Civ 5 Design Challenge IV - History/Eras

[Natan35]

America (Barack Obama)

UA: The Obama Doctrine -
For every city-state ally you have, you will gain a boost in your cities depending on the city-state's type. (Details Below) Whenever another civilization has declared friendship with you gain +1 Delegate in the World Congress for however long they maintain the friendship.

UU: Infiltrator (Replaces Riflemen) -
Whenever a unit is killed by the Infiltrator you are granted a boost to Science .

UB: House of Congress (Replaces University) -
Influence with city-states is earned 10% faster. Great Scientists are born 15% quicker.

Details for City-State Bonuses .

Spoiler :

Maritime - +1 Food Boost
Militaristic - +1 Production Boost
Mercantile - +1 Gold Boost
Religious - +1 Faith Boost
Cultured - +1 Culture Boost

I do not mean to be rude, but please stop it. I'm under the impression you treat designs as if they're obvious and could be "pumped out" instantly. It doesn't work this way. Sometimes, it takes me an hour from the moment I finish reading a Wiki page until the moment I even start writing the design itself. Your attitude - the fact you said that you "had" to finish the design - is just wrong. You aren't obliged to post designs. But, and especially in challenges, you are obliged to have some sort of connection between what you post to the civilization its supposed to represent. You were tasked with the creation of a modern era civ, so you can't give it a rifleman replacement. And can you please explain me, what is the Obama doctrine? As far as I'm concerned, any friendships other nations have with the US have benefited the other side much more, or at least as much as they have benefited the US. And what does the house of congress has to do with universities?

I'm not asking you or anyone to be perfect, I know very well that my designs arnt perfectly representative. I know that not all designs have to be the same, I know that some might desire their designs to be unique. But I'm certain that there are better ways to do so.... I do not intend to offend anyone, you may ask me to stop criticizing you. I will stop if you ask me, but... Well, I'm only criticizing things if I can't understand them. I would be more than happy to hear an explanation to the choice of components in your design, but given the fact there was no such explanation, I just had to point out some things.

 

[Ajsieg]

I do not mean to be rude, but please stop it. I'm under the impression you treat designs as if they're obvious and could be "pumped out" instantly. It doesn't work this way. Sometimes, it takes me an hour from the moment I finish reading a Wiki page until the moment I even start writing the design itself. Your attitude - the fact you said that you "had" to finish the design - is just wrong. You aren't obliged to post designs. But, and especially in challenges, you are obliged to have some sort of connection between what you post to the civilization its supposed to represent. You were tasked with the creation of a modern era civ, so you can't give it a rifleman replacement. And can you please explain me, what is the Obama doctrine? As far as I'm concerned, any friendships other nations have with the US have benefited the other side much more, or at least as much as they have benefited the US. And what does the house of congress has to do with universities?

I'm not asking you or anyone to be perfect, I know very well that my designs arnt perfectly representative. I know that not all designs have to be the same, I know that some might desire their designs to be unique. But I'm certain that there are better ways to do so.... I do not intend to offend anyone, you may ask me to stop criticizing you. I will stop if you ask me, but... Well, I'm only criticizing things if I can't understand them. I would be more than happy to hear an explanation to the choice of components in your design, but given the fact there was no such explanation, I just had to point out some things.

I agree his designs might not be fleshed out than you or somebody else, but you could've said it a lot more nicer by suggesting things instead of blatantly telling him that you don't understand and that he needs to "stop it".
I agree making designs can take a little bit. My Spain design took an hour because I was balancing and thinking on how to improve it.

But my main problem is that since I've been on and before even that when I was lurking, I always got a feeling that you thought you were better than everyone else. I'm not saying you are. This is just my opinion. I'm sorry if you're offended. Wasn't my intention. I know you like to give your feedback and have your own idea for the civ a modder wants to make and that's not my problem, but how you say things have a bad tone. My point is that maybe you come things at a different angle.

This is more of I agree with you, but you could've said it in a different way. Also if you want to critque my Spain design, I'm more than happy you hear it out if you're confused on something. I thought I did an interesting job on it so i would like to hear an opinion on how I did .

