BTS requires admin privileges to run under Vista?

[sapphire_wyvern]

I'm on home premium and I've got the same problems.
- Civ-Vanilla starts without problems.
- Civ-Warlords iirc used to have a UAC but now doesn't (maybe due a later patch)
- Civ-BTS does not start without UAC interference.

I've looked all over the net for tips and tricks with UAC, but so far I haven't been able to come up with much.
- You can disable the UAC in the control panel, but that is not really a solution to this problem.
- It seems that in Ultimate and Business you can also decrease the security policy so that you do not have elevated UAC warnings as an administrator and you can automatically continue.... however, that is also not a solution as it effects all programs.

Correct on both counts. Also, that latter solution only works for people who are running admin accounts already; I prefer the extra robustness of authenticating rather than just clicking "Continue". (Of course, this means that I'm suffering slightly more than most Vista users from this problem due to my own choices. I accept this.)

It's easy to see which programs have UAC interference, namely, the windows shield icon hovering over the program icon. If I check the Civ-Vanilla and Civ-Warlords executables, I see no such icon. When I check the Civ-BTS executable I do see the UAC windows icon hovering over it. Of course, the shortcut just inherits the status of the executable so that requires UAC permission as well.

Interestingly, the shield only shows up the first time you run BTS; the icon doesn't have it until it triggers UAC for the first time. Hmm, idle speculation time: I wonder if Windows assumes that a program which needs UAC once will always need it in the future, or checks each time?

It should be possible to have a safelist of individual programs which can by-pass UAC because this is sort of rediculous. I know UAC enhances security and therefore I do not wish to disable it permanently, but it should at least be editable to allow execution of those programs which YOU trust.

Interesting idea... maybe in Vista SP1?

If anyone can come up with a "windows only" resolution to this problem I'd like to hear it (I will not use third party programs to bypass the UAC).
I'm certain that Firaxis can fix this in the next BTS patch, since UAC checks can be coded, probably in a dll or such.

I agree that in principle, Firaxis should be able to fix this. It's certainly my preferred solution. I'm a little concerned that this thread hasn't made it into the consolidated bug list. Don't the forum admins consider this behaviour a defect of the software?

 

[sapphire_wyvern]

Heh. I just thought of something "funny".

One of the requirements mentioned earlier of the "Games For Windows" logo is that the game support & implement Vista's parental controls system. Ie, a parent should be able to say that kids can only play games of a certain rating, or set time limits as to when the game is accessible. I haven't explored the full capabilities much because I have my own computer and am a single adult.

But BTS requires admin privileges to run, which means that anyone capable of starting the game knows the logon credentials for an account with full control of the computer. Which means that anyone who can start the game, can turn off the parental controls. And anyone who would be affected by parental controls, can't start the game.

So... requiring admin rights defeats one of the selling points of Games For Windows. Ironic.

This bug also means that the game can't be used in net cafes, etc. (I know, I know, the EULA forbids that anyway). Hardly any net cafes would give their customers admin privileges...

 

[lroumen]

Interestingly, the shield only shows up the first time you run BTS; the icon doesn't have it until it triggers UAC for the first time. Hmm, idle speculation time: I wonder if Windows assumes that a program which needs UAC once will always need it in the future, or checks each time?

I don't understand the triggers for the enabling of UAC because some random tools which I have from work are never checked and they're not likely to be recognised by Vista/UAC as safe. I'm more inclined to think that this issue arose because BTS is made exactly for Games For Windows and as such requires some sort of Administrative Powers to set the parental controls. Subsequently it would mean that Firaxis overlooked something in that process and BTS triggers the UAC.

I agree that in principle, Firaxis should be able to fix this. It's certainly my preferred solution. I'm a little concerned that this thread hasn't made it into the consolidated bug list. Don't the forum admins consider this behaviour a defect of the software?

It's probably because the admins have many threads to check, or they didn't read through this entire thread, or they are only taking note of gameplay bugs. Whatever the case, I hope for all us Vista users and future Vista users, that this issue will not be overlooked.

 

[necbone]

It's by design, Microsoft wants the program to do that in their Games for Windows titles. If you don't like the pop-up asking for permission, turn User Account Control off.

 

[Sam_Yeager]

I tried giving the Users group Full permissions to the BTS directory. No difference.

However I then had a look in the registry and gave the Users group Full permissions over the key and sub-keys of "HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4 - Beyond the Sword". Success!

Note this was on Win XP SP2. Vista may be different but hopefully not. Looks as though it's some sloppy coding where they want to open the key in write mode rather than just read mode.

 

[lroumen]

It's by design, Microsoft wants the program to do that in their Games for Windows titles. If you don't like the pop-up asking for permission, turn User Account Control off.

Actually, there is a lot of mumbo-jumbo about Games For Windows and User Account Control on this microsoft development page which might be a good read.

http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb173456.aspx

In it I found the following quote:

Summary of Games Requirements

1.2 Support Family Safety / Parental Controls
Requirement

Games must fully support Windows Vista Family Safety by adhering to the following rules:

* Games must not require administrative credentials to play. Installation, patching, and removal can require administrative credentials, subject to the requirements in section 3.

...
...

Installation and patching requiring administrative powers, that is fine. Playing the game requiring administrative powers.... that's wrong.

 

[sapphire_wyvern]

Thanks Sam_Yeagar and Iroumen!

I was stunned by necbone's assertion that Games For Windows are *supposed* to trigger UAC, I couldn't believe that MS would cripple the parental controls they're insisting on that way. I'm glad that you've found evidence to the contrary.

