The defender pops up the next turn, so if you take the town immediately it is razed and the defender is never built the town destroyed with a "full box" But maybe I am just a liar and making this up as I post.
Caught the AI Cheating
- Thread starter Nergal
- Start date
The massive barbarian uprisings are hardcoded to occur when the first civ enters the Middle Ages IIRC.
It is hardcoded, but I think it is actually triggered by the second civ reaching a new age
.I've never seen anything appear before I hit end turn as I think Bartleby is describing, but I agree that AI can
a defender faster than a human can. This is from my notes in HoF Upsilon gauntlet:Delhi was on a hill, so I didn’t attack until I had 6 jags nearby in 2630 BC.
Since I couldn’t reach his city from outside his radius, I had to declare when he gave me the ultimatum. He whipped the spearman on that turn. My first veteran jag killed Ghandi’s non-fortified regular spear on a hill starting my Golden Age. The second veteran jag killed the warrior and eliminated India.
IIRC the turn correctly, I moved units next to Delhi while we were at peace, and there was only a warrior there. During the IBT, Ghandi gave me the "leave or declare" - I declared. When it was my turn again, there was an unfortified spearman in Delhi and 1 less citizen.
If the player whipped something, it wouldn't be ready until his next turn - he couldn't have it before the AI moved again. My guess is that in the turn order, "diplomacy" comes before commerce, food, and shields (similar to the way it is in multiplayer), and once the player declares the AI breaks into the build sequence and whips a spear (cheater!!!
). It is possible that Delhi just happened to starve and complete a spearman on that turn, but I doubt it.I think that gave was played after I finally figured out how to use CAII's archive function
so I probably have the saves somewhere. Indeed - I
giving the AI a cash rush government before attacking - fewer defenders, less autorazing, less whip unhappiness in captured towns, plus they go through at least some anarchy (depending on the level).
I don't recall if I'd declared or what gov't the AI was in, but maybe it's the "scared to death" bug, not drafting, that I was seeing. I would have sworn that the defenders were conscripts, but maybe not. Anyway, I'll watch for a testing opportunity.
Thanks to everyone for responses.
Edit: Wow. Serious x-post with Chamnix.
Thanks to everyone for responses.
Edit: Wow. Serious x-post with Chamnix.
Nergal
Prince
Maybe hostility is too strong a word. But I dont lie in real life and I've practically been accused of it in this thread. And I've had the same experience in the past from from experienced players who think I am knocking, or belittling 'their' game. If it happened in real life I'd take them outside and show them the meaning of Conquest victory.
Nergal
Prince
I once bombed 4 towns on an island to size 1 .. no baracks left nothing, just empty towns. Landed 6 modern armour and the turn after a veteran mech infantry was in the one town they couldnt see. It may be cognitive bias but has anyone found that if you attack a town from a certain angle, so that your attacker hides the defenders hit point flag, more defenders survive unharmed than if you attack from another angle?
I understand better what you meant, now. I see how you could feel that way. Sorry if I sounded like I was complaining. We need to use more smileys.
Now those are the words of a Mancunian!
Seriously though, I don't think that people meant to cause offense or make accusations of lying. It's just a game that a lot of people feel very strongly about and maybe want to defend. Exploring reasons that might explain a perceived example of AI cheating is healthy IMO.
Missing details that I think are important in the research example but not provided in the OP are (off the top of my head) map size, number of turns since the last Zulu tech discovery, size of your empire and number of luxes you already have. These are all required to help determine the value of the trade you got. This is not accusing you of lying; it is simply saying that more information is required to make a decision.
Nergal
Prince
I cant be bothered reloading now it.. its gone off the boil ... but next time it happens I'll check it fifteen times and make sure its kosher before posting. As people have pointed out there are valid reasons it could have happened. But as other people have pointed out the game still has bugs. A lot of the more experienced players take these for granted and its the newer ones that notice them. I like the game, its not perfect, it has flaws I would like to see fixed, although I dont expect they will be but I find it a lot more playable than Civ4. The AI and the RNG need tieing down in a field within range of 200 or so stealth bombers, thats undisputed.
TheOverseer714
Overseer
I know the AI cheats, so I don't let that bother me. What really gets me boiling is when the RNG repeatedly favors the AI, like on a recent turn a veteran sword killed an 11 point MDI army without being scratched. Next turn, 2 veteran swords killed 2 fortified pikes behind walls
Turn after that a town that had just built a library 5 turns back flipped instead of growing culturally. Some days, you just feel like the deck is too stacked against you.
Turn after that a town that had just built a library 5 turns back flipped instead of growing culturally. Some days, you just feel like the deck is too stacked against you.Just try to remember that you do get similar runs in your favour.
I must admit that I'm surprised that it even attacked. That's a tough result but s**t happens. In my recent Deity game, I lost two armies (one cavs and one rifles) to a stack of archers, spears and the odd horse. Not as extreme as yours, as it wasn't so much a long run of bad results as much as the fact that there were simply too many units for me to deal with, along with some bad results early on. I know that I got some results that went my way as well in other parts of the game so I just get on with it. Annoying yes, but it doesn't stop me enjoying the game in the long run!
Bartleby
Remembers laughter
Has anyone else seen a settler-spearman pair build a town and as the settler transforms to a town one or more warriors pop out?
Now that's cheating!
That sounds like it's a conquered AI's last settler; when they found a city, the computer thinks it's their first city so it gives them their free units (only applies above regent level).
MAS
Deity
My apologies if I sounded rude or hostile. I have that problem more often.
I forgot about the double victory=promote rule, but still, its not unique to the AI, it works for your own defenders to. In fact, it works for your attackers as well; If they have blitz, they will promote with 2 victorious attacks in a row.
(one reason why cossack are better than they appear at first, you can create lost of elites and thus MGL this way.)
I forgot about the double victory=promote rule, but still, its not unique to the AI, it works for your own defenders to. In fact, it works for your attackers as well; If they have blitz, they will promote with 2 victorious attacks in a row.
(one reason why cossack are better than they appear at first, you can create lost of elites and thus MGL this way.)
Nergal
Prince
Cossacks are brilliant, I love playing them because they do that. But the RNG does favour the AI more than the player, especially at higher levels so they get more victories.
Is there a different rule for barbs? I ask because in my game The Unluckiest Lucky Start, I had an army (& I think it was a cav army) attacked by barbs! Don't recall if they were warriors or horses, though.
Bartleby
Remembers laughter
I think the barbs always attack if you are NW/SE of them. In C3C, that is.
gmaharriet
Ancient Crone
TheOverseer714 said:
My understanding is there are a few cases in which an Army will be attacked by the AI (not barbs).Tone said:
1. When the Army has just been in combat and its hit points are greatly reduced.
2. Even at full health when the Army is garrisoning a city the AI wants.
3. On a foreign continent if the attacking AI has all of that continent's land to itself. (That's not something I've seen myself.)
4. An Army will be bombarded once the AI has Flight.
Like Tone, I'd be surprised if the vet sword was attacking, rather than just defending. If it was defending, fortified on a mountain top, and the Army was missing hit points, I guess it might happen.
Bartleby
Remembers laughter
I've seen no. 3 in your list, gma; I'm convinced it's related to AIPatrol. If you have AIPatrol set on, the AI units with nothing to "go for" will simply mill about--one or two will accidentally bump into the Army and maybe injure it enough that it becomes a valid target.
gmaharriet
Ancient Crone
That would explain it. Thanks, Bartleby!
