Civics redesign

[Slvynn]

A 2c bonus for turbines would make a level 1 turbine, available very early, give 1h3c. That is far too much. You would risk the AI building those instead of windtraps, and having pathetic cities.

(You lose commerce with spice and water is something AI should favor much more than commerce/hammers)

This makes no sense to me. What does hydraulic despotism in terms of controllnig which nobles get spice have to do with building wind turbines?

Ecology, and desire to find alternate power/commerce generators, thus focus on improving them and supplying civ needs by those improved improvements and labor focus to be scurpulous, carefulness with surrounding world , inventiveness etc etc "No extraction, no depletion" concept
and here goes Spice and mali for it. As told, HD of Leto II is not that relevant to time period in game, but it can have its prequisites. Rations, limited acess to Resources and luxuries, as way to control. Either for preserving , either for control and limitation of use, extraction and depletion. Or just denying it and decreasing numbers of spice consumption relying on invention and ecology.

Alot of civics are doubtfull with their bonuses. Heritage rule? 1 hapiness per military rule? I dont think that in real world and in Dune world HR provided hapiness in THAT way, hovewer mod uses it as invention of vanilla.

(edit: just edited post because this post got mixed with one from promotions thread, so removed irrelevant stuff and placed in right post)

 

[Ahriman]

water is something AI should favor much more than commerce/hammers

Still not the main point; main problem is an instant 4-resource yielding improvement, that goes up to 6 resources with enough tech, that is buildable basically anywhere. Windtraps have high yields, but you are very limited where you can build them.

And besides, hydraulic despotism has nothing to do with an ecological awareness of the environment. I just don't see any link between
a) denying population consumer goods (by extracting as much energy as possible through power generation, vs
b) reducing spice harvesting activities

You lose commerce with spice

I don't understand what you mean here.

I realize you're probably not a native English speaker, but your tendency to write in fragments and incomplete thoughts makes your comments very difficult to read and understand.
PLEASE try and explain your ideas more clearly and completely.

Ecology, and desire to find alternate power/commerce generators, thus focus on improving them and supplying civ needs by those improved improvements and labor focus to be scurpulous, carefulness with surrounding world , inventiveness etc etc "No extraction, no depletion" concept

Spice is a renewable resource - as long as there are worms, there is spice. Spice isn't an extractive industry, like drilling for oil or coal, so it makes no sense for an ecologist/conservationist to try to preserve it by not harvesting it.
And if you don't harvest spice, it just blows away anyway. There is never a reason to not harvest spice that is there.

And the main reason that Leto restricts spice is to restrict space travel (and longevity), deliberately suppressing human expansion so that it can leap forth in a diaspora.

Alot of civics are doubtfull with their bonuses. Heritage rule? 1 hapiness per military rule?

Hereditary rule represents a standard traditional order of succession and rule, where power is concentrated in the monarch/leader and his military forces. A society where power is inherited is one where bright successful people from lower classes (who would succeed in a meritocratic society) are kept in check and without power only by strength of military force. As opposed to a theocratic society, wher religion is used for the similar effect, or an Imperial society, where power is decentralized.
Its not that much of a stretch.

you will just meet AI archers in cities

Then, like I said, maybe the problem is that the AIs aren't prioritizing defense tactics early enough because we don't yet have tech flavors in the mod. I wouldn't be surprised if the AI was designed to put a high value on getting one other military tech early.

Can we not put this argument in the civics thread though please?

 

[Slvynn]

I don't understand what you mean here.

I realize you're probably not a native English speaker, but your tendency to write in fragments and incomplete thoughts makes your comments very difficult to read and understand.
PLEASE try and explain your ideas more clearly and completely.

I mean that you get Spice economy (corporation bonuses and tile yelds) hampered.
My thinking is conceptual, and not logical, i've studied in academy of arts, and i think more abstract than logically, but i am very practical as well. Sorry if its hard to understand me sometimes for you, and i can ask you - dont consider me dumb (i am not saying that you do, i just asking for future) just because i can be so uncoherent.

Still not the main point; main problem is an instant 4-resource yielding improvement, that goes up to 6 resources with enough tech, that is buildable basically anywhere. Windtraps have high yields, but you are very limited where you can build them.

And besides, hydraulic despotism has nothing to do with an ecological awareness of the environment. I just don't see any link between
a) denying population consumer goods (by extracting as much energy as possible through power generation, vs
b) reducing spice harvesting activities

....

Spice is a renewable resource - as long as there are worms, there is spice. Spice isn't an extractive industry, like drilling for oil or coal, so it makes no sense for an ecologist/conservationist to try to preserve it by not harvesting it.
And if you don't harvest spice, it just blows away anyway. There is never a reason to not harvest spice that is there.

And the main reason that Leto restricts spice is to restrict space travel (and longevity), deliberately suppressing human expansion so that it can leap forth in a diaspora.

Well ok, lets forget about Hydraulic Despotism, but i think that Solar/turbine bonus should be more powerfull , and followed by some mali - negative civic feature.
Also having some synergy with one of lore/game paths would be nice.

Hereditary rule represents a standard traditional order of succession and rule, where power is concentrated in the monarch/leader and his military forces. A society where power is inherited is one where bright successful people from lower classes (who would succeed in a meritocratic society) are kept in check and without power only by strength of military force. As opposed to a theocratic society, wher religion is used for the similar effect, or an Imperial society, where power is decentralized.
Its not that much of a stretch.

I am not concerned thats is right representation of HR via civic, but thats vanilla tradition and i accept that.

Can we not put this argument in the civics thread though please?

^^^^
reply is quote of my previous post edit
VVVVV

(edit: just edited post because this post got mixed with one from promotions thread, so removed irrelevant stuff and placed in right post)