But, I'm even more glad that we now have a solution! Woohoo!

Hopefully an upcoming patch will fix it anyway, but now I don't need to wait.

 

[lroumen]

I tried giving the Users group Full permissions to the BTS directory. No difference.

However I then had a look in the registry and gave the Users group Full permissions over the key and sub-keys of "HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4 - Beyond the Sword". Success!

Note this was on Win XP SP2. Vista may be different but hopefully not. Looks as though it's some sloppy coding where they want to open the key in write mode rather than just read mode.

I will check this in Vista tonight, but as I recall the Firaxis location is further down the registry in Vista than simply in the \SOFTWARE\ bit. I hope this will fix our problems (be it at least unofficially).

Thanks Sam_Yeagar and Iroumen!

I was stunned by necbone's assertion that Games For Windows are *supposed* to trigger UAC, I couldn't believe that MS would cripple the parental controls they're insisting on that way. I'm glad that you've found evidence to the contrary.

I couldn't even be true because then Microsoft would have truly missed the point of providing Parental Control with Games For Windows.

 

[LeeT911]

Glad to see I'm not the only one with this problem. I also wish there was a way to safelist specific programs in Vista. But I still love this game! Dealing with the UAC every time I run it doesn't bother me so much, but then I have a lot of older games installed that require UAC to run also...

Have they fixed the issue of unusable voice capture device? I'm running Vista 32 bit and everytime I start Warlords, I get 3 prompts about an unusable voice capture device. I click OK on the warnings and then the game plays fine, it's annoying. I was hoping for better Vista support.

I had this problem as well, but managed to fix it. You can correct the voice capture prompts by going into your BTS ini file and changing the "Enable Voice Capture = 1" (not sure about exact phrase) from 1 to 0. For some reason it stays 1 even if you change the in game options...

I'm at work now, so can't check the exact path for the ini file, but for less computer savvy people, you can follow the steps below:

1) Make sure you have quit the game.
2) Open "My Computer" and navigate to your BTS folder (inside your Civ4 install directory)
3) Open the shortcut to the saved games folder (can't remember what it's called)
4) From the save directory, move up directory levels until you get to the "Beyond the Sword" folder
5) There's an ini file in there, with "Civ4" or "BeyondtheSword" in the filename, something like that. Open the file with Notepad
6) Scroll down until you find the line that says "Enable Voice Capture = 1" (I'm not sure about the exact phrasing but it should be fairly self evident).
7) Change the "1" to "0" (zero).
8) Save changes and exit
9) Launch CIV!

 

[sapphire_wyvern]

Well, I'm sorry to say that granted full access permissions on the Firaxis\Beyond The Sword registry keys & the Program Files\SMCivIV\BTS folder hasn't done me any good in Vista.

I might try granting full access on the entire Civilization IV folder... I'll post here again when I've got some info on that.

 

[Sam_Yeager]

Well, I'm sorry to say that granted full access permissions on the Firaxis\Beyond The Sword registry keys & the Program Files\SMCivIV\BTS folder hasn't done me any good in Vista.

Sorry to hear that this workaround doesn't work for Vista. I've raised a formal bug report here. Perhaps it may be worth doing the same thing for Vista?

 

[lroumen]

Well, I'm sorry to say that granted full access permissions on the Firaxis\Beyond The Sword registry keys & the Program Files\SMCivIV\BTS folder hasn't done me any good in Vista.

I might try granting full access on the entire Civilization IV folder... I'll post here again when I've got some info on that.

I have tried fooling around the registry as well as granting full access to folders and programs, but neither attempt have been successful. Other than disabling the UAC (not an option) it seems it cannot be done.

Sorry to hear that this workaround doesn't work for Vista. I've raised a formal bug report here. Perhaps it may be worth doing the same thing for Vista?

I'd like to thank you for your effort. It was worth checking out.
I think the moderators of this forum should just confirm this bugthread. They do it with all the other threads that start out as tentative bugs.

 

[sapphire_wyvern]

Yeah, I agree. Thanks again Sam_Yeagar

I'm guessing that the game has a UAC manifest that requests admin rights (who knows why, or how it got Games For Windows certification like that...)

But if that's the case, there's nothing we can do but wait for a patch.

I'll give this another couple of days and if there's still no acknowledgement, I'll raise a new thread following the "official style".

This is definitely a bug because the game as released does not comply with the Games For Windows logo requirements.

 

[geofelt]

I, also have the "run as administrator" problem on bts. If there is a solution, please post it here.

 

[boule]

Same problem here on vista 64. nothing to add to a problem that is already well described

I expect BtS to run as CIV IV vanilla and Warlord on a standard account as I did not see any warnings on limited rights (funny ... 'must be' an Admin is a limitation of my rights) nor did I see any change or indication of change of such rights on my BtS box.

 

[lroumen]

I'm on Vista 64-bit as well, but it's not related to that.

By now I've tried a dozen approaches to fix this, but I still haven't figured out how to change it. It can only be ascribed to BTS. Someone needs to acknowledge this as a bug already.

 

[boule]

i'm just stating a fact as i did'nt try it on vista 32bits even though the only difference should be on the driver side not the gaming side.

I deeply agree for the need of acknowledgement.

 

[lroumen]

I sent a bug report to Firaxis linking to this thread. Maybe it helps.

 

[sagji]

One of the requirements for GFW is that the game can be played without administrative credentials (UAC)

see http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb173456.aspx
section 1.2

 

[lroumen]

Yes, I linked to the same page a few posts above.

Shameless bump until one of the bugforum team recognises this as a bug (or at least acknowledges our investigations).