Civ V Ideas & Suggestions Summary

[Decimatus]

You should be able to direct the distribution of hammers, gold, and food to whatever city you want, which would be more inefficient depending on distances, obstacles like rivers and mountain ranges, as well as techs that greatly increase distribution.

That distribution would become more or less automated depending on your economic civic choices. If you choose a Socialistic civic, you micromanage everything. If you choose a Capitalistic civic you can subsidize here and there but commerce, trade and production happen mostly automatic with big bonuses compared to the command economies.

When the industrial age starts, there should be great incentive to plow over the tiles around industrial cities to make room for industrial parks. These parks would provide trade goods, vital resources for war efforts, and major targets for carpet bombing campaigns.

Going into the industrial age quite a change of pace, with most of the major powers quickly copying progress and following suit, unless they are super far behind. IE their tech speed should increase to catch up, since really in an industrial world, if england sees france building factories, they start building their own, whether they have "researched" the tech or not.

I think Obama should be a leader in Civ 5.


HaHaHa

I think you should be able to create your own leader in Civ 5 as well as hundreds of real world choices.

When making your leader, you get a choice of 1 UU and UB per era, as well as a choice of 2-3 of the leader traits(or you choose their preferred civics).

Maybe have random events where you can change leader traits mid-game.

Actually, instead of leader traits, there should be civ traits. Similar to current leader traits.

For the leaders, they should get bonus's swhen you use the civics that they are known for.

If you are playing as Abe Lincoln and use the slavery civic, you get negative happiness. But if you use freedom related civics you get bonuses to happiness.

 

[Camikaze]

When you say 'You should be able to direct the distribution of hammers, gold and food', do you mean direct the distribution as in direct what cities your tile output goes towards, or direct what your tiles produce in the first place?

And on modern day leaders, one of my biggest and most unrealistic wants is to have a modern world scenario on an absolutely ridiculously large map, with all present day leaders and countries. That would be pure awesomeness.

 

[Decimatus]

When you say 'You should be able to direct the distribution of hammers, gold and food', do you mean direct the distribution as in direct what cities your tile output goes towards, or direct what your tiles produce in the first place?

And on modern day leaders, one of my biggest and most unrealistic wants is to have a modern world scenario on an absolutely ridiculously large map, with all present day leaders and countries. That would be pure awesomeness.

I mean one city has hammers, food, and gold in one city, but you can route those those to other cities nearby, or even far far away later in the game.

Your grassland super food producer sheds all its excess food to the nearby metropolis(s) so that those cities can work on more important things like tanks, commerce, and whathaveyou.

Same for hammers, though perhaps in a different manner. The hammers should be actively turned into a resource of some kind. In the host city, you use your hammers in your workshop, and get sword resources, a finite quantity, which makes its way to the barracks in the next city over, which can then pump out some swordsman.

Hammers should really be citizen based as opposed to tile based. Each citizen starts with 1 hammer. If he applies that hammer to a hill, he gets some resources. Those resources go to the forge which then turns them into weapons/whatever. Or the hammer works the field, and makes some food. If you have surplus of anything you can route the food certain distances, further and further with techs, roads, etc.

You shouldn't even have a slider for science, not before organized education anyway. Science should be a byproduct of commerce and production and should be relatively random(relative to the assembly line tech tree in civ1-4) in the beginning. In the beginning, researching tech should be by doing certain things. If you mine enough hills for copper while training warriors in your city, you gain points toward bronzeworking. If your citizens work enough hills, they learn about mining.

The more scientist specialists you have in a city of a certain industry, the more tech related to the industry you develop. Which is amplified by having libraries and the like. In fact, your average library should do more to give your civ tech from other civs than it does generating tech by itself. Libraries aren't as much about new ideas as they are about learning from others.



If a citizen works a hill, they shouldn't just magically make 2 hammers. They should be gathering material, be it copper, wood, stone, etc that is then turned into a more valuable commodity in the city. You can ship the copper to other cities, or turn it into spears/cables/whatever in the city and then ship it.

