C2C - Space Terrain

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Caveman 2 Cosmos' started by Hydromancerx, Feb 2, 2012.

  1. ls612

    ls612 Deity Moderator

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    +1000 to this. It does not IMO make sense to do all of this coding (and it is quite a large amount of coding to do this), and then junk that all a little while later when the actual Multi-Maps stuff comes along. It would also as you say have issues with world wrapping. All Mapscripts would need to be changed to accommodate this, and then changed back once Multi-Maps come.

    All in all I think that Hydro's idea may be more work than it is worth.
     
  2. Dancing Hoskuld

    Dancing Hoskuld Deity

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    There are three things here all totally separate issues:-
    1) The go to moon/Mars/... random location is almost all XML and minimal code about 2-10 lines of python.

    2) The "Go To City..." is something we need now. Don't know why it did not come with Civ IV vanilla. The code would be the same on one map or many if you have the code accept "map" as a parameter in addition to the other stuff needed anyway.

    3) World wrapping is only a problem if you have all the maps on one map which we wont have - except for Hydro's current test map. Just ignore it as we wont be going that way.​
    1) Go to location on (other map)
    If this is just a random location then this can be done with one mission per target map.

    If it is a random location on a chosen terrain type then we need one mission per terrain type per target map.

    If it is a given location on another map then we need some way of
    • getting the location specification from the player. However this is done it just ends up as a coordinate (map, X, Y).
    • passing this coordinate to the mission that does the work
    • This can't be done using the current mission system.
    2) Go To Place...
    This is generic in that it can work for units on any map and between maps. It
    • Displays a list of targets based on where the unit can get to
    • Takes the selection (map, x, y)
    • Gives the unit "go to" orders if the target is on the same map.
    • Uses the right mission if the target is on a different map.
     
  3. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    @DH

    So what's the bottom line? Do we need to wait for multi-maps or not?
     
  4. Thunderbrd

    Thunderbrd C2C War Dog

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    @DH: Have you taken a look at what Koshling has stated is the final remaining barrier to multi-map development? It appears your python skills might be in desperate need to complete that project.

    (map, x, y) makes a lot of sense and I don't know how much of that kind of thinking would need to take place in the dll but such missions wouldn't be terribly difficult to make there provided such a coordinate system has been established. To be honest, I know he's done the viewports and such but I don't understand or know exactly what he's done for multi-map work.

    Then of course, we need to be able to store the multiple maps... I think he's done work for that. But we also then have to figure out how (and when) to generate them. I believe the plan on that has always been to generate the added maps as needed. But we'd need to be able to identify what mapscripts to use for that and ... it would help if Koshling might be able to break down the steps of the project and let us know exactly what has been done, how what's been done so far works in the code and what exactly we still have to achieve. I'm sure we need to develop new mapscripts for generating the rest of the maps but I know so little about the standard mapscripts we use that I feel totally useless here!

    I think that last sentence kinda states we should be waiting for completion on the multi-map project.
     
  5. Faustmouse

    Faustmouse Deity

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    It would be very cool if you could at least land on and colonize the moon soon. Not only for gameplay-reasons to fill the lunar-techs, but also for modding reasons to test the space-missions-stuff.
    But I think it is not worth it to change the mapscript as Hydro proposed. What if just making a test-scenario that don't affect the game? Sure, you are forced to play this one map if you want lunar-stuff, but it is MUCH less effort and you could still enjoy and test lunar-stuff.
     
  6. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    Or use both. First use the special map script to make the map and then go in and customize the map to include all the C2C terrains, features and resources. Because right now the custom map only produces a simplistic map that doesn't utilize all the types of terrains.
     
  7. Dancing Hoskuld

    Dancing Hoskuld Deity

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    Actually there is a great deal off effort to get such a map working, all to do with turning each sub-map into a globe ie allow you to walk east of the eastern end onto the western end. Making it look right too so that the east is linked to the west end. This is the wrapping problem we talked about and don't want to think about.
     
  8. Faustmouse

    Faustmouse Deity

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    Jeah, the map I suggested for demo purpose was just a flat one, not a round world. I think I've heared you ned multi maps to solve the wrap problem correctly.
    What I suggest is just an as easy as possible flat map for testing lunar stuff (i think mars stuff is quite similar to that, isn't it) with no extra mapscript needed. Just like the 4 (or 5) in one map Hydro posted in the Map thread: Earth and Moon seperated by space terrain, similar like 2 continents are seperated by water before you have ships.
     
  9. Alex Costa

    Alex Costa Warlord

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    I think we should test the Moon first. BTW Hydromancerx what wonder are planned to be Moon-specific? Also I suppose Helium-256 (? correct me if I am wrong?) will be added as a resource?
     
  10. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    I have not even thought about Wonders at this stage. But Helium3 is already put in as a resource.
     
  11. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    @Dancing Hoskuld

    Here are some Terrain Improvements. These are like Cottages, but for the Lunar and Mars terrains. Note they cannot be built on Earth terrain so they will not be built normally on your homeworld. They are less productive than am Earth cottage so its in the players interest to terraform their lunar/martian terrain so they do not have to build them anymore.

