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ChristosIOT I

Discussion in 'Imperium OffTopicum' started by christos200, Jul 25, 2012.

  1. Ailedhoo

    Ailedhoo wonderer

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    Er Chris... you know after the drones we could say "lets all make a treatry" and then we all win? "Remove all" types of games are not grand of IOTs unless you set out as a blantent Risk but we have allainces and ecomonic system that is not of Risk.

    Hence I am with AA and if AA wants we can set a vote whether to continue this game or not: AA is a grand player and a important IOTer. His views are vital to consider.
     
  2. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

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    "Remove all" types of games are pretty much the heart of IOTs. Some games are more blatant than others, but every game has players trying to advance their power and prestige relative to others.

    Every IOT. There is actually no one to make it otherwise without even more complex mechanics. You're being very hard on Christos on this, and I do not see why.

    In the end, we weighed everything and we made the decision that nuclear war followed by recolonization and fallout scrubbing is the better path to go than dealing with the Dominion and Eurasian-spanning Huns once the droids are dealt with.

    Finally, and this is important, MAD did not factor in. We launched a first strike and while we may be hurt a tad next turn, we ultimately have won this war and, therefore, in the name of survival, it is highly recommended that the parties involved just surrendered.
     
  3. Double A

    Double A wak

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    If you had beaten me in a conventional war, I wouldn't be making this big of a deal, because then I would have gotten some fun out of it. Or if I had made a single hostile action to you.

    This was just a sucker punch to my nuts. From a goddamn mecha.
     
  4. christos200

    christos200 Never tell me the odds

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    OOC: it's not my fault if NATO decided to nuke you. I did not encourage them to do this.
     
  5. Double A

    Double A wak

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    I'm only annoyed with you because you clearly told them stuff that was only hinted at before. I'm downright pissed at them.
     
  6. christos200

    christos200 Never tell me the odds

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    OOC: Anyway, assuming I had told you that nuking all other nations would win you the game, would you have predicted the attack?
     
  7. Double A

    Double A wak

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    No, because nuking everyone is the least fun way to win a game unless there's tons and tons of buildup. Then it's dramatic and stuff.
     
  8. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

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    There was. One built up 3000 IC and the other constantly harassed us in the Americas. Unfortunately, the one with 3000 IC decided to enter Alaska after we explicitly informed the Dominion they are not allowed to do that.

    Since the chance of pushing one to the either was too high, it was simply in our interests to put all dogs involved down.

    Edit: The fact our targets didn't have their own arsenals helped with the decision immensely.
     
  9. christos200

    christos200 Never tell me the odds

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    OOC: Anyway, I hope that everyone still wants to continue the game. I will update in a few hours. I will also allow humans to build Shields to be protected from Nukes.
     
  10. Ailedhoo

    Ailedhoo wonderer

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    OOC: you should have done that earlier... perhapes when you introduced the nukes!

    Serious: this game is not worth continuing. I agree with AA that the nukes took the fun out of it.

    ...and Sone might want to look how IOTs are played: although this is mainly because they no do reach the end the players are playing nations. Considerations are considerations.

    ...and Sone could have set diplomatic channels for Alaska to be exchanged from AA to the USA. Now all we have is NATO (the real villains: seriously they are "KILL ALL!" nuke tactic was not going to spare many civilians...) is pushing around. I think the game is dead. It has died many times but got back up again. Now it is dead dead. Nukes are no fun in they way they have been used and Chris should not hint the usage of nukes.
     
  11. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

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    We could have.

    We didn't.

    In the end, I made a decision any other rational state actor would do. The game isn't dead, but if the Dominion wishes to collapse itself in spite, by all means, do so. NATO still has to answer the Droid Question and those who don't submit and sign the peace treaty.

    Christos, again, did not hint as the usage of nukes. This was a decision reached by the USA and RSA and Christos, if anything, recommended against use using the weapons.

    Finally, I've been running IOTs years before you even joined the site, so I sorta/kinda know how IOTs are played. I know that in IOTs, the only thing keeping players from nuking each other in games with nuclear weapons, if they're acting as sane state actors, is the fact both parties have nuclear weapons.

    You had no way to resist us, so when everything is said and done, I would make the same decision.

    We entered a state of total war. In total war, civilians work your farms and factories. They, therefore, were our enemies just as much as their government.

    But none of this matters, for we have won the war suffering only acceptable casualties. The death of hundreds of millions of enemies is, to me, no different from putting down rabid dogs.
     
  12. Double A

    Double A wak

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    I attacked Alaska for explicitly one reason. If you had asked for it, I would have given it to you. I've made no overtones of hostility in this game - I've been benign and helpful. If I was Black Hole, I probably wouldn't care. Sure, I'd be ticked that all my work had gone to waste, but this was essentially LOL LET'S BEAT DOUBLE A UP FOR NOT BEING A DICK.

