to Nat (national epic and national park city).
I looked at both my cities, and they were both exactly fit for their job.. with plenty of food to play with.
They looked as beautiful as if I have given birth to twins, and they both seem too smart to be true..

From this time on, I took micromanagement super-seriously to have a good game and not mess up the start.
It's hard to take a game seriously at the start, when all the gambles are still ahead.
Stone, Oracle, Astronomy, Engineer. and random quests.

I had marble in Cap and was looking for huts, Musa and stone.
Found Musa in a good location (for me) but still no stone, not much money or techs from the huts, but I will pump up those fishing ships and granaries.
I will build a library in the capital ASAP.
Nat will have it's granary and fishing boats and prepare to whip workers when alphabet brings slavery around.
I don't remember if I got any techs from a hut - the entire game.
They were generally a big disappointment.

I did not find stone on my continent, but I loved the land I have, especially my 2 cities.
I was willing to do many things to keep this game alive. My issue is now stone.

Even before alphabet, since there's no stone on my continent, I knew I'll have to venture early into the small islands surrounding it.
I do it for the stone, for more huts, and to get a wider look around and plan city placements.

At turn 99, Alphabet. Sciences exchanged.

Chapter 2: Stone(r) Crisis :smoke:and religion bad luck (100-180)

At turn 108, revolution : slavery + Org. rel.
I did not yet have a religion, but doing 2 civics at once shortens the 2-civic change from 4 to 3 turns of anarchy.
Also, with 2 only small cities, Organized Religion does not cost more.

My first double-worker whip on Nat was not of 2 workers, but of a worker and then galley to check the islands.
The galley would go all around with a warrior, but would find no stone :(
This was the first critical moment in the game.
I NEVER play without stone. I know it always f***s me up not to have it.
I stopped and opened the PDF manual.
Searched for any national or world wonder that require stone. Anything I need?
Yes. 3 things. Oxford, Notre Dam, Hanging Gardens. 50% bonus.

Notre Dam and Hanging Gardens are done late in the game when I have a Mining Co to build with.
Oxford is the only issue. It is important to do it ASAP, the first part of the game is a race for it.
But hey, my capital is (was) surrounded by forests! I think I can chop some more and live with it.
So... no stone needed!!! yey!
Many no-stone maps will become playable with this revelation.
This does not mean I will allow Musa to have stone, but no stone is ok.

At around turn 130-132 I placed 2 scientists in Cap to produce the first great scientist.
At turn 145, Currency.

Next, I need settlers. 3, In fact, but 2 are urgent. I'm building/chopping to build them, but not whipping this time.
Whipping my huge-food-surplus cities for settlers seems just wrong.
I want to do it with forges, but don't have them yet.

I normally go for Metal casting now, and I did start it, but then I had a situational issue that would cut turns off my game :(
Musa was going for Code of Laws, and I did not want to have to do philosophy for a religion.
So I found no solution but to switch to learning Code of Laws first, which delayed the much needed Metal casting.

Before Code of Laws, I placed cities 3 and 4 (Iron and Wall).
With 4 cities, I can now plan for Oxford and for Forbidden.

At 166, Code of Laws was discovered (at Wall, giving the city its' name).
The religious revolution was done (Confucianism) and missionaries were added to building queues.

At 173, I saw Musa studying Agriculture... Wait, I don't have agriculture at this point? no irrigation? OMG!
So many fish and pig and cow and.. didn't need a single irrigation and didn't have it yet. lol.
Got it from him at 175.

Chapter 3: Science power to Capital - Forge to Oxford (181-262)

At 181, Metal casting, finally.
At 182, My first great scientist builds an academy in Cap, and finally remove the 2 scientists in Cap to work those tiles like all the other ancient people!

I mainly start working the cottages and grow Cap now - but this would still be considered late in a game with flood plains to start working the cottages.

With my new-found forges, I can now build - lighthouses are first, but wait - Cap has 2 religions to do monasteries with.
That's 20% more! and I reach Scientific method very late.
And I also built another settler.

At 207, Civil Service and immediately, my last anarchy - 2 turns - for bureaucracy. 50% more commerce and hammers in Cap.
Once I reached Civil Service, I could now afford a city a bit further from my capital.

I immediately (turn 207) settled my settler in the far side of the continent to become my forbidden palace city.
It will build granary, forge, courthouse, and chop the hell out while on wealth and wait to build forbidden when it is possible.
Will need 4 courts and 8 cities, so it will come much later.

