Civ2 in Civ3

Not too shabby, Rodent. :)

Couple of points: The lux slider can be turned down to zero without unhappiness - we are paying 4gpt for nothing - and Science to 100%, shaving two turns off Maths.

And Delphi is badly placed IMO, so badly so that I would suggest that it builds a Settler to replace itself, then be abandoned.

BTW, what level are you comfortable at?
 
Emperor is the level i am comfortable at-

I know Delphi's position sucks, it is just an extension towards carthage.

But you got to see that the landmass pretty much sucks. Also, i hope you noted that we seem to have just the civs we met on a continent and the others must be on another continent

Also i am in favour of attacking carthage in the next few turns or so, they have Numidians so archers may have a hard time
 
I've got it. :)
 
Bumps...

Elear you there, need a skip?
 
Elear has disappeared again. Lets give him a few days and if there's no response, I will play a set.
 
perhaps overseer should play now.....
 
I may take this Sunday, we'll see.
 
Bump again, someone needs to play, play 1 turn, but play !
 
I am playing a Hawk 03 turn-set, right now. I am also up in SGOTM 13, so it may be awhile. If Bucephalus wants a turn first, that'd be great. I might be able to take this sometime this weekend, but no guarantees.
 
Bump....

:)
 
I think I might find a break soon, I am half finished with my CBob04 turnset, and maybe there will be a chance to bang out some turns soon. I seem to get involved with SGs started and staffed by on/off players (Elear, Tad, Kurtson and Kraznaya are on the short list), so I'll try to nurse this one along also.
 
TheOverseer714 just in case you wanted to finish this I have played this out to 90AD. I will post a log and a save if you want to go ahead and play. If not I will just finish it. I read a post where you mentioned this was a game not completed.
 
Here is the log up to 90AD. I would post a log in either case. Not a lot of change to the map.

Pre:

Well I have run across a couple of games where Overseer714 was trying to complete SG's that had gone cold. I agree with him that it is often sad to see them go away, so I have jumped in a few times to help finish them.

So stumbling across the reference to Civ2 ToT, I looked for it and will start the ball rolling. The game had not gone very far, so Overseer714 this is not call for you to complete it. I am just playing out some turns, in the event you do want some help to get it done.

I have not read the logs, but check on the conditions and it seems Conquest and Space are the desired ones. I would expect that Conquest would come before Space and will proceed on that basis.

My first move was to find the nation the farthest away and get an embassy with them (Japan). I paid 56 gold. I went with only them in the event that the game finds the other eliminated. I like to have a couple of embassies in the event of war.

This will let you steal, if need be. No embassy and war means no steals. It could come to pass that stealing will not occur, but just in case 56 gold is not a bad price.

Not too happy with the location of Buceopolis or Delphi, but those are the breaks. I would rather it was either next to the lake or first choice the hill on the river. Then Delphi on the other side of the river. Anyway I am not going to spend time on stuff I can do nothing about.

The builds I will have to study as I do not grasp the need for all eight towns to make war items at a time when we are at peace. Was war under consideration?

BTW I held off on embassy with Cleo to see what the rest of the world looks like over there. I would prefer to go with the nation that is the most likely to last.

I guess the boat was sunk as none are available to finish the mapping and we have no town on that side of the water. Will need to plant a town that can get a boat out and search. Argos is so far away from the unknown, I am not sure if it is worth it.

We seem to have a lot of troops as if a war was coming. I do not see why we would want to start one at this time. We do not have Iron. Japan is way too far away. Carthage has BW, so they will have Nums. IOW I do not see how we can press a war right now, so why all the warriors and archers?

Top four towns:
Athens 0/7
Buce 1/5
Sparta 1/5
Knossos 1/4

I rename Buceopolis to save me stokes and all that know the name, will get the reference.

Now where can we make wonders? We for sure want SoZ and maybe GLIB. We have two nations making the Oracle, so a rollover could occur, if either can make them when the Oracle finishes. It may be that no one has Ivory, not looked to see.

Anyway Athens is the only place that can grow past size 6 right now. I am going to take radical action for me. I switch Buce to a settler and sell the barracks. I will pop out the settler and move the town to the lake.

We need more towns that can become cities and we will not give up much and actually gain a few tiles for other towns.

Sparta will have to do for one site. I will get the cow mined as shields is more useful to me right now.

Pharsalos, rename to Phar and switch to worker. I do not want more regular archers as I do not intend to take on Nums with archers. Hannibal will send them to attack us and we will have to combat them. Not like Hops, that are attack one. Switch to wall as this is a town that will come under attack, when war breaks out.

I want to get a town on the hill to block access for Hannibal so I switch archer to settler in Knossos. I am not sure where the settler is headed. I would guess to get the ivory, but I will send it to the hill. I can get the ivory next.

