COTM 11: First Spoiler

Having just finished a Regent-level OCC (not COTM), I can safely say that the GL is pointless and that you can safely expect to remain ahead in tech throughout most of, if not all of, the game. (I did build the GL in that game, but only for the 6cpt.)
 
eldar said:
Having just finished a Regent-level OCC (not COTM), I can safely say that the GL is pointless and that you can safely expect to remain ahead in tech throughout most of, if not all of, the game. (I did build the GL in that game, but only for the 6cpt.)
I built the GL for denial. I haven't got my act together to get the 1st spoiler up, but will probably wait til I qualify for the 2nd due to the resource gag order.
 
akots said:
You mention about something everyone should understand and some self-policing issues. Well, apparently not everyone is smart enough to figure it out. ;)

It's rather me not being good enough at stating what I have in mind... ;)

Actually, thnigs are made a little more complicated by the fact that if I really say what you shouldn't talk about, well... :crazyeye: ...then I've said it!

What I was implying is that there are one or two resources whose location is key to deciding your approach to the game.
Unfortunately, with map trading not being available in the AA, some players might not have discovered them yet.
So, other than that, what you post here should not be terribly spoilerish -for instance, resources around the starting position is ok.

I take your point, anyway. Next time I'll try to be as precise as possible -and look for different map featuers maybe. What kind of map would you like? ;)
 
Karasu said:
... What kind of map would you like? ;)

Please, don't get me wrong. I like the maps and games and think that they are the greatest maps/games with very thorough playtesting and extremely balanced which is very hard to achieve for single player games. And I'm 100% happy about the GOTMs/COTMs. Like I said, it is your game and you set the rules, it is just that some players (like me and probably a few others) don't understand the spoiler rules very well but this is a very minor issue indeed.

Regarding wishes, really don't know. May be time for a brutal Deity level game? Similar to GOTM37?
 
Karasu said:
... What kind of map would you like? ;)
If I could make a wish about a civilization to play, how about a Conquest game with India. Didnt their fancy elephants get an additional hitpoint? Seeing how lethal Ancient Cavalry can be, maybe war oliphants have a new allure as well.
 
God knows they were annoying me something fierce a few days ago. Getting to use them on offense would be very cool.

Renata
 
akots said:
May be time for a brutal Deity level game? Similar to GOTM37?
Don't you think more like GOTM14? I wouldn't call GOTM37 a brutal Deity game, with the food bonuses and the land bridge. It had it's difficulties, but brutal? No, see page 14 in the GOTM saga.

Otherwise I agree with you. But I suspect the hardest games need an insane amount of game testing.
 
GOTM14 has been replayed about a year ago by 3 teams with RBC rules (at least 2 teams were able to stick to them till the end) and it was rather easy indeed, still puzzled why it had been such a trouble originally:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=78780
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=78781
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=78782

Must agree, it was possible to lose that game. With GOTM37 it was not so easy to lose indeed but it was very brutal in terms of bloodshed.
 
@akots, I didn't get you wrong at all. Your criticism wast most probably correct, and I understood it to have a constructive value. :)

Of course, this doesn't mean that I will be able to come up with better criteria the next time I set up a COTM... :crazyeye:
 
Open, barbs fixed
20K, not in Seoul

I moved my settler SE and founded Seoul. I got burned last time I tried a 20K in the capitol, so I decided to put P'yongyang up by the lake. My shield output wasn't very high, but I hoped the early size 12 would help balance it out. I built P'yongyang in 3050 and started on a temple. During the AA I got temple (2230 BC), colossus (1425 BC), MoM (975 BC), SoZ (670), and a library (510 BC).

Mostly I used the ancient cavalry as units to disband. I had a small war against the Vikings, but mostly there was no action in it, so I could afford to get rid of the AC.

I researched at max towards philosophy, with just a single deviation to get CB for my 20K city. Despite this, I didn't get philosophy first. The Mongols got literature from this and started the great library. I let them have it. They were good researchers in my game, but the rest of the AI were slow, as expected.

I enter the MA in 290 BC, not too far from finishing the HG, and feeling that the 2nd city approach was a bad choice. Now, having finished, I'm not sure whether it was or not. I'll have to think about it more.
 
Open class, yet another 20k attempt!

The Ancient Age (in which PaperBeetle is hoist by his own petard)

... begins on a small peninsula with good red meat all around. I'd like to settle in place actually, if it weren't a mountain. Moving the worker north reveals lots more map, and with the help of some fog-gazing, the most powerful spot throughout all ages is determined to be N,NE. This is where I found Seoul (3900 bc), which will be my Eternal City of Culture. A couple of warriors and a curragh later, the feeder city P'yongyang is built on the south coast, and Seoul starts the culture hunt.

Techwise, I head straight for Philosophy, determined to be first to get there, and aware that there are lots of other civs who started with Alphabet. I should have gambled on delaying a while, or barked up a different branch of the tree. By the time I get Writing (2190 bc), I have met Ragnar, Hanni and Will with my numerous explorers, but still haven't produced my third settler. Contact with Temujin follows shortly. I am trading up the tech ladder quickly, but still don't have much of an empire.