My other 2 weak cities (Iron and Wall) are now racing to have a library and prepare for doing university fast.
Cap had time to build something before education comes, so it progressed on the great lighthouse.
Nat is building the Oracle.
Researching Paper.

At turn 225, Paper + Oracle => Education !
Musa didn't beat me to Oracle, again :thumbsup:
All go for universities. Except forbidden, it will mind it's own business :nono:
Cap will finish its' university fast and will have enough power to finish the great lighthouse at 243, and then build wealth and pre-chop most of Oxford.
At turn 252, Feudalism checkpoint.
At 262, Oxford.
Somewhat late, but I had some constraints I can't remember, I think it was Wall completing university late.
Now science is pumping good at over +200% in Cap.

Chapter 4: Sailing to America until Mining Co (263-406)

At 275, Optics. Building my Caravel and getting a missionary ready to hop on that caravel.
At 280, Great library completed at Nat.
I didn't write when the National epic was completed. A few turns before 300 I guess.

I'm never sure Great Library is better at Nat for more GP or at Cap for the science. It's an open discussion..
An academy was also set up in Nat at 297 so the scientist are not useless.

Now we reach the Astronomy gamble.
The caravel is sent for the new continent, wanting to pop Astronomy from a hut.
I receive maps, I receive... a spit in the face :cry:
I lost this gamble this time. But not willing to quit the game because of one setback.

It will be only much later, after I've lost hope of another hut, at turn 339, when I finally learn Astronomy with the help of one of the many great scientists I'll receive this game.

At turn 296, in perfect harmony, Maus of Maus and Banking are complete.
At turn 297, I start my first GA and move to Mercantilism and serfdom. It's worker madness time. and great engineer hopes.
I built many workers, settlers, missionaries and courthouses on this GA.
Main expansion is starting now.
I also received the Blessed Sea quest.

At turn 319, I succeed to reach Constitution on my last GA turn and switch to Representation (320).
At turn 320, soon after founding my 6th city, I also found cities 7 and 8.

Around turn 330-335, the Forbidden Palace is built (can't see from game log :( )
I became worried about the great engineer failing to appear so far.

At turn 364, I finished the Blessed sea quest and chose to get a great prophet this time.
He built the religious special building in Wall that turn ("King-Kong-Miau-Miau-Want-Milk?").
And yes, Wall is building bank, grocer, market. (Expecting WallSt when 3 other banks will be built and corporation discovered)

At that same turn, I built the Taj Mahal and entered the 2nd GA at 365.
A few turns later, at 370, I'll move to Caste system for the workshop hammer over worker speed of Serfdom.
The workers are ok at this point and I'm nearing Steam Power anyway.

At turn 382, Steam Power. I won't have many levees, and I'll mostly wait Mining Co. to help build them.
The current Goal is Mining Co. and no engineer in sight. I'm now terrified.
This is THE gamble I can't lose.

At turn 395, it is becoming too late for my great engineer.
This is a full blown Engineer crisis.
I'm 2 turns from Liberalism for Railroad and then Economics and Corporation for Mining Co.
How can I possibly get my engineer in time?!
I have to gamble on my next 2 great people to bring me an engineer.

I can produce a GP in cap and soon after race with Nat for another shot, although a bit late.
It's game on or not. All or nothing.
The plan is that Cap is nearing a GP that I can speed up to come in time for Corporation, and a GP from Nat soon after that if I miss the first one.
To be able to do this in time for Mining Co, I MUST get into a 3rd GA to speed GP birth.
To speed it up even further, I go into Pacifism. Everything I can do.
I then forced my capital to remove cottages tiles for more specialists to make it in time.

At turn 397, Liberalism ==> Railroad.
At turn 405, Corporation and.... Great Engineer available at 406 in Cap!!!!!!!!!!!!
The stage is set for a record! Oh yes!
Mining Co founded that same turn - Bring me my hammers, thy sweatshops are all mine, thy profits mine, my kingdom divine!
I spread mining Co to ALL cities.

Looking back at the great engineer probability -
I wrote an estimate of some of the percentages I had for great engineer (sometimes forgot to look and write) -
~50% (first Nat GP with engineer constantly out, but with great library built)
22% (Nat)
21% (Nat)
15% (Nat)
30% (at Cap, when I got it).