I do not know if Hannibal has already crossed the area, but I want to be able to block him. I switch Athens from archer to temple. You need a temple in any capitol to build large projects and get larger.

I sent an archer and a hop from the newly rename Therm to the hill location and to cover the new town north of Therm.

875BC (1):
I stop the settler northward to make sure it went to the nearest hill. A Japanese warrior shows up, will see if a price is paid for sending out a settler with no escort. I did not check on the barb settings.

850BC (2):
Found Myce and start a worker in 10. Yahoo, now we have cut off that end. I disband a 3/3 archer, just to get down the maint and I do not want regular archers for more than MP duty. I envision this becoming a Monarchy and playing out as an AW, but that is not certain right now.

825BC:
Note that all the contacts have Math so the cost drops for us. We have no techs on them at this time.

800BC (3):
Found Herak. I did not abandon Buce as I wanted to let the settler get in place. This way I do not lose the support. One will replace the other next turn. I have a worker in Buce to make a road then.

775BC (4):
Found Buce after abandonment of the old one. All towns on the grid.

750BC (5):
Math next turn. Hannibal started GLIB and the Colossus was completed. I hope the Oracle finishes as that would stop any rollover. Cleo started the Pyramids.

I started GLIB in Athens, but it is working tiles with no roads, let alone a mine. I started FP in Sparta, which could be use for SoZ as well.

730BC (6):
I forgot to mention a barb showed up by the Iron. I opt to start on Poly to get to Monarchy.
Hannibal start Pyramids, hope he gets it.

710BC (7):
I spot an Egyptian warrior out on the far north. I had forgot about the warrior out there, so I disband it.

630BC (11):
Found Thess, need to get a road to the ivory.

610BC (12):
France finished the Pyramids, so we shall see what that means. We still have not gotten contact with a number of nations.

590BC (13):
There it is, Hannibal wants 33 gold, I say come and pry it out of my cold dead hands. DOW follows.

570BC (14):
Too many events, need an event log ala IV. I recall that Japan finished the Oracle. Japan started ToA and Cleo started MoM. We are falling behind everyone at this point. The lack of contact with the others slows research, which I will have to stop once I get Monarchy. We are just too slow.

Japan had two units about to enter our land, not sure if I will oppose that or not.

530BC (16):
I demanded they leave and they did.
 
510BC (17):
japan enters again and then they DOW rather than leave. Archer kill one 5/5 warrior and goes elite. Good start. Num and archer next to Phar.

490BC (18):
archer kills a Num. Hop kills the archer and GA time. May need it to handle both nations. I guess when you choose conquest and pick Greece, you are begging for an early GA. That does not bother me as I am use to them.

470BC (19):
start on Monarchy. Have a worker finally on the ivory. Still no road to Iron.
I sold Poly to cleo.

430BC (21):
Two archers kill two Carthage archers and one goes elite. Settler on the way to the Iron as a road is going up to connect the town.

390BC:
Hannibal is willing to talk, but I suspect he thinks I should give him something. Anyway we get war happiness from him and I prefer to keep him making troops rather than other things.

370BC:
Two archers kill Japanese warriors and one goes elite.
Found Rhodes. Now the Iron is in our border.

350BC:
Now we are getting some place. 5/5 archer kills Carthage warrior and makes a leader. The very first elite battle, yahoo. Form an army, but will wait for swords.
3/3 and 3/5 archers kill Japan warriors.

330BC:
Our 4/5archer* was sacrificed to damage the Num and another archer finished the job.
BTW Japan has shown up with horses.
I have Ivory now and start SoZ. Drop lux slider to zero.
Archer kills horse.

5/5 archer kills Num.
archer kills Carthage warrior.
Worker on the Iron now.
3/3 Hop kills Japan warrior and stays 3/3.
4/4 Hop goes red but kills a warrior.

250BC:
Hannibal gets Cleo to DOW on us. Someone finished ToA last IBT.
I barely got a hop to the Iron in time for a barb horse to attack. I would not want to see if the 3/3 warrior would have held up. The Hop went to vet so the Iron should be safe, till an uprising.

230BC:
I am confused as I though Hannibal build Colossus, but I checked and see Joan has Pyramid, Colossus and Lighthouse. All are in French cities, so no captures. It was MoM that was build, not the ToA and it was built in Thebes.

Another lucky move as an archer arrives in Argos just as a warrior lands. Kills Carthage warrior. I did have a hop there, so no danger. I was mainly not wanting the warrior to wander off to look for easy targets.

GLIB will finish on the IBT, so we will get some techs and as it would happen learn Monarchy on the same turn.

190BC:
Japan started Zeus. We have a big lead, but have to worry that they will flip the ToA to it. Of course you always have to worry about a leader.

We get Currency next turn. Only Carthage knows Construct. I drop research to zero. I revolt and draw 4 turns.