    Did you even consider I would've joined NATO if you had asked? This is just the most ridiculous, arbitrary, and Chaotic Stupid war I've ever been a participant in.
     
  13. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

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    You were neutral. With enemies, you know where they stand. Neutrals? You never know. Especially when said neutral has 3000 IC.

    In either, what is done is done and I have already washed my hands of the question of legitimacy of the action and am instead awaiting the slew of unconditional surrenders.
     
  14. Double A

    Double A wak

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    That's the most hilarious thing you've ever said.
     
  15. Ailedhoo

    Ailedhoo wonderer

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    Er Sone... a rational actor would not nuke a power like that. You killed millions of people, the majority civilians. To say it was justified is... immoral... well IC wise I mean but it would not be wise to label such as noted.

    It is unrational to not make a diplomatic comment to AA. All happened is the fun was sweped from the game.

    In the end the game is not worth continuing. What we learned is that Christos needs to improve nuclear weopons so they can be set not as unfun. 50IC is cheap for something that can remove entire armies. To this end I am displeased how the nuclear set was noted and agree with AA.
     
  16. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

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    It is no different from a rational state actor destroying Hiroshima or bombing Dresden, now it it? I don't care much about your civilians, because I don't answer to them in elections. Thankfully, I don't have to answer to them ever again.

    If the Dominion wishes to collapse or surrender, do so. Don't think the NATO Powers will collapse because of it. We will continue the war against the Dominion if they do not surrender immediately, and then we will deal with the droids on our own terms. After which, we will rebuild metropolitan areas and recolonize the bombed areas with government-funded settlers.
     
  17. Ailedhoo

    Ailedhoo wonderer

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    Implying I reguard the fate of Dresden and Hiroshima as rational.

    Your population may not reguard you well. Your glade this game does not have a stability mechanic because your citizens would be in horror of what you did...

    I am talking OOC Sone! I am being serious! This game is over because of the lack of consideration to fun and the failings in Chris's mechanics reguarding nukes, plus he did not make things public and by that I mean the FAQ.

    ...and next turn you would simply nuke me again. The game is over. It has entered "nuke all" phase. It ended with the nukes. I suggest Chris moves onto another project.
     
  18. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

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    I believe not. I believe my people are happy that the government has set into motion the process of building a new world suited to their interests. Even if they're not, oh well, I'm in charge. I control the military and if people are seriously going to pick up arms against their government because the government used nuclear weapons against peoples they'll never see again, well, I'll put them down just as easily. I doubt it'll come to that though.

    There were no failings. How nuclear weapons work are clearly laid out in the OP and we had the advantage of being the only ones who bothered to build them.

    I don't think you understand how difficult it is to include every single question asked by players in a FAQ. In RIOT, I have players who have asked extremely good questions and, since they had the foresight to ask me directly or ask in the social groups, the knowledge is completely contained within themselves.

    Knowledge is a weapon. And a ruleset can't be designed to answer every possible question. Ain't no one got time for that.

    I suggest he finishes the game. Some of us still have droids to eradicate.
     
  19. Ailedhoo

    Ailedhoo wonderer

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    Wait... I think we just found the true fascist power in the game. The Dominion are tame compared to your threatening power!

    Well... the game has a realy downing ending. I guess ChristosIOT II will be the rebellion against the winners of this game.

    Chris did have interests in making a sequel. I can offer Chris advise on units and on a debate on how to set superweopons. Fear not: it will in the end be of improvement.



    Clearly laid out does not mean not failing. The reason why I did not use nukes was because I was setting focus on ecomonic considerations. That and I like challange.

    Then I suggest we set it law that it must be open. Seriously: this information is of vital considerations. Even Tani appears to have knowing of this as shown by Terios!

    Chris has. He will have to do some improvements for next time.

    To be fair to Chris the game, while flawed, was fun and he did heed advice on improvements.

    So happens Chris said we would be able to play the driods in ChristosIOT II. The USA have already proven dominion in a villainius way. The drones stand no chance. Such unstoppable victory is boring as it is without challange. Challange is important.

    In unrelative news I might consider setting a allaince with AA in ChristosIOT II... if we are both in it that is...
     
  20. Sonereal

    Sonereal ♫We got the guillotine♫ Supporter

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    :shrug:

    Check Sons of Mars 3 how I deal with rebellions (hint, it also involved nukes).

    Besides some balance issues with the lower-tier units, I actually thought Christos wrote a decent ruleset.


    So when you get destroyed by a mechanic you neglected to care for, you're annoyed?


    No. Players who ask smart questions, and players who ally with players who ask smart questions, should have the advantage in knowledge. That is why IOT chat players are typically better than ones who aren't on the chat, unless that player is named Krz or Bsmith because I love their orders in every possible way and they don't even need to ask questions 99% of the time.
     

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