The resources and trade products should be just as vast, if not much more so than the unit options.

You should be able to specialize cities as the main hub for that certain resource you need.

Having a coal resource next to one city in your empire shouldn't be an afterthought. It should be something that is very important and something that you really want to maximize so that it can fuel the parts of your empire building war machines and consumer products.

I don't believe resource veins should run out on default settings, but I do believe their effectiveness should be capped so that you need to seek out more sources instead of being content with 1 iron to build all the units you will ever need.

For instance, 1 vein of iron might allow 2-3 cities to run full production with iron byproducts(swords, consumer products, etc). Maybe change that value depending upon the map size or a custom map setting.


Whatever happens with civ 5, I hope they sit down and really plan out how they are going to make the economy, because the economy needs to be the bedrock from which you build your civilization and conquer other nations.

Economy shouldn't boil down to 20 gold for tech and 3 gold for treasury. It needs to tie directly and vitally into production and happiness.

I want to see situations arise where civilizations become rich and powerful because they cornered the market on shipbuilding, or autos, or coffee, or all of the above for civs large enough. With an AI that viciously tries to fill in any gaps that the player might have left to fill.

Cornering markets and industries should be far more effective than building wonders, and perhaps more expensive and turn consuming.



If I ever hit the lottery, I may just fund development of a Civ game to compete with ole Sid. This industry needs the competition.

Probably won't happen, but a guy can hope.

 

[Camikaze]

I certainly agree that economic factors need to be more important in the game.

Here are a few threads from the last few months on the topic that you will probably be interested in:
Taking advantage of all land plots and resources, pesgores, 1/1/10
Changing the way terrain tiles are worked, Gangor, 14/12/09
Importing food, aimeeandbeatles, 11/9/09

 

[zeusbenedict]

Just some suggestions:

Unit builder.
Additional defensive structures like towers and walls.
Actual ranged attacks.
Migration of population to other cities which can lead to taking over it. Or something like that.
Additional options for international organizations.
Tourism.
Significance of obsolete wonders.
Specialization of cities.
Additional stuff for great people and actions that doesn't consume them.
Diseases.
Learning techs by other means, e.g. slowly learning about it from foreigners, internet, reverse engineering or a product of a great idea.
Terraforming.
Contact with extra terrestrials.
More terrain types/features and natural events, e.g. volcanoes = eruptions, storms, whirlpools, earthquakes.
Natural wonders placed all over the world, can be taken by territory borders.
Expansion on civics and religions.
Alliance organizations, e.g. Axis and Allies.
Resource levels on tiles, i.e. plenty, few, scarce, WTFOMG.

And something I don't know what use it could have:
Sub-tiles.

 

[Decimatus]

I certainly agree that economic factors need to be more important in the game.

Here are a few threads from the last few months on the topic that you will probably be interested in:
Taking advantage of all land plots and resources, pesgores, 1/1/10
Changing the way terrain tiles are worked, Gangor, 14/12/09
Importing food, aimeeandbeatles, 11/9/09

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=8825630#post8825630

I was going to reply in one of those threads, but after the reply became ginourmous I made a new thread...

I expanded upon an idea and it seems pretty solid. You could do a lot economically with the model I proposed. Just make resources density based instead of node based, and give it a robust trade system.

 

[702]

This isn't very important, but...
I'd like to see a new terrain type, Ice Sheet. It would be impassable and without any hammers, gold or food, like a mountain, but clearly a land terrain.
So it would be present at high latitude lands in small amounts, and on world maps would cover the southernmost couple of rows of tiles.

 

[Flying Pig]

Actual ranged attacks.

OK. I need a word in here on the military side of Civ. One tile is the size of a mountain or a massive city; we're talking a few square miles. Almost nothing except the biggest artillery peices could ever shoot more than one tile. Likewise, military units are representative of about regiment/brigade sized formations and so the idea of mortar units is stupid as well.