With the war happy we have no happy issue during the anarchy. The GA loss is a shame, but not all that huge.

Japan has a sword coming and they are probably in the Middle Ages soon and Hannibal already is there.

170BC:
kill 2 Nums and a warrior, losing one vet archer.
Uprising near Rhodes, lets see who else make the MA.
Egypt, so we will go to the new age next turn. Two have Republic, so we will learn that and Construct.

150BC:
Looks like the HG was a lost cause anyway as it and the ToA were built.
Killed a unit on the IBT that attacked Myce. I had used a Hop to block the passage. We need swords to make progress here.

Got bad luck on the Free Tech, sure wish we had contacts. Drew Mono.
16 barb horses show up.
archer kills sword and is red, but goes elite to get to yellow. Cover with Hop.

130BC:
HG and GW are build and Japan is working on SoZ, think they are behind us on that.
8 barbs die on our forces. I had sent another hop, an archer and a warrior to prevent any accidental loss of the worker.
5/5 archer kills a wounded Num

Still 8 more barbs looking at the worker. I draw off the warrior.
Did I mention that both hops went elite.
Hop kills warrior.
3/3 hop kills archer and makes vet.

IBT:
Make peace with Cleo. She wanted Monarchy, so I offered Monarchy and Mono for 850. I figure the gold is better in my hands and she will get the tech eventually. I know she will trade it, but that is fine as well as that means the sooner we get more techs form the GLIB.

110BC:
Finally come out of anarchy and into Monarchy.
SoZ is finished by Japan, switch to market.

16 more barb horses ride towards the capitol. Sure wish I could have gotten up a few more towns. Will try to get settlers out now.

90BC:
Found Eretria maybe last turn.
Kill Num and warrior.

IBT:
a little scary. The hop was red lined by a sword. The archer did no damage to our archer, so the other archer did not attack.

70BC:
Iron is in and the GA is over.
I make peace with Japan and sell Republic for 160 gold. I figure they will DOW real soon anyway.

IBT:
4 barb horses hit the hop that is heading to covering a settler. The first horse make it red, even though the hop is on a hill. The second one died and promote the hop to vet. The third one died and made the hop elite, so I was not worried about the last one that did no damage. Bottom line the hop still has 3HP, but is now elite.

50BC:
Stick a sword into the army. I had swapped the nearly done lib to a sword.
Army kills Carthage horse.

killed 8 of the 16 barbs, but cannot prevent them from cutting one road. On the IBT they could do more damage as road and mines are exposed and the capitol is now empty. They can only get next to it though. I am trying to kill them and entice them to not cut improvements.

Found Troy.

Get Fued from GLIB, so MDI and start Sun Tzu, but who knows. Start HE as well.

IBT:
Yuk one barb dies on warrior, but the next kills it. They wreck two tiles and go on a hill.

30AD:
I missed a couple of kills by the 1st. I realize now as I add a second unit and it kills a red lined Num. Funny I toss a red warrior on a red barb horse on a hill and it wins. I killed all 8 barbs in the borders.

4 more are on a hill next to Troy.
5/5 archer kills Carthage horse and all units removed from the interior.

50AD:
Not listing all combat now.
Japan enters the borders and I demand they leave, so they DOW.

70AD:
Kill two more Nums and 3 of the 4 barbs. Only one left.

90AD:
Killed 2 Japan units and 2 Nums. Cleared last barb.

Need to get some settlers and more workers now.

Need to get the army healed on the attack.

I got a galley out and hope to sneak it by Carthage to find the rest of the world.
 
130AD:
kill Num and archer and army kills Num in Leptis.
kill 2 Japan swords.

150AD:
1st kills Num in Lep and pillaged mine and moves to heal.

170AD:
kill Japan sword.
5/5 archer kills Num. Goes red, but get a leader. Form army.

190AD:
kill 2 swords.

210AD:
archers continue to have high success against Num's. These are all 3/3 and often are pinged. I met Ottoman, may have been last turn, not sure. They are behind in tech.

230AD:
I see that Cleo has Chiv now.
2nd kills Num, it is a lone MDI right now.
5/5 archer kills one.
archer kills one.
5/5* archer kills one. The last two were pinged.
1st kills archer as it heads back to Leptis.

250AD:
2nd struggles to kill a Num in Lep. AC shows.
I have embassy with Otto now.

260AD:
We learn Theology and Chiv. I switch the pre to Templar. I was going to use it for Leo, but the HE is close to being done and I could start another pre there or even switch it, if we learn Invention in time.
Ping another Num and archer kills it.

archers kill a Num and archer.
2nd heads out.

I forgot to mention that on the IBT after the AC arrived it attacked and nearly killed the Hop. The town is on a hill, will see if it had a wall. Nope, so it will get one right away.

Sistine's is started by someone.

This game is playing like the one move only game as we do not have horses.

