I need to be skipped this round- my hard disk died and I won't get the new one in the mail and installed until Friday afternoon. I'm out of commission as far as playing Civ until then, although I can use a borrowed computer to post in discussion.
CG7 - Diety Attempt!
- Thread starter cgannon64
- Start date
Aggie
Deity
Well, sorry to hear it cgannon, borealis.
Guess Jack is up again...
Guess Jack is up again...
jack merchant
Internationalist
No problem, Borealis, I've got it then. I hope you got to finish GOTM18 ?
jack merchant
Internationalist
Inherited turn: Upgrade a horse in Nanking to Rider. Wake up the Rider in Beijing and send it to Inch'on - I want to be ready when war breaks out anew with the Koreans. Hurry a pike in Pusan for 88 gold - the AI likes nothing better than to sneak attack when you have unprotected cities. Hurry the temple in Hyangsan for 152 gold.
IT Arabs have gathered 2 Longbow miniSOD's - 11 longbows total and a pike and a spear
450 AD (1) The FP completes in Shanghai and the bank in Beijing. Our income jumps by 70 gpt. ! An elite attack on one of the longbows generates our first Leader, Kuang'yin ! For its great victory to the north of our empire, the Rider unit is renamed Light of the North, or Aurora Borealis
Of course, this happens after our FP is complete (I actually considered slowing down construction last turn ! If only... From a purely topographical standpoint, the FP might have been better off in Jack's G). We massacre all the longbows; hopefully Mansura will fall next turn.
Luxes go to 10% due to emerging WW in some cities
IT Another 2 longbows emerge out of Mansura and kill a rider.
460 AD (2) We take Mansura. Kuang'Yin builds an Army. Before deciding who to fill it with, I have another elite attack a longbow and we get the GL Sun Tzu ! The Shillen Tzu's are added into the army. I'll turn Sun into JS Bach's. I buy Metallurgy (which just came in) from the Babs for 68 gpt and sell it to the Celts for Music Theory and 10gpt. Then, and this may be
, I rush JS Bach's on the spot. I don't think it's too great a risk. Mansura hasn't had a culture expansion yet and is only size 3.
470 AD (3) We redeclare war on Korea to get rid of the 36 gpt payment - otherwise we'll be bound to the treaty for 20 more turns. Completion of Bach isn't enough to turn off luxes yet, it appears. The Zul steal the town of Taejon from us, which is a pity, as we wanted its furs. We massacre some more longbows as we rest and refit.
480 AD (4) Capture Pyongson with 4 workers and a catapult. Capture Wonsan at the cost of one Rider. Beijing starts the Heroic Epic. Granary rushed in Nanking.
490 AD (5) Rest and refit time
500 AD (6) We capture Bukhara and Fustat, which will give us a native source of saltpeter soon once we can connect it. I'm not in a hurry to do so though- it's much cheaper to hurry pikemen for now.
510 AD (7) We capture Cheju at the cost of 2 riders - it does give us gems though.
520 AD (8) We capture Ulsan and make peace with the Koreans - there are enough Zulu and Bab knights around to finish off the Koreans. The Koreans give us Navigation, a worker, 43 gold and 13gpt for peace. I hurry temples in Fustat and Wonsan. The luxury rate can now be turned off because of the market in Shanghai, and we make 291 gpt.
Diplo check reveals the Babs have researched Democracy.
530 AD (9) Rest and refit time
540 AD (10) Sell silks to the Babs for WM, 1gpt and 90 gold to keep them on our good side. The Zulu alliance has also expired - it's probably best to cancel it now. On the other hand, we have the Arabs on the run and a shift in focus from infrastructure to more Riders will help us capture even more of their territory.
I also rush some pikes and temples where needed.
In hindsight it might have been better to take Seoul too, but there will be time for that later. Our forces are now somewhat scattered but by combining the troops in Bukhara and Ulsan, we'll have a decent SOD again. I left an open place in the Army for possible future leader-generating Riders, although adding a cav later on would work too.
We are only behind by Democracy and our income is over 300 gpt now - we're in real fine shape.