So the chance of NOT getting a great engineer is around 0.5*0.78*0.79*0.85*0.7 = 18.33%.
One in 5 games I will not get my great engineer (when trying hard to get it). That's still a good gamble.


Chapter 4: Time to build (until all is... well, built) (407-500)


The road is now clear.
I switch to slavery just for 5 turns to whip some cities that mining co will take time to get to.
And I even whip Executives, since Wall is still a small ugly city and Mining Co is founded there.

At 411, I go back to Organized Religion, Caste System, and now also Free Market, as Mining Co expands.
This is the last expansion stage, both of cities and executives, so scientific progress is slow.
I will have half my cities off my main continent for their resources for Mining and Sushi.
Oh, and I now have stone on the new world continent :)

At turn 425, Assembly line.
Factories and Coal plants for all except Nat! (Nat will wait for plastics to have power)

At 435, Scientific Method. Workers preserve forests.
At 441, Notre Dam, since I'm expecting sushi soon.
At 447, Biology. I have only 2 (!!!) not-on-a-resource irrigations.
Biology ONLY means Nat can have its' National Park!

Preparing for Sushi, I built the Hanging Gardens in 449, Ironworks and National Park at 456.

At 459, Medicine + Wall Street complete, and at 460, Sushi !!!
Sushi is much easier to spread since I don't go spreading it everywhere. It has tons of culture.
Main continent and the Moai Island are more than enough.

Important economic/city-management note :
I had many puny, very small (6-9), nearly useless cities with workshops all around them.
They were small, but had nothing to about do until now - they couldn't grow without massive irrigation.
But why build a lot of irrigations? Why do we build them? for other tiles to be used for commerce or hammers.
Had I grown the cities early, they would still produce small amounts of commerce and hammers, but their maintenance cost would burden my economy and prevent fast expansion.
So I don't attempt to grow my cities.
Unless they have food resources, they should have 1-2 irrigations MAX. Wait for sushi. Then explode.
Many mainland cities were size 6-9 when sushi finally came in. But the workshops were ready :mischief:

At 461, Ankor Wat. Although soon to be obsolete, it is cheap and handy for the short term, and gives Iron more prophets.
At 473, Electricity.

At 487, Superconductors.
This is the bell. The race is on.

Build all you can before entering the last leg of the journey with MAX science with Free religion.
Labs and the final push to build everything the cities need to be functional for the space race.
Labs, Universities, Aqueducts, Grocers, supermarkets, 2 religions (only 2 reached me :( ) , 2 temples, ball courts, hospitals, theaters. Even industrial parks.

For all cities to finish this building queue (not in that order, just spewed my mind) I'll need My 4th GA.
I hoped I may have 5 (or more with quests), but I didn't.
To get the GA started, I need the Communism spy.
So I learn Communism, and start the 4th GA at 491.

At 500, when most cities are building Wealth or Science, most of the buildings are behind me.
Last revolution (in GA) to Free religion at 500! For the last 10% science we can squeeze.


Chapter 4: Space race (501-570)


Buildings are something of the past.
Wealth. Science. Apollo. Space parts.
And trying to keep happy somehow --

At 503, Rocketry.
At 511, Apollo is complete.
At 519, Broadway.
At 520, Fiber Optics.
At 522, RockNRoll.

At 523, Fusion.
Now the space parts plan comes into execution -
I look up and rank my base hammer power in all cities except Iron (which is #1).
#1(Iron) and #3 will build the engines. Iron will finish much earlier and will also build Stasis.

At 526, Satellites.
#2 will build the largest part (Docking), but it has time to do it.

At 530, Composites.
The 5 cities strongest available at this point (who are not Nat) should do the 5 Castings.
It appears that the 5 Castings finish date will determine the launch date more than anything else.
I had 5 cities pushed to their limit to do all castings in 9 turns (the actual start date of Castings construction is 531).

At 534, Genetics.
Iron has completed the engine with one turn to spare (which was used for wealth at some point).
Now it will do Stasis fast. But It can't do it fast enough. A few forests are cut (3-4) and Iron will be on time.

At 537, Ecology.
Nat started building Life Support (at 538).
I've pre-chopped all forests in Nat and placed workers to chop at 539 -
I can't finish the castings this turn, so let Nat work one turn.

At 539, I chopped Nat until I had 1 turn to Life Support :)
A quick look at F1 and F8 to see all is ok on the space parts. All one turn to complete, no part missing.

