Caveman 2 Cosmos

[irishhombre]

Update: also one more issue I noticed -- I have 6k+ Park Ranger units, but when I alt+click on them to upgrade them to Ecologists, only a fraction of them get upgraded. I then have to wait for the next turn to upgrade more. I do have enough money to do the upgrade (around 1 billion).

I find that this happens when some units have movement points and others don't have any.

 

[Esfera]

@jiallombardo Can I ask you how comes you have so many ecologist units?! For what purpuse, are that high your water and air polution?

 

[Snofru1]

I think that is too much , playing on Marathon and large space map (growing to Village etc. is also way too long).

 

[raxo2222]

I think that is too much , playing on Marathon and large space map (growing to Village etc. is also way too long).

View attachment 553124

Upload save, probably there is error in upgrade time calculations

 

[JosEPh_II]

I did see a comparison on the lets play being done on Something Aweful and it does look flat worse than the next civic on all points - I think mostly due to civics not being yet fully evaluated past the industrial/modern era.
@JosEPh_II I think mentioned something about civics having been balanced only up to a particular place in the game so far.

That is correct. Pepper's Civics have had marginal changes by me. Some I think by raxo2222, I think.
The Med Era somewhat, but the Ren/Industrial/Atomic/next Era only cursory when I 1st started the project.

As Players make it into these Eras a save game placed in the Civics Thread would be greatly appreciated to help with data collection and evaluations of these areas.

 

[Snofru1]

The slow growing villages are around the city called A22-Keleia.

 

[jiallombardo]

@jiallombardo Can I ask you how comes you have so many ecologist units?! For what purpuse, are that high your water and air polution?

Well, I had 88 cities, each having 2000+ air pollution, mid-Atomic era. I also build almost every building, because I play for fun (except for Maginot Line, and the buildings that remove trade routes). My income was 700k per turn, so I didn't mind spamming rangers to suppress pollution. It wasn't enough though, some cities still had ~500 pollution, until I researched Ecology and Recycling

As Players make it into these Eras a save game placed in the Civics Thread would be greatly appreciated to help with data collection and evaluations of these areas.

I'm about to enter Information Era, but my playstyle is very specific (I build most of the buildings, and intentionally switch civics sometimes to build civic-specific buildings, like Grand Manors, Art Patronages etc). Would my save be helpful? If so, which exact thread should I post to?

 

[Thunderbrd]

I think that is too much , playing on Marathon and large space map (growing to Village etc. is also way too long).

View attachment 553124

Perhaps you have traits that make such an upgrade take so long with the intent that it basically won't ever upgrade under that trait.

 

[jiallombardo]

One more question -- has the meltdown mechanic been disabled? I can see there's a "nukeImmune" tag, but I don't see any py-scripts that implement meltdown. The Pedia also doesn't have "Small chance of Meltdown" property on Nuclear Plants (as well as Utility Fog, for example). Is the mechanic gone, or are the descriptions missing? If so, which buildings can currently cause meltdown to occur? Or is it tied to "Random Events" flag?

 

[raxo2222]

One more question -- has the meltdown mechanic been disabled? I can see there's a "nukeImmune" tag, but I don't see any py-scripts that implement meltdown. The Pedia also doesn't have "Small chance of Meltdown" property on Nuclear Plants (as well as Utility Fog, for example). Is the mechanic gone, or are the descriptions missing? If so, which buildings can currently cause meltdown to occur? Or is it tied to "Random Events" flag?

NukeImmune tag is completely unrelated.

This meltdown mechanic was disabled (related tag was removed from all buildings) like year ago as it was way too disruptive, and didn't made much of sense.

 

[Yudishtira]

NukeImmune tag is completely unrelated.

This meltdown mechanic was disabled (related tag was removed from all buildings) like year ago as it was way too disruptive, and didn't made much of sense.

IT... DID... NOT... CONFORM... TO... CULT... DOCTRINE... ALL... PRAISE... THE... ATOM...

 

[Thunderbrd]

NukeImmune tag is completely unrelated.

This meltdown mechanic was disabled (related tag was removed from all buildings) like year ago as it was way too disruptive, and didn't made much of sense.

It made total sense on the initial fission plants.

All I thought didn't make sense personally was that it was applied to all dangerous buildings as a representation of the danger they pose rather than having more appropriate disaster scenarios for those that didn't always involve fallout.

 

[tmv]

IT... DID... NOT... CONFORM... TO... CULT... DOCTRINE... ALL... PRAISE... THE... ATOM...

All praise the utility fog!

 

[raxo2222]

IT... DID... NOT... CONFORM... TO... CULT... DOCTRINE... ALL... PRAISE... THE... ATOM...

Chernobyl happened because of incompetence.
So you should be blaming dictatorships.
And we know, that nuclear war means total destruction of civilization or at least modern technology.

It made total sense on the initial fission plants.

