Can you numb skulls explain...

[Duddha]

Well, the final results aren't in but it looks like Prop 56 in California will fail. (For thoes not familiar Prop 56 would have changed the requirement for passing a state budget in the state house and senate from 2/3 to 55%) Can one of you explain why we should keep the 2/3 voting rule? (which has forced the state democrates to literally bribe one house and senate republican with porkbarrel projects every time they try to pass a budget, in a democratic majority controlled legisature) How does this make any sense for anyone?

 

[cgannon64]

Has California ever made sense to anyone?

 

[amadeus]

Free California?

Great, now we have two Californian hypernationalists posting here.



And if you're wondering why my post has nothing to do with your topic, it's because you're referred to us as "numb skulls."

 

[Duddha]

Yeah, I should have specified that "numb skulls" is directed at those Californians on this Forum who voted against or who are against Prop 56. Sorry for the insult.

 

[Pontiuth Pilate]

Great, now we have two Californian hypernationalists posting here.

The other being? Sims?

Yeah, I should have specified that "numb skulls" is directed at those Californians on this Forum who voted against or who are against Prop 56. Sorry for the insult.

I campaigned against it. The more checks on the legislature the better.

Maybe, instead of bribing reps and handing out pork, they could have designed a budget that ACTUALLY MET WITH MAJORITY APPROVAL? Ever think of that, buddy? You know - instead of changing the rules of the game to suit you?

 

[Duddha]

Maybe, instead of bribing reps and handing out pork, they could have designed a budget that ACTUALLY MET WITH MAJORITY APPROVAL? Ever think of that, buddy? You know - instead of changing the rules of the game to suit you?

Not playing by the rules is exactly what the state republicans have done, they have dictated to the majority that either their demands are met or they get paid off. Minority rule is not democracy. I think that when it comes to the State budget the majority of california representatives should be able to pass what the majority wants them to pass, which is a democratic budget plan (they would have voted for republicans if they wanted their budget). We can see the disasterous consequences of this 2/3 rule in the ongoing state budget crises that was created by the minority (republicans) because they were unwilling to compromise on a budget.

55% is the majority, 2/3 is a hyper-majority. Imagine if this were true for the national legislature.

 

[Pontiuth Pilate]

they have dictated to the majority that either their demands are met or they get paid off.

A time-honored American tradition.

PS: California Liberation Front? Are these people for real? Or are they from Berkeley?

 

[stormbind]

Free California!!

I don't have any interest in change, but I think that under WW2 treaties it was agreed that the largest powers would award independence to any state they controlled that requested it.

This was with the aim of preventing future wars. Am I right?

Now surely this applies equally to the world.. shouldn't Washington DC respect the wishes of the citizens of the Republic of California?

Afterall, we invaded Iraq because it did not live up to our high moral standards.

Is it right to have one set of morals when you want something from others, and a conflicting set of morals when others ask for something of you?

Maybe Washington DC will respect the people's wishes. If there is a desire for change, why not put it a free and fair referendum?

 

[Duddha]

@Pontiuth Pilate
It may happen all the time, but I happen to think it shouldn't. And yes the CLF is real though small (and not in berkeley) and i"m not a member if you thought of asking, but I do support them, that they might improve the pittiful state of American democracy.

@stormbind
I completely agree. It is nice to hear another voice of reason in relation to california secession, rather than the familiar banter of "No, the Civil War decided that stuff. We killed a bunch of southerners and said nobody can leave. So if you try and leave we'll kill you too."

 

[Sims2789]

Originally posted by cgannon64
Has California ever made sense to anyone?

you say this and wonder why Duddha supports seccesion?

 

[Sims2789]

Originally posted by stormbind
Free California!!

I don't have any interest in change, but I think that under WW2 treaties it was agreed that the largest powers would award independence to any state they controlled that requested it.

This was with the aim of preventing future wars. Am I right?

Now surely this applies equally to the world.. shouldn't Washington DC respect the wishes of the citizens of the Republic of California?

Afterall, we invaded Iraq because it did not live up to our high moral standards.

Is it right to have one set of morals when you want something from others, and a conflicting set of morals when others ask for something of you?

Maybe Washington DC will respect the people's wishes. If there is a desire for change, why not put it a free and fair referendum?

only problem being that less then half of us (Californians), including myself support sessesion, and it really isn't an issue. but i'd like to see a poll proving my belief(about how less then half of us support sessesion).

 

[Duddha]

only problem being that less then half of Californians support sessesion, and it really isn't an issue. but i'd like to see a poll proving my belief(about how less then half of us support sessesion).

You are probably right. But how many californians have even heard or mcuh less seriously thouhgt about california secession?
Here is a poll that says californians overwellingly support secession, however i'm pretty sure the sample is scewd. Link: http://www.misterpoll.com/results.mpl?id=140047269

 

[stormbind]

Where I come from: Less than half the population reads current affairs and less than half the population votes

I just wish (and this is not directed at US issues) that democracies would pay attention to the results of referendums. It seems to me that whenever a referendum is held, the population always votes overwhelmingly to support A or B... and then negotiations continue and nothing changes!

It's utterly insane that people advocate democracy and then completely ignore the results of a referendum when it doesn't provide the results they wanted!

This has happened a lot in the UK which is I why I yearn for the day people actually pay attention to votes of people!

My rant is the result of frustration and anoyance at the double standards.

 

[Sims2789]

i'd take them more seriously if the font on their flag was something other then an absurd half-wingdings half-times new roman font.

 

[h4ppy]

Californians can have their own country after they have fought for it and won. (In other words never)

 

[Duddha]

true, but the font adds to the expression of the bear's fist in the air.

 

[Duddha]

Californians can have their own country after they have fought for it and won. (In other words never)

Again with the war and might makes right dribble.

 

[h4ppy]

But it does.

 

[Sarevok]

Originally posted by cgannon64
Has California ever made sense to anyone?

Certainly not me

 

[Sims2789]

Originally posted by Duddha
true, but the font adds to the expression of the bear's fist in the air.

no, it just makes whoever designed this flag look like a non-serious screw-off. if it was in angry font then you'd be right. now, it just looks absurd. if anything it makes the bear look like a crazy, angry drunk about to get in a bar fight with a t-rex.