BOTM 01 Pre-Game Discussion
- Thread starter ainwood
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I am guessing that you have Vanilla and BTS but no Warlords. Some one reported something similar with another program using the same logic. There are some assumptions built in like having all the HOF Mods (which doesn't really matter) and that if you have BTS that you would have Warlords as well (not so good 
). I'll fix it and put out a new version tomorrow sometime.Yes.
C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Beyond the Sword\
Maybe it just stops looking after a certain number of errors? In which case I would think it would be sensible to stop looking in Vanilla as soon as it finds that the HOF-1.74.002 folder doesn't exist.
I was fiddling with the FfH mod and think I might also have changed one of the BtS xml files. If so, I can't remember which and was hoping this program could figure it out for me. I guess I could always take an afternoon to reinstall and repatch. Or play something else.
Yes.
Thank you.
Just from my experience and without total authority:
1- First strikes get referred to as 'first stike chances', so I take them as extra rounds of combat that can either succeed or fail.
2- Not sure. First strike units seem to sit there for a moment before anything happens during combat. So a little pause and some sound effects is all you get.
3- I wouldn't use first strikes for defense if you have the choice. I find them useful in situations where a town I want to capture has one or two very strong units and then a number of weaker ones. Casualties are unavoidable against the strong defenders, so send in the first stikers and they at least have a good chance of taking the enemy down by a few hp's for the next guy to kill. So they're kind of kamakaze units. Sure, there are seige weapons for that, but let's say you're in a hurry...
With Oromos, unless you're going to be fighting stronger units I'd take it as a 'better than nothing' kind of thing.
Check your combat log next time you play with these units. You'll notice they often score a 'hit' before the enemy does. I think that is all there is to it.
ChrisShaffer
Board gamer
Some promotions give units "first strike chance" - in that case, they have a chance to get a first strike.
Some promotions give units "first strikes" - in that case, they get a guaranteed first strike.
A unit can have 2 first strike chances and 1 first strike. Such a unit would have 1-3 first strikes. Minimum 1, maximum 3.
Some promotions give units "first strikes" - in that case, they get a guaranteed first strike.
A unit can have 2 first strike chances and 1 first strike. Such a unit would have 1-3 first strikes. Minimum 1, maximum 3.
azzaman333
meh
First Strike units are much more likely to come out of combat without being harmed, especially if they have many first strikes and are facing a weaker unit.
ngraner42
Ultrarunner
I have only played a couple BTS games, so this was a surprise. While playing the practice game, I had 4 barbarian Spearman pop up early in the game and sacked my capital. They appeared two moves away. Having and event like this seems completely unbalancing for GOTM play.
Do you protect against the off chance it happens and thus severely weaken your game, or do you ignore it and possibly get wiped out.
Do you protect against the off chance it happens and thus severely weaken your game, or do you ignore it and possibly get wiped out.
@Jasonc
I am no expert in first strikes, but I'll try to help.
In a normal combat round your unit or his unit "loses" and gets damaged.
In a first-strike-combat-round one of the unit "loses". If it is the first-striker, it is not damaged. If it is the other unit, it gets damaged as usual.
What's the value of this promotion? I don't really know, but in my experience it is roughly equivalent to Combat1. It is a general promotion that serves in all battles, just like combat1.
If you know you will use a unit for defense, it is best to give it a specific promotion like CG1. If you know your unit will attack sometimes, defend sometimes, then take combat1 or Drill1.
I have read that, when your ar at the offensive, taking a lot of cities, you should use first strikers as mop up units, because they will win without losing a single HP so you won't have to stop for healing.
I am no expert in first strikes, but I'll try to help.
In a normal combat round your unit or his unit "loses" and gets damaged.
In a first-strike-combat-round one of the unit "loses". If it is the first-striker, it is not damaged. If it is the other unit, it gets damaged as usual.
What's the value of this promotion? I don't really know, but in my experience it is roughly equivalent to Combat1. It is a general promotion that serves in all battles, just like combat1.
If you know you will use a unit for defense, it is best to give it a specific promotion like CG1. If you know your unit will attack sometimes, defend sometimes, then take combat1 or Drill1.
I have read that, when your ar at the offensive, taking a lot of cities, you should use first strikers as mop up units, because they will win without losing a single HP so you won't have to stop for healing.
about first strikes,
oromos with 5+ Xp can get drill IV, and have 4-7 first strikes.
Sure, it's not as good as CR3+combat1, but it's certainly worth more than drill 2 combat 2.
Why? because it's extremely likely that those 4 to 7 free rounds of combat will do some harm.
If you read through the combat explained article, you will undestand why it's such a big deal.
oromos with 5+ Xp can get drill IV, and have 4-7 first strikes.
Sure, it's not as good as CR3+combat1, but it's certainly worth more than drill 2 combat 2.
Why? because it's extremely likely that those 4 to 7 free rounds of combat will do some harm.
If you read through the combat explained article, you will undestand why it's such a big deal.
azzaman333
meh
I think the uprisings were moved to a spot where they are managable if you haven't tempted fate by leaving your cities vulnerable.
Right, its even better - it works on defense too.
Also i believe, every first strike has a 50% to go off, not granting 4 free rounds of combat automatically.
But who cares, being Musketmen they have a 95% chance to be skipped entirely in favour of Riflemen.
in other news, have quests been enabled/disabled?
Try this one: AssetChecker v2.0.1.zip. You will still get the messages about the Vanilla HOF Mod files but it should skip over Warlords now and show BTS files.