 

[inthesomeday]

Also don't criticize someone for going out of time period when, technically, all of the designs should have all uniques from the atomic and info era. I mean the argument that it's a bit too early could be easily applied to your design, too; military science, where your UI is unlocked, comes at the same tech tier as rifling, and the tank unit is technically meant to represent tanks used during WWII. If we're going to nitpick here the armor unit you should be replacing is the modern armor, the tank unit meant to represent armor from the Cold War on. Of course, I would never make these complaints because to me they seem rather nitpicky and overly critical, and if I wanted to disdain your design because, for example, +1 science and +2 culture are utterly irrelevant by military science and the UI is basically worthless, then I wouldn't express that until the voting period, and I would express it by, pretty simply, not voting for you.
It's true these challenges are meant as a forum for discussion and idea exchange, but there are ways to express that other than through perceivably insulting language and rudeness. Keniisu takes criticism pretty well, so I don't think he'll be complaining at all, as at its core what you said was constructive, but I think there are ways you could go about it more kindly. Either way, we shouldn't start an argument on this design thread so this will be my last post to the subject. I agree with Ajsieg that you should work on your polite discourse. I disagree, though, about Keniisu's design, I actually quite like it, and feel it represents the extractory/exploitative nature of American foreign policy.

 

[Natan35]

Also don't criticize someone for going out of time period when, technically, all of the designs should have all uniques from the atomic and info era. I mean the argument that it's a bit too early could be easily applied to your design, too; military science, where your UI is unlocked, comes at the same tech tier as rifling, and the tank unit is technically meant to represent tanks used during WWII. If we're going to nitpick here the armor unit you should be replacing is the modern armor, the tank unit meant to represent armor from the Cold War on. Of course, I would never make these complaints because to me they seem rather nitpicky and overly critical, and if I wanted to disdain your design because, for example, +1 science and +2 culture are utterly irrelevant by military science and the UI is basically worthless, then I wouldn't express that until the voting period, and I would express it by, pretty simply, not voting for you.
It's true these challenges are meant as a forum for discussion and idea exchange, but there are ways to express that other than through perceivably insulting language and rudeness. Keniisu takes criticism pretty well, so I don't think he'll be complaining at all, as at its core what you said was constructive, but I think there are ways you could go about it more kindly. Either way, we shouldn't start an argument on this design thread so this will be my last post to the subject. I agree with Ajsieg that you should work on your polite discourse. I disagree, though, about Keniisu's design, I actually quite like it, and feel it represents the extractory/exploitative nature of American foreign policy.

Insulting language? I honestly don't think that I've used any insults in my posts... I could have wrote it in a better way though...
I'm not saying that I'm above everyone or anyone. Keniisu might as well get more votes than me, but that won't change my opinion.
I suppose that my comment* on his design was hypocritical considering my own design, but again, this doesn't change my opinion. I will change my design though.

And thank you for your criticism.

*

Spoiler :

Frankly, that could be applied to almost every design in this contest. I suppose that it was to be expected considering the length of the information era in game....

 

[Keniisu]

I'm not going to say much besides that I do his criticisms as honest. They could have honestly been phrased much better and nicer, but the blatancy of it does get the point across. I do have one gripe though. I don't pump out designs for the sake of it. In fact I spend almost an hour or sometimes even two coming up with it and then afterwards usually spend some time tweaking it to be to the point where I personally feel it's well-developed. I do need some assistance with it as I do feel I could be more unique, creative or whatever with it. However that's something I'll need to improve on overtime and I have to say from the feedback I'm getting on my some of my latest ones I think its getting more better.

Last note is that even though Natan35 put it bluntly, I still do respect his words nonetheless as they are his honest thoughts on it.

 

[Klisz]

I do not mean to be rude, but please stop it.

Wait, what in particular are you asking him to stop doing? Posting designs altogether?

But, and especially in challenges, you are obliged to have some sort of connection between what you post to the civilization its supposed to represent. You were tasked with the creation of a modern era civ, so you can't give it a rifleman replacement.