A final thing I just noticed is that Shanghai didn't pick a high-food tile after growing to size 10. Please fix, we can get it up to size 12 pretty quickly now and only then MM for production.
the save
IT Arabs have gathered 2 Longbow miniSOD's - 11 longbows total and a pike and a spear
450 AD (1) The FP completes in Shanghai and the bank in Beijing. Our income jumps by 70 gpt. ! An elite attack on one of the longbows generates our first Leader, Kuang'yin ! For its great victory to the north of our empire, the Rider unit is renamed Light of the North, or Aurora Borealis
Of course, this happens after our FP is complete (I actually considered slowing down construction last turn ! If only... From a purely topographical standpoint, the FP might have been better off in Jack's G). We massacre all the longbows; hopefully Mansura will fall next turn.Luxes go to 10% due to emerging WW in some cities
IT Another 2 longbows emerge out of Mansura and kill a rider.
460 AD (2) We take Mansura. Kuang'Yin builds an Army. Before deciding who to fill it with, I have another elite attack a longbow and we get the GL Sun Tzu ! The Shillen Tzu's are added into the army. I'll turn Sun into JS Bach's. I buy Metallurgy (which just came in) from the Babs for 68 gpt and sell it to the Celts for Music Theory and 10gpt. Then, and this may be
, I rush JS Bach's on the spot. I don't think it's too great a risk. Mansura hasn't had a culture expansion yet and is only size 3.470 AD (3) We redeclare war on Korea to get rid of the 36 gpt payment - otherwise we'll be bound to the treaty for 20 more turns. Completion of Bach isn't enough to turn off luxes yet, it appears. The Zul steal the town of Taejon from us, which is a pity, as we wanted its furs. We massacre some more longbows as we rest and refit.
480 AD (4) Capture Pyongson with 4 workers and a catapult. Capture Wonsan at the cost of one Rider. Beijing starts the Heroic Epic. Granary rushed in Nanking.
490 AD (5) Rest and refit time
500 AD (6) We capture Bukhara and Fustat, which will give us a native source of saltpeter soon once we can connect it. I'm not in a hurry to do so though- it's much cheaper to hurry pikemen for now.
510 AD (7) We capture Cheju at the cost of 2 riders - it does give us gems though.
520 AD (8) We capture Ulsan and make peace with the Koreans - there are enough Zulu and Bab knights around to finish off the Koreans. The Koreans give us Navigation, a worker, 43 gold and 13gpt for peace. I hurry temples in Fustat and Wonsan. The luxury rate can now be turned off because of the market in Shanghai, and we make 291 gpt.
Diplo check reveals the Babs have researched Democracy.
530 AD (9) Rest and refit time
540 AD (10) Sell silks to the Babs for WM, 1gpt and 90 gold to keep them on our good side. The Zulu alliance has also expired - it's probably best to cancel it now. On the other hand, we have the Arabs on the run and a shift in focus from infrastructure to more Riders will help us capture even more of their territory.
I also rush some pikes and temples where needed.
In hindsight it might have been better to take Seoul too, but there will be time for that later. Our forces are now somewhat scattered but by combining the troops in Bukhara and Ulsan, we'll have a decent SOD again. I left an open place in the Army for possible future leader-generating Riders, although adding a cav later on would work too.
We are only behind by Democracy and our income is over 300 gpt now - we're in real fine shape.
A final thing I just noticed is that Shanghai didn't pick a high-food tile after growing to size 10. Please fix, we can get it up to size 12 pretty quickly now and only then MM for production.
the save
jack merchant
Internationalist
And a picture of our new lands:
Aggie
Deity
This is not HOT3, that's very clear. 
We are in a strong position although we lost a settler at the start.
Who is up now? Borealis?
We are in a strong position although we lost a settler at the start.Who is up now? Borealis?
jack merchant
Internationalist
If she can take it now, that would be fine by me. If we want to stick to the roster, you would be up again
Since CG said that he wouldn't be back until Tuesday, I would propose changing the roster to this:
Jack Merchant
Borealis
Aggie
Shillen
Cgannon
And then stick to that order. Also, please forgive me for taking it so quickly - I'm enjoying this game
Since CG said that he wouldn't be back until Tuesday, I would propose changing the roster to this:
Jack Merchant
Borealis
Aggie
Shillen
Cgannon
And then stick to that order. Also, please forgive me for taking it so quickly - I'm enjoying this game
Aggie
Deity
Solid turn, again Bach is an important wonder to have. We still are leader in the important demographics categories.