So destruction should be scaled with city size - bigger cities would lose less buildings as effectively one building represents multiple buildings (this isn't simulated yet).
Also destruction chance should depend on civics too.
If you have wonder that represent moving asteroids around, there there should be small chance of utter destruction of civilization on earth with that 50 km asteroid.
In cosmic era you can sterilize entire galaxies.
in last era you can delete reality itself.

All praise the utility fog!

And microwave powerplant (space solar collectors beaming down energy)

 

[Thunderbrd]

So destruction should be scaled with city size - bigger cities would lose less buildings as effectively one building represents multiple buildings (this isn't simulated yet).
Also destruction chance should depend on civics too.

It was more accurate as it was than it is to completely remove it. At some point, variation in nuclear explosion events will be made into a much more detailed game engine but for now I don't see how removing the capability of meltdown from all nuc plants makes any sense at all.

Chernobyl happened because of incompetence.
So you should be blaming dictatorships.
And we know, that nuclear war means total destruction of civilization or at least modern technology.

What about 9 mile island? Fukushima? and the ones destined to happen in our future still? There's no such thing as an unsinkable ship. Nature seems to take offense to any effort to think we have controlled it flawlessly and regularly proves to us that nothing we do is ever flawless.

I do admit the mod was having these events take place too often.

And yes, we need a disaster event engine that's a bit more easily set with various variables, directly tied to what risks people are taking with the technology at their fingertips.

 

[raxo2222]

It was more accurate as it was than it is to completely remove it. At some point, variation in nuclear explosion events will be made into a much more detailed game engine but for now I don't see how removing the capability of meltdown from all nuc plants makes any sense at all.


What about 9 mile island? Fukushima? and the ones destined to happen in our future still? There's no such thing as an unsinkable ship. Nature seems to take offense to any effort to think we have controlled it flawlessly and regularly proves to us that nothing we do is ever flawless.

I do admit the mod was having these events take place too often.

And yes, we need a disaster event engine that's a bit more easily set with various variables, directly tied to what risks people are taking with the technology at their fingertips.

Only one (earliest) nuclear powerplant had chance of meltdown.

Also often humans are weakest part of link.

Fukushima and 9 mile island accidents were temporary disruption (much less dangerous than Chernobyl) - could be simulated by surge of Radioactivity property, that temporarily reduces city productivity, health and happiness.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Also often humans are weakest part of link.

Fukushima and 9 mile island accidents were temporary disruption (much less dangerous than Chernobyl) - could be simulated by surge of Radioactivity property, that temporarily reduces city productivity, health and happiness.

Not saying we aren't the weakest part of the link, but we are the planners and engineers and operators, all of whom could easily make a mistake.

As for those, that's true, (though I think Fukushima has been FAR worse than any gov wants to admit in terms of the lasting damage it has done to the planet) except we don't yet have a more in depth ability to establish such variations without extensive direct python programming for various buildings. At some point we should build a better disaster game engine but until then I have no problem with the simpler 'acts like a nuclear blast' disaster scenario as long as it's a nuclear one.

 

[raxo2222]

As for those, that's true, (though I think Fukushima has been FAR worse than any gov wants to admit in terms of the lasting damage it has done to the planet)

Radiation doesn't do lasting damage once it dissipates to low enough level.
All those nuclear tests were more destructive than fukushima.
Also Chernobyl was orders of magnitude worse.

Even 10x usual background radiation isn't too much.
Microplastics and other persistent pollutants are often more serious.

So persistent pollution autobuildings should be added too.
Preferably if they would require buildings created by any civ.

 

[Thunderbrd]

Radiation doesn't do lasting damage once it dissipates to low enough level.
All those nuclear tests were more destructive than fukushima.
Also Chernobyl was orders of magnitude worse.

Even 10x usual background radiation isn't too much.
Microplastics and other persistent pollutants are often more serious.

So persistent pollution autobuildings should be added too.
Preferably if they would require buildings created by any civ.

Wow... wherever you got your education didn't want you to think of radiation as a serious threat huh? lol That's absolutely absurd. Even a small amount of radiation exposure can dramatically damage environments for generations to come with harmful random mutations and carcinogens. Sure microplastics and other pollutants are serious as well, PERHAPS worse, but it will take some generations to really see just how devastating the released radiation into the ocean will prove to be. Chernobyl was worse, yes, but it didn't spill into an ocean so as to poison the foundation of the global ecosystem either.

 

[raxo2222]

Wow... wherever you got your education didn't want you to think of radiation as a serious threat huh? lol That's absolutely absurd. Even a small amount of radiation exposure can dramatically damage environments for generations to come with harmful random mutations and carcinogens. Sure microplastics and other pollutants are serious as well, PERHAPS worse, but it will take some generations to really see just how devastating the released radiation into the ocean will prove to be. Chernobyl was worse, yes, but it didn't spill into an ocean so as to poison the foundation of the global ecosystem either.

Radiation is serious thread, but you shouldn't be exaggerating it, there were oceanic nuclear tests too.
Also radiation will simply dilute to safe level in oceans - that is low enough so organism can heal themselves easily.
Radiation is much worse when it happens on land.

Climate change and regular pollution is way more disruptive than fukushima radiation.