Sure you can. Spreading a civ's uniques over a few eras makes it more fun to play, IMHO, and gameplay concerns like fun and balance are much more important than realism and thematic appropriateness.

And can you please explain me, what is the Obama doctrine?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obama_Doctrine

And what does the house of congress has to do with universities?

 

[inthesomeday]

Either way, I think we should move on to a more constructive topic of conversation, maybe one pertaining to the thread.

 

[NiaoMeow]

All T no shade, designs should not be created. They should flow from you. It's the reason I cannot think of a complete Mongolia design.

If you are making yourself create a design to win a challenge, it shows.

 

[Natan35]

Wait, what in particular are you asking him to stop doing? Posting designs altogether?



Sure you can. Spreading a civ's uniques over a few eras makes it more fun to play, IMHO, and gameplay concerns like fun and balance are much more important than realism and thematic appropriateness.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obama_Doctrine

@Keniisu: you said just enough. And exactly what I wanted to hear.
I should really work on my phrasing though, I'm aware of that. Has to do with English not being my first language, and the fact I'm a schoolboy, literally.

@inthesomeday: you don't move topics, you create them. I'd rather derail a thread than see it die\ temporarily shut down...
Now on to the quoted post: I'm not asking him to stop posting designs, I'm asking him to change the way he views designing. Besides that, the fact that Firaxis does something (which I do not agree with) doesn't make it ideal. And thanks for the link, I'll be sure to read it.

 

[senshidenshi]

the fact that Firaxis does something (which I do not agree with) doesn't make it ideal.

This. Sooooo much this. Designing civs is about creativity, and basically the only consistently(?) creative Firaxis civs are Assyria and Indonesia. Maya UA is pretty creative, but their UU and UB are tedious. And neither of them are that great :/

I haven't submitted a design for this or any other era because I don't know. For this one it's because I don't know anything about politics.

 

[kul]

I haven't submitted a design for this or any other era because I don't know. For this one it's because I don't know anything about politics.[/SIZE]

Dont let all those science's talk above get into you Senshi, just wrote about something you know. Like your Current Town Mayor's Civilization, or Meme Civilization. With the recent adult video written in Memes, I think they had a chance to become relevant again.

 

[senshidenshi]

Dont let all those science's talk above get into you Senshi, just wrote about something you know. Like your Current Town Mayor's Civilization, or Meme Civilization. With the recent adult video written in Memes, I think they had a chance to become relevant again.

Que?
Temur's basically a meme, innit?

 

[Natan35]

New design!

State of Israel(Benjamin Nethanyahu)
UA: New Middle ISt
Gain a 5% combat bonus against civilizations per each time you denounced them or one of their friends. During wars, WLtKDs in cities continue as long as they haven't been damaged and reduce unhappiness from population.

UB: Bahad
Replaces military base. Unlike it, the Bahad increases starting XP for units trained in the city by 15. During WLtKDs, units trained in the city start with extra strength equal to the local happiness.

UU: Merkava
Replaces Modern Armor. Ignores ZOC and terrain costs in desert and snow. Has the trophy promotion, making it take 33% less damage when fighting ranged units.

 

[Keniisu]

Voting has begun and shall end on 3/7/2016

 

[inthesomeday]

I'll go with einayim, I have a soft spot for revolutionary civs and it's got nice, well-balanced uniques that don't make it over or underwhelming.

 

[Ajsieg]

I Vote for Uighur Caesar's design

Spoiler :

 

[Uighur_Caesar]

I love that poster lol. My vote goes to inthesomeday.

 

[kul]

Inthesomeday for me as well. I love the synergy. Even if it had some OP tendencies, I think it could be balanced with its time constraint (like what you said)

 

[Natan35]

I vote for Caliph Scott's design. Superb synergy, and I quite like how the UA and the UU could work together.

 

[Keniisu]

Voting hath ended
Let's take a look at who won...

» Urdnot_Scott - 1
» Inthesomeday - 3 (I vote for Inthesomeday as well...)
» Uighur_Caesar - 1
» Einayim - 1

Congrats Inthesomeday for winning this challenge. The next design challenge choice is yours!