Culture in Seoul is going okay, with Colossus followed by temple, but being stuck at size is beginning to grate. Still I don't realise that I'm on the wrong branch of the tech tree, and I follow Philosophy with Laws (free) and Republic. The trouble is, Republic is so expensive that my research is essentially stalled. My lack of base commerce doesn't help; I decided to try and block the Carthaginians and my third city is founded as late as 1525 bc, on the isthmus leading to our continent, claiming the ivory.

About this time, all the AI start setting up wonder builds, so I figure it is time to distract them a little. I dow on the most distant civs and give my neighbours techs for alliances against them. In 1250 bc, I meet the last civ, India and, after finishing P'yongyang's granary, start my fourth settler. My fourth city is founded on the coast northwest of Seoul, expanding my empire in the direction of that ivory outpost. Meanwhile, Seoul completes the Oracle and starts a library.

At this point, a mysterious wise man arrives from the east and informs Wang Kon that his Quick Start Challenge is over and he has scored 3197 points.
QSC Stats:
4 towns with 12 citizens and 61 tiles territory
All ancient techs except Construction, Currency, Republic (~500 beakers to go) and Monarchy
1 worker, 6 warriors, 2 curraghs
1 granary, 1 walls, 1 temple, Colossus, Oracle
233 gold in the bank
All civs contacted; embassies with Scandinavia, Carthage and Holland
307 culture at 14cpt (why doesn't QSC scoring take account of culture? It's kind of important these days, what with everyone doing 20k games :) )

And so on with the ancient age. Seoul finishes its library and starts on a bigger and more Wonderful one. Then the Mongols call me up and demand Literature. Of course I tell them where to get off; this is precisely the kind of phoney war I've been trying to set up to slow everybody down. Gleefully, I ally the Indians against the Mongols, and feel smug. And then a Mongol galley arrives. It drops an archer onto the same mountain I started the game on. Oh dear. This one archer chews its way through four warriors at the cost of a single hit point. If he takes down the fifth, he will capture P'yongyang, so I give Temujin Construction for peace. I have broken my alliance with Gandhi, and my rep is shot. Well, I guess I asked for that.

Finally I discover Republic in 570 bc and spend 4 turns revolting. The Dutch have beaten me to the Glibrary, so I settle for the Lighthouse and start on Seoul's aqueduct. Just before this is complete, I trade Republic for Currency (although most civs got Republic before me) and enter the medieval era, getting Engineering for free. The date is 290 bc and I have six cities; two are just resource-squatting and the other four are actually productive parts of my empire.

Seoul's culture at 290 bc (dates in F5 style):
Palace 3900 bc
Colossus 1870 bc
Temple 1700 bc
Oracle 1100 bc
Library 1000 bc
Lighthouse 370 bc
... makes 822 culture at 21cpt.

Roll on the medieval, when things go slightly better. I think.
 
Open

Decide to settle Seoul on the hill NNE to get settler factory started. Whilst researching pottery, we send out a couple of warriors exploring and a curragh in each direction. After learning Pottery its full steam ahead to the Rep slingshot.

I decide that since available land is a bit hilly, i'll keep my core tightish, so I settle Pyonyang on the south hill and Wonsan to the NE. We meet the Celts in 2390BC and trade for CB. In 2270BC, me meet the Vikings and they trade us Warrior Code. 2190BC sees contact with the Dutch and Carthage, whom we learn the Wheel and Masonry from. The immediate lack of horsies prompts me to start planning for the occupation of the ivory near Carthage borders for SoZ. Pop Mysticism from a hut in 1870BC. Soon after we learn IW from Carthage and realise that the northern iron could become a tempting target for the Dutch, so the fertile plains to the north are soon settled.
We meet the Mongols in 1650BC. In 1350BC we meet Japan and India. Then disaster strikes! The Celts learn Philosophy two turns before me! So ashamed. :blush: Trade for HBR, Poly, Maths, and Mapmaking with our stupider neighbours.

Okay... new plan. I'm unaccustomed to not getting Republic. And spending 40ish turns researching is not tempting... I'm gonna take a gamble and try to get Feudalism as my freebie on entry to Middle Ages. Now, what goal to concentrate on? Fastest Space and Diplo is effectively out without Republic, and I am not a good enough warmonger yet. I didn't plan for 20K, so 100K it is. Should be a good way to teach me how to use Feudalism. Lets start researching Literature and get a headstart on some early libraries then. I wonder if I have enough time to play 100K this month?

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QSC Stats:

13 cities, 25 pop
3 granary, 2 barracks, 1 temple.
3 settlers, 5 workers, 10 warriors, 2 curraghs
all contacts
all AA techs bar Construction, Currency, Republic, Monarchy, Literature.

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qsc.JPG


After Amsterdam builds the Pyramids in 690BC, this effectively OK's my decision. I need to take Amsterdam to play an effective 100K, but an assault on the Dutch will be tricky. :hmm: I'm going to start a few world wars I think. My military is weak so i'm just going to sit back and build up a nice little AC and sword stack. We learn Currency in 590BC, trade it to the Celts in 570BC for Construction to get access to the Middle Ages. Damn, we get Mono as a freebie... oh well, 100% science on Feudalism....
 
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