Rant over. Carry on

 

[Camikaze]

This isn't very important, but...
I'd like to see a new terrain type, Ice Sheet. It would be impassable and without any hammers, gold or food, like a mountain, but clearly a land terrain.
So it would be present at high latitude lands in small amounts, and on world maps would cover the southernmost couple of rows of tiles.

This would require a more complex altitude system (well, there isn't really an altitude system at all, as such, currently). Is there any point in having it as well as mountains other than aesthetics?

 

[rysmiel]

This isn't very important, but...
I'd like to see a new terrain type, Ice Sheet. It would be impassable and without any hammers, gold or food, like a mountain, but clearly a land terrain.
So it would be present at high latitude lands in small amounts, and on world maps would cover the southernmost couple of rows of tiles.

No terrain should be impassable, with the right tech. No terrain should be unusable, with the right tech.

 

[Silv Something]

No terrain should be impassable, with the right tech. No terrain should be unusable, with the right tech.

, mostly. Ocean should be useable? Or does that not count as a terrain?

 

[rysmiel]

, mostly. Ocean should be useable? Or does that not count as a terrain?

Ocean should be usable, sure. I've long been a fan of representing factory fishing with a ship unit that can harvest food from adjacent ocean squares and return it to its home city, frex. Or, once you have submarines or so, collecting manganese nodules from the seabed should be possible; the concept's been tested and works in real life, so I think it's a plausible tech to develop in Civ even if you do not want future techs.

 

[Camikaze]

How would you represent the relative miniscule output of such tiles compared to normal tiles without greatly multiplying the output of those productive tiles?

 

[Decimatus]

How would you represent the relative miniscule output of such tiles compared to normal tiles without greatly multiplying the output of those productive tiles?

You use my citizen unit concept. (found in the link a few posts down from this one)

An ocean tile would be worked by a fishing citizen unit(or later perhaps more industrial water mobile citizen units), and would provide ocean type resources back to the nearest cities. Fish, crab, pearls, squid, oil, even minerals later in the future eras.

The resources would be turned into food products and other refined goods back in the city, and then used as food, or in the case of refined goods it would allow production of certain units or end products.

Also, research vessel citizens that would gain good amounts of science production from those undiscovered depths.

 

[Decimatus]

I had another idea that I didn't see on the list.

Renewable resources.

Not windmills and solar.

I am talking about ancient staples here.

Cows, wheat, corn, rice, pigs, and every other grown plant or animal.

You won't find a single civilization in the world that has only a handful of any one of these.

Those resources should start off spread thin, few and far between.

However, they should be resources that your civilization is keen to spread to as many tiles as possible, since they are what you are farming.

Basically, your workers(citizen units in my concept), if they had access to a single wheat, could then plant wheat in any supportive tile on the map(grassland or floodplain, plains, etc).

Same for livestock. You should be able to have whole swaths of territory devoted to cattle ranges if you so choose.

Rice patties as far as the eye can see.

The renewable resources would be continent bound. IE 1 continent has wheat, 1 has rice, another has corn. Another might have pigs and chickens, while all the cows are on another.

Apart from certain exceptions which might be universal over the world, the resources would stay on their home continents until deliberately spread.

American corporation sails into port with wheat and bread. Trades for rice and whatever and makes a killing. The more wheat that spreads to the new continent the less valuable it would be in the future. So you might only bring flour/bread and keep the wheat to yourself for as long as possible to keep the monopoly and exploit the franchises.

Mmmm, make it happen Sid!

 

[rysmiel]

How would you represent the relative miniscule output of such tiles compared to normal tiles without greatly multiplying the output of those productive tiles?

Why should the output of a factory-fished ocean tile be realtively minuscule foodwise compared to that of a sea tile withing the radius of a coastal city ?

 

[Aserjiek]

I had another idea that I didn't see on the list.

Renewable resources.

Not windmills and solar.

I am talking about ancient staples here.