    Habitat (Small)
    Graphic: Use Habitat (Small) from "Song of the Moon" mod.
    Req Tech: Lunar Colonization
    Can be Built By: Space Worker or Android
    • Can Only Be Built on Flatlands
    • Can Only Be Built on Lunar or Mars terrains
    • Becomes Habitat (Medium) in 10 Turns
    • Cannot Be Built Outside Cultural Borders
    • Pillage Yields 10 :gold: on Average
    • +1 :commerce:
    • +1 :commerce: with Lunar Megastructures
    • +1 :commerce: with Planetary Colonization
    • +1 :commerce: with Planetary Megastructures
    • +1 :commerce: with Colony Arcology

    Habitat (Medium)
    Graphic: Use Habitat (Medium) from "Song of the Moon" mod.
    Req Tech: Lunar Manufacturing
    Can be Built By: Space Worker or Android
    • Can Only Be Built on Flatlands
    • Can Only Be Built on Lunar or Mars terrains
    • Becomes Habitat (Large) in 20 Turns
    • Cannot Be Built Outside Cultural Borders
    • Pillage Yields 15 :gold: on Average
    • +2 :commerce:
    • +1 :commerce: with Lunar Megastructures
    • +1 :commerce: with Planetary Colonization
    • +1 :commerce: with Planetary Megastructures
    • +1 :commerce: with Colony Arcology

    Habitat (Large)
    Graphic: Use Habitat (Large) from "Song of the Moon" mod.
    Req Tech: Planetary Colonization
    Can be Built By: Space Worker or Android
    • Can Only Be Built on Flatlands
    • Can Only Be Built on Lunar or Mars terrains
    • Becomes Habitat (Huge) in 40 Turns
    • Cannot Be Built Outside Cultural Borders
    • Pillage Yields 20 :gold: on Average
    • +3 :commerce:
    • +1 :commerce: with Lunar Megastructures
    • +1 :commerce: with Planetary Colonization
    • +1 :commerce: with Planetary Megastructures
    • +1 :commerce: with Colony Arcology

    Habitat (Huge)
    Graphic: Use Habitat Compound from "Song of the Moon" mod.
    Req Tech: Planetary Manufacturing
    Can be Built By: Space Worker or Android
    • Can Only Be Built on Flatlands
    • Can Only Be Built on Lunar or Mars terrains
    • Cannot Be Built Outside Cultural Borders
    • Pillage Yields 25 :gold: on Average
    • +4 :commerce:
    • +1 :commerce: with Lunar Megastructures
    • +1 :commerce: with Planetary Colonization
    • +1 :commerce: with Planetary Megastructures
    • +1 :commerce: with Colony Arcology

    Many thanks in advance! :goodjob:
     
  12. Dancing Hoskuld

    Dancing Hoskuld Deity

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    These are like cottages which means that only the first can be built and they grow into the larger ones. Do you want it this way or do you want each them to be built?

    Edit There is no tech TECH_PLANETARY_COLONIZATION assuming TECH_PLANET_COLONIZATION.
    There is no tech TECH_LUNAR_MANUFACTURING or TECH_PLANETARY_MANUFACTURING
     
  13. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    Sorry yeah I want it to work like houses.

    And the tags are weird. I am not sure who made them.

    Lunar Colonization = TECH_LUNAR_COLONIZATION
    Lunar Manufacturing = TECH_LUNAR_LUNAR_MANUFACTURING
    Planetary Colonization =TECH_PLANET_COLONIZATION
    Planetary Manufacturing = TECH_SUPERFLUOUS_MANUFACTURING
     
  14. Civ Fuehrer

    Civ Fuehrer Eat, Sleep, Mod

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    Hah, I thought those would've been changed by now - those are the old names back when they were still in the concept stages.

    @Alex Costa
    I have a few wonder ideas for the moon currently not sure the terrains thread is the proper place to post them though.
     
  15. ls612

    ls612 Deity Moderator

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    You can't change the underlying names without breaking saves.
     
  16. Civ Fuehrer

    Civ Fuehrer Eat, Sleep, Mod

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    I realize that, but I thought their alpha-stage names would have been changed upon implementation into C2C.
     
  17. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    @Dancing Hoskuld

    I was looking over the lunar and Mars terrains and I found the following problems ...

    1. Lunar Basalt looks like Space.

    2. Lunar Plains looks like Lunar Basalt.

    3. Lunar Rocky looks like Lunar Plains.

    4. Lunar Barren looks like Lunar Rocky.

    5. Lunar Desert looks like Lunar Barren.

    6. Martian Ice looks like Lunar Desert.

    7. Martian Permafrost looks like Martian Ice.

    8. Martian Desert looks like Martian Permafrost.

    9. Martian Dunes looks like Martian Desert.

    10. Martian Barren look like Martian Dunes.

    11. Martian Plains look like Martian Barren

    12. Martian Rocky look like Martian Plains.

    In other words it looks like all the terrains were pushed over to right.
     
  18. ls612

    ls612 Deity Moderator

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    Apparently not. :rolleyes: The same thing happened with OrionVeterans's new Aircraft, their tags are really messed up, making it a pain to work with. MrAzure's tech tags are also kinda bad, and I may just bite the bullet and change them (it will only affect games that have gone that far, and that should not bee to many).
     
  19. Raven Destroyer

    Raven Destroyer Prince

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    i know it's always annoying when modders break saves but if it helps modding then modders should just have Sorry guys but this is something that needs to be done (and best done combining the most save breakers in one go)
     
  20. Hydromancerx

    Hydromancerx C2C Modder

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    If it was done I would vote for say v30. Where we took all the thing that would break saves and just do them at the release of v30.
     

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