At 540, Launch! After a lot of city tiles and queues rearrangements and checks.. :)
A round launch date : 1200 AD.

For the 30 turns from now on, I went for points - larger cities, more techs and wonders :)
On 570, I win.. 1350AD


Chapter 5: Epilogue and thoughts

This was a good game. Finally.
Sushi had 42 Food.
Mining Co had 48 Hammers.

It was very good, but not great.
Could have been better with :
  • Floodplains
  • GA quests
  • Astronomy popped
  • Goody huts luck
That's what I think, and I think. Therefor I play. To occupy my thinking neurotic part.
So what can I improve/want for next game?

I want a flood plains start, and if I do that successfully, I'll then try Huayna Chapec!

About chopping Nat at the end - I should/could have another city wait with 10 forests ready for the Life Support next time.
Half-killing Nat at the end was sad. Nearly no real effect on the game, but sad to watch :(
We'll see. Having fun, can't you see? :cool:

Booga.
 
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I might have to toy with these smaller maps. Looks like fun. Sometime ago someone here posted a duel map with 18 civs as a space challenge. No dom limit. I vaguely remember it being desirable to Oracle currency ...
 
Okay. Asoka, noble, duel, highlands, thin peaks, scattered, cylindrical, marathon against Isabella and Justinian. Tech polytheism ->priesthood. Capture AI city for Hinduism ~turn 8. Warrior rush other AI ~turn 95. Capture (Buddhist) capitol and worker once its 2nd city is settled. That's 3 cities with 3+ fast workers by turn 100. Map looks big enough for 12 cities easily. (Equatorial band should fetch 5+ cities.) Probably get shrine first before academy.

Playing a game now. Hagia Sophia may work out well. So Divine Right too? Experimenting ...
 
Hey! Are you going on my slot? ;)

If so :
1. Why highlands? It's much smaller than Terra.
2.
Capture (Buddhist) capitol and worker once its 2nd city is settled
It's hard for me as Pacal to do this to Musa. He has good UU at this point, but the actual reason this is bad is for you is that you will pay for this last city and worker later -
First, only Musa shares all techs, so not choosing him will cost you with techs you don't get for free.
Also, starting a war and taking a city from an AI you will live with is bad because it will kill many other deals you may have early in the game until you get relations back on track.
He won't trade some techs, resources, gold per turn...

If you surpassed these issues, please tell me, I'd be happy to hear how.
Really happy!
I did try taking Musa's worker.
I had to gift him stuff just so he opens his borders, not to mention his techs.
I gave it up, but would love to hear solutions I'm not seeing.
Also..
 
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No not going for your slot. Highlands has more land tiles than terra. Though water tiles don't count towards limit. Stone/marble are not too hard to find. Food may be tight but AI capitols are fine.

I've gotten to turn 150ish. Oracled currency and built stonehenge/temple. I have a shrine up now too. 5-6 cities working on more. There won't be a need to trade for tech. Deciding what to do for academy. There may not be a rush for it. AI is my worst enemy. But it may be fine to gift a Hindu city later.

If one wishes to ascend to the gods, one should work on the (wor)ship.
 
No. This is a space trial. Turn 250ish. Hagia Sophia is done. So are the pyramids. Mids got done after Sophia. Working on the Hanging Gardens. 14 cities all Hindu with courthouses and most with granaries and temples. Coasting into civil service for the Apostolic Palace in my capitol. There's also UoS and Spiral Minaret to consider. Finally got a scientist for academy. Shrine was used to help fuel the REX.

Should be interesting to see how fast 14 cities can catch up. Education is a ways off yet.
 
Turn 335. Oxford done. Firing off the first golden age via scientist. This is the third scientist produced. 2nd scientist bulbed education in full due to empire size. On a larger map this would be the point where a launch could be expected in ~100 turns or a turn 435 launch for a turn 465 win. Can Asoka win by turn 500? We'll find out. I'll play this out during the week.
 
{duel, noble, space} IS the slot I'm on, so you are "testing" on it.
I hope to hear when you've landed -
If you do better than me, I'll have competition. Else, I'll just be proud ;)

Which ending are you up to? Corporations? Communism?
And.. I Oracle Education.. why use it early with such weak AI? ;)

EDIT: Just looked at players HoF.
Now I'm scared for my slot, but please do your best :)
 
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