P.S. You really should turn on Private Messages in your profile, so we can take this offline and not clutter up the pregame thread.
ngraner42
Ultrarunner
The barb event occurred with the HOF mod, but it was rather late. The defense was fairly light, I was just experimenting, but is seems like people who take the risk of not heavily defending, and avoid the event, will have a large advantage over those who resort to measures such as sending out two good defenders with every settler. But, if you gamble and loose, its wait to weeks for the next game.
I see lots of questions and claims about first strikes in this thread, only half of which are true. Here's a rundown of how it really works.
What is a first strike?
To understand that you must first understand what a combat round is. When two units face off, they do so in a number of combat rounds until one of them has lost all its hit points. In each combat round, a random number determines which of the units hit the other for damage. If two units of exactly equal strengths are fighting, it's 50-50 who hits the other. If one has 3x the strength of the other, chances are 3:1 who hits the other, etc. The unit that loses the combat round takes damage, how much is also determined by a comparison of the unit strengths (see the article on combat for the full story). A battle is a sequence of combat rounds ending when one unit dies.
With the knowledge of what a combat round is, we can now define what a first strike is. A first strike is a combat round in which only one of the units, the one with the first strike, can damage the other. Everything is calculated exactly the same as a normal combat round, except that if the random number indicates a win for the other unit, no one takes damage. So a first strike is a free chance to damage your opponent, before he gets the chance to hit you at all.
Note though that it's not free damage to your opponent. You get a chance to hit him, and if you miss you don't do any damage. If your unit with strength 3 attacks his unit with strength 30, you're not likely to get anything out of your first strikes at all. Only difference from the normal combat that follows is that he can't strike back.
How many first strikes do you get in a battle?
This of course depends on your skills and promotions. An archer with the Drill I promotion has 1 first strike and 1 first strike chance. This means you will get 1-2 first strikes in each battle, where the exact number is determined by a flat distribution. A flat distribution means that each number is equally likely to happen. It's is not a 50% chance for each first strike chance, which would result in a normal distribution. If you have 3 first strikes and 4 first strike chances, you are equally likely to get 3 as you are to get 7.
If both units have first strikes, both roll to see how many they would get, and the one who rolled the highest number gets to do the difference. E.g. one unit has 1 first strike and another has 2 first strikes, the second will get one first strike round in combat. If one unit has 1-4 first strikes and rolls 4 and another has 3-8 first strikes and rolls 3, the first one will get one first strike round in combat. Etc.
So what does this mean for my chances in combat?
Like Lexad says, first strikes usually help a stronger unit get even stronger. If your strength is higher than the opponent's strength, that's far more important than if you have a first strike or not. But if you are stronger already, your survival chances can increase dramatically, since the opponent can't damage you during those first rounds. Archers fortified in towns on hills with Drill IV will withstand a lot more attacks than those without. But likely City Defender is still better for that particular purpose, since it's specialized. I have no exact numbers to back this up though, it's simple gut feeling.
What is a first strike?
To understand that you must first understand what a combat round is. When two units face off, they do so in a number of combat rounds until one of them has lost all its hit points. In each combat round, a random number determines which of the units hit the other for damage. If two units of exactly equal strengths are fighting, it's 50-50 who hits the other. If one has 3x the strength of the other, chances are 3:1 who hits the other, etc. The unit that loses the combat round takes damage, how much is also determined by a comparison of the unit strengths (see the article on combat for the full story). A battle is a sequence of combat rounds ending when one unit dies.
With the knowledge of what a combat round is, we can now define what a first strike is. A first strike is a combat round in which only one of the units, the one with the first strike, can damage the other. Everything is calculated exactly the same as a normal combat round, except that if the random number indicates a win for the other unit, no one takes damage. So a first strike is a free chance to damage your opponent, before he gets the chance to hit you at all.
Note though that it's not free damage to your opponent. You get a chance to hit him, and if you miss you don't do any damage. If your unit with strength 3 attacks his unit with strength 30, you're not likely to get anything out of your first strikes at all. Only difference from the normal combat that follows is that he can't strike back.
How many first strikes do you get in a battle?
This of course depends on your skills and promotions. An archer with the Drill I promotion has 1 first strike and 1 first strike chance. This means you will get 1-2 first strikes in each battle, where the exact number is determined by a flat distribution. A flat distribution means that each number is equally likely to happen. It's is not a 50% chance for each first strike chance, which would result in a normal distribution. If you have 3 first strikes and 4 first strike chances, you are equally likely to get 3 as you are to get 7.
If both units have first strikes, both roll to see how many they would get, and the one who rolled the highest number gets to do the difference. E.g. one unit has 1 first strike and another has 2 first strikes, the second will get one first strike round in combat. If one unit has 1-4 first strikes and rolls 4 and another has 3-8 first strikes and rolls 3, the first one will get one first strike round in combat. Etc.
So what does this mean for my chances in combat?
Like Lexad says, first strikes usually help a stronger unit get even stronger. If your strength is higher than the opponent's strength, that's far more important than if you have a first strike or not. But if you are stronger already, your survival chances can increase dramatically, since the opponent can't damage you during those first rounds. Archers fortified in towns on hills with Drill IV will withstand a lot more attacks than those without. But likely City Defender is still better for that particular purpose, since it's specialized. I have no exact numbers to back this up though, it's simple gut feeling.
Ronnie1
Deity
The AI's are teching as fast as ever, they just aren't TRADING for any techs!
EDIT: Nice explanation on the first strikes Niklas!
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