However, I've got a few questions (not too many of them):
- Why didn't you take Seoul? It has Sun Tzu!
- Why don't we have a lone scientist? There's always a far away city were this doesn't hurt. Democracy would be a nice lone scientist tech.
Narjan has Leo. That's not too difficult too grab
Another target is Damascus, for the ivory.
Bach is an important wonder to have. We still are leader in the important demographics categories.However, I've got a few questions (not too many of them):
- Why didn't you take Seoul? It has Sun Tzu!
- Why don't we have a lone scientist? There's always a far away city were this doesn't hurt. Democracy would be a nice lone scientist tech.
Narjan has Leo. That's not too difficult too grab
Another target is Damascus, for the ivory.
jack merchant
Internationalist
Figures; I reread the last two turns to get up to speed as to what was happening, but missed that little tidbit. What with fighting the Arabs, I don't think I'd have been able to gather enough forces to take Seoul anyway.
I have become somewhat disenchanted with the lone-scientist research on deity. It will work in the ancient age, but after that it generally fails. As it is, the Babs did get democracy over 30 turns before our lone scientist would have brought it in. Not much use then.
Najran should be a cinch to take - I've only encountered Arab spears and the occasional pike. Plus with our Riders moving so fast they don't get the time to reinforce. But Bukhara hasn't been pacified yet.
I have become somewhat disenchanted with the lone-scientist research on deity. It will work in the ancient age, but after that it generally fails. As it is, the Babs did get democracy over 30 turns before our lone scientist would have brought it in. Not much use then.
Najran should be a cinch to take - I've only encountered Arab spears and the occasional pike. Plus with our Riders moving so fast they don't get the time to reinforce. But Bukhara hasn't been pacified yet.
cgannon64
BOB DYLAN'S ROCKIN OUT!
Now I'm really going to be out for a while. Disassembling the computer after this post - I'll have internet in the new place by Wednesday or so. See y'all in a few days. Good luck while I'm gone.
Good luck while I'm gone. 
Great turn Jack. Our economy is simply booming.
Nice job with the leaders. I also would have rushed Bach's, but I would have done it before building an army. You lucked out with a second leader though so same result.
Too bad about making peace with Korea when they had Sun Tzu. I didn't know they had it either though. For some reason I thought the Zulus did. It doesn't matter, we'll just take it later from whoever takes it from them.
I'm extremely worried about culture flips with Arabia. They have 3 times our culture and the cities are far from our capital. I think this is one of those times you want to position your troops outside their cities. We can take them back easily because they'll only get a spearman for defense. Also they have no fast units so their longbows can't reach the undefended cities without first stepping into our borders where we can kill them easily. It's too bad we don't have any really corrupt cities to rush native settlers out of.
If I look far into the future and we conquer a lot of Arabian cities it will probably be worthwhile to rush our Palace in Mecca with a leader. I imagine if we get courthouses in our old core the FP will keep them all productive and Arabia has really nice land.
edit: Oh yeah after the marketplace in Pusan I'd make it into a worker factory. It will easily be able to build a worker every 2 turns, maybe even 3 every 4 turns if we rush a courthouse. This will be a great asset when rails come along and we can also join workers into our other cities to get them all to 12 quickly. After we have rails I'm sure it can get to a worker every turn. Then after hospitals we can mass join workers and get them all working every available tile.
Nice job with the leaders. I also would have rushed Bach's, but I would have done it before building an army. You lucked out with a second leader though so same result.
Too bad about making peace with Korea when they had Sun Tzu. I didn't know they had it either though. For some reason I thought the Zulus did. It doesn't matter, we'll just take it later from whoever takes it from them.
I'm extremely worried about culture flips with Arabia. They have 3 times our culture and the cities are far from our capital. I think this is one of those times you want to position your troops outside their cities. We can take them back easily because they'll only get a spearman for defense. Also they have no fast units so their longbows can't reach the undefended cities without first stepping into our borders where we can kill them easily. It's too bad we don't have any really corrupt cities to rush native settlers out of.
If I look far into the future and we conquer a lot of Arabian cities it will probably be worthwhile to rush our Palace in Mecca with a leader. I imagine if we get courthouses in our old core the FP will keep them all productive and Arabia has really nice land.
edit: Oh yeah after the marketplace in Pusan I'd make it into a worker factory. It will easily be able to build a worker every 2 turns, maybe even 3 every 4 turns if we rush a courthouse. This will be a great asset when rails come along and we can also join workers into our other cities to get them all to 12 quickly. After we have rails I'm sure it can get to a worker every turn. Then after hospitals we can mass join workers and get them all working every available tile.