Cows, wheat, corn, rice, pigs, and every other grown plant or animal.

You won't find a single civilization in the world that has only a handful of any one of these.

Those resources should start off spread thin, few and far between.

However, they should be resources that your civilization is keen to spread to as many tiles as possible, since they are what you are farming.

Basically, your workers(citizen units in my concept), if they had access to a single wheat, could then plant wheat in any supportive tile on the map(grassland or floodplain, plains, etc).

Same for livestock. You should be able to have whole swaths of territory devoted to cattle ranges if you so choose.

Rice patties as far as the eye can see.

The renewable resources would be continent bound. IE 1 continent has wheat, 1 has rice, another has corn. Another might have pigs and chickens, while all the cows are on another.

Apart from certain exceptions which might be universal over the world, the resources would stay on their home continents until deliberately spread.

American corporation sails into port with wheat and bread. Trades for rice and whatever and makes a killing. The more wheat that spreads to the new continent the less valuable it would be in the future. So you might only bring flour/bread and keep the wheat to yourself for as long as possible to keep the monopoly and exploit the franchises.

Mmmm, make it happen Sid!

I'm all for the spreading of resources, but due to the fact that most livestock and grains in the game of Civ drain the soil in real life, I think that none could be planted in a tile next to a resource of its type, grains or livestock. Even then, you'd have to revamp the corporations in order to keep cereal mills from becoming to powerful.

 

[rysmiel]

I'm all for the spreading of resources, but due to the fact that most livestock and grains in the game of Civ drain the soil in real life,

Well, that depends on how you manage them. Crop rotation, for example, makes a big difference, for reasons we are only now coming to understand. (To cut a long and complex story short, it's to do with giving the fungi that are symbiotic to the roots of every crop plant of note in the world (except soybeans) a chance to regrow the connecting networks that get damaged when soil is ploughed up or otherwise disturbed.)

I think that none could be planted in a tile next to a resource of its type, grains or livestock.

I don't think spreading a "resource" is the way to do this, because that, to my mind, is what the irrigation/farming tile improvement already represents.

I would be inclined to think this best represented by having a boost to the effectiveness of farming when you discover crop rotation, another when you discover chemical fertilisers, and arguably a third when you discover genetic engineering.

 

[Decimatus]

That is all fine for a game based on hammers, food, and commerce but I think civ 5 should move beyond that.

When you have tiles being worked outside a city, it shouldn't be based so much on how much production or food the tile can produce, as the amount of resources you get from the plot.

For instance the wheat which you spread over your whole civilization is then turned into a certain amount of processed food(breads, cereals, etc) which is then fed to your civilization OR traded and moved to other cities and civlizations.

That also ties into production. It is kind of ridiculous that a hill produces 2 hammers.

The citizen should produce 2 hammers, and he should use those hammers to turn the resources coming from that hill into a refined resource/trade good. IE copper comes in from the hills and the city turns it into swords every X amount of turns which then let you equip a warrior into a swordsman, OR sell those copper swords to other cities or civilizations.

The biggest aspect of altering tile production into resource production is that you open up large aspects of trade that can make the game much much better.

 

[Decimatus]

I'm all for the spreading of resources, but due to the fact that most livestock and grains in the game of Civ drain the soil in real life, I think that none could be planted in a tile next to a resource of its type, grains or livestock. Even then, you'd have to revamp the corporations in order to keep cereal mills from becoming to powerful.

Corporations certainly need to be expanded greatly, and hopefully based on a better base system of trade.

I don't think there should be some artificial limit on where you plant your wheat though. It may be inefficient, but farmers have been using the same plots of thousands of years.

They get by thanks to fertilization, crop rotation(which all happens inside 1 tile), flood soil, etc.

In the early ancient world, many of the major food producing farms should all be located in or around major floodplains.

That is where people congregated and grew cities because that is where all the easy food production was.

It wasn't until much later that the cities expanded out from the floodplains and river valleys, as they started to learn how to manage soil and livestock.