270AD:
I agree to peace with Hannibal for two towns. I abandon one of them as it is far off.
kill spear.

290AD:
I found Hali and last turn or so as was Marathon. I could check the founding date, but why bother?

Got gold from barb camp and Hop kill the last barb there. A Num had kill the other one.
kill spear, but do not attack the archer. I do not want to leave a unit in the open. The archer will only move to a spot where we can attack safely.

300AD:
kill archer.

IBT:
Japan archer attacks 5/5 archer and dies. AC attacks Myce and retreats. The wall not finished yet.

310AD:
kill the AC and a sword. Tell Hannibal to leave.

IBT:
Sword kills a hop in the open. It was covering a 5/5 archer. Sword attacks the archer, but dies.
 
330AD:
kills 2 swords.

350AD:
sold Republic to Otto.

360AD:
Found Perg
KT in.
killed a sword

370AD:
BTW I have a pre for Leo going.
Found Mile
MDI clear camp for 25 gold.

I see what is likely the French border past Konya.
5/5 archer kills sword.
MDI kills one.
I decide to use the army and kill the last one. I have let a few wounded leave as I did not want to expose units. I brought over the 1st to stop that. I had expected Hannibal to come by now, but I guess not.

The lack of horses is painful and the only ones I see are far off.

380AD:
I see a French town, will let them make contact or do it next turn. I do that to postpone the time they kick me out, if I can. I also see a new border, Persia I think.

390AD:
Joan is down Republic and Mono and is broke? She made all those wonders! Maybe I should have gone Republic and just teched out.

I forgot that an AC dies at Myce on the IBT. I am not doing a great job of logging here, just fair. I know I have left off stuff.

5/5 archer from Therm kills sword and a 5/5 from Herak does one. About due for a leader.
2nd comes out of Herak to finish the archer.

MDI kills spear and goes elite. 1st covers.
5/5 archer kills the sword that landed next to Herak.
I see we have contact with Xerxse now.

IBT:
Cleo demands 100 gold, no way. She DOW's.
Japan wants peace now, so I do it for a town, that I will have to abandon or gift.

410AD:
Japan move troops into our land after the peace deal?
I give Ise to Xerxse, maybe it will cause him some trouble.
4/5 MDI kills Egypt MDI.

I see Joan has two workers in the box, so I trade Republic for them and all her gold (4).

420AD:
Hammi is off the coast with a galley, so we know everyone.
I build an embassy with Carthage and see they are 82 turns from Sun Tzu.
I make embassies with he rest and find Persia is 16 turns from Sun. They are making 15spt.
We are only 14 turns away at current pace. That will shrink as we are about to grow. We are making 16spt.

Kill spear and pike they was escorting two settlers, thanks Cleo.
I told Japan to leave and got a DOW.
Killed 7 Japanese units and an Egyptian warrior. 3 elite archers won.

450AD:
Let see if I can bring things up to date. I got a shock a couple turns back as an SGL appeared. I used it to rush Leo. I still have Sistine going to use for Cope, if no one finishes sooner. I am running at 80% with -56gpt. Lots of money to use. I have upgraded all the cats. Normally I do not do this, but it will make it easier/cheaper to get to cannons later.

I have a feeling that trebs are better than cats, but never really tested it. The big problem is no offensive has been done. I have manged to attack a town on three occasions, but with only one army on scene got little done. I may be able to move some using crusaders, if I can get a few into battle. I have two now.

Kill Egypt sword and the red AC.

IBT:
One Japan sword attacks and dies. Many units heading in and I see a knight.

460AD:
kill Japan sword and 2 archers.
1st kills Egypt sword.
Found Arte.

Carthage and Ottoman are the only others to know Invention. I have been working on Astro in the hopes of making a trade for Horses with someone.

The game is much harder than I at first expected and I have had a number of good things come my way.

Pix:
 
I can probably play some of this after I finish this round of Rod02. This was a tough map, as you are finding out.
 
I knew you were up in Rod02 so I played on, but there is plenty left when you are ready. I think it can be won, but it is very slow as no one is researching well. I am not having any luck in leaders as of late.
 
Here is the save and last turn.

470AD:
killed 8 units in the border and one just outside.

What do you think about changing tactics at this point? The progress is slow and it won't be long before muskets come online, making the armies a risky business.

I have not used this style in some time, but maybe we should crank out trebs and MDI and just take towns the old fashion way. I was hoping to get that 3rd leader for another army. Then we could get Pentagon and add a fourth unit.

We have two crusaders and that would make a decent army. They also would make a great fourth unit.

Once Cleo has slowed down her charge, I was counting on Hannibal to jump us. That is the direction I would like to expand as they have horses and not all those jungles.
 
I would say that Carthage is next on the list. A pile of trebuchets might be the best strategy to
take them out. I can work on this probably tomorrow if I get my 5 Rod02 turns finished.
 
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