Aggie
Deity
Absolutely. We must have a 2nd core.
You know we also have the option of starting to do our own research. Just because I was curious I checked how quickly we could learn Physics by turning the science slider up. We could get it in 14 turns with a positive income. Considering we're still trading away 68gpt and we have no libraries built anywhere that's pretty good. I imagine if we got libraries in all our cities that number would drop to 7 turns or so, add in universities and we could get down to the 5 or 6 turn mark. And that's with a not great positioned FP.
I'm just throwing out this option and not really endorsing it. If we were going for a space victory or something then I'd say we should do it. But since we have a military objective I think we should just continue rolling over our enemies while they research for us. But I don't think it would hurt if the opportunity arose for some of our cities to start building libraries. Right now we really need the military production, though.
I'm just throwing out this option and not really endorsing it. If we were going for a space victory or something then I'd say we should do it. But since we have a military objective I think we should just continue rolling over our enemies while they research for us. But I don't think it would hurt if the opportunity arose for some of our cities to start building libraries. Right now we really need the military production, though.
jack merchant
Internationalist
I agree on the research - in fact, I played with the slider a little, too. Once we get some libraries going, we'll be a pretty decent research center.
For now, Riders are the name of the game. This is one of the easier deity games I've played so far.
For now, Riders are the name of the game. This is one of the easier deity games I've played so far.
Is it easier or are we just getting better at playing? I guess all the AI wars did slow down the tech pace a bunch and reducing the number of AI's helped us. But I wouldn't discount how well we've done by saying the game was easy. Sure we had trouble early with the lost settler and workers but we stuck in it and managed to come back from behind.
Each time I play a new game it seems easier to me. Only a month or so ago I was still having trouble with emperor. My last emperor game I played was so easy for me it wasn't funny. I had complete control of the game from the ancient age on. Do I think the game was easier than the ones I played last month? I doubt it. It's just all the learning and practive I've had over the last month.
jack merchant
Internationalist
True - however, the amount of space available for expansion certainly helped. I'm now playing a deity light pbem (with one less AI settler at the start) where I was forced to go to war with archers due to being hemmed in at the edge of the continent. Right now I'm probably about 7 techs behind - that one is decidedly more difficult. GOTM19, OTOH, is a cinch so far. It's not just our playing skill - it's also circumstances out of our control.
Certainly we have become better players though - and as such, I suggest a proper deity game next time around
Certainly we have become better players though - and as such, I suggest a proper deity game next time around
Aggie
Deity
Ahem, isn't this a proper one? Oh I remember: one less AI civ. We are talking about victory already, but we still have to do a lot to actually win. It looks good, let's keep the momentum
You should play QSC18r3, the quick game in the GOTM forums. The one where he converted GOTM18 into a deity game. The AI's not only get their usual settler and workers, but they get the extra workers that Cracker gave them. Also if you remember the map there were very few luxuries and resources near our start position while the AI's had multiple sources of iron, horses, and luxuries. Talk about a rough game. Their expansion rate is even faster than normal because of the extra workers, the tech rate flies because it's a pangaea map and all their free units go charging for the barbarian land and meet up with each other real early. Your only chance is to wage an early middle age war to acquire more territory/luxuries/resources. But that isn't helped by the fact that you're surrounded by civ's with 3 defense UU's.
jack merchant
Internationalist
I may try that one - but the PBEMs, SG's and GOTM19 come first (although I haven't got a chance of actually competing there - too much sloppy play). But that's probably due more to a general character failure - I'm happy to win and I can play well enough to do so, but I can't bring up the focus to win resoundingly and play better than a host of other contestants.
As Aggie said, this one isn't in the bag yet, but we're looking good. I'm not too sure about the palace move though. Won't it compromise our best cities too much ? After RR, it won't matter, but moving it earlier than that and it may actually hurt our cities.
As Aggie said, this one isn't in the bag yet, but we're looking good. I'm not too sure about the palace move though. Won't it compromise our best cities too much ? After RR, it won't matter, but moving it earlier than that and it may actually hurt our cities.
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