COTM 29 Pre-Game Discussion

[ainwood]

COTM 29: Russia

[img=right]http://www.civfanatics.com/images/civ3/leaders/CA_SHAP.jpg[/img]


Civilization: Russia
Rivals: 7 pre-selected.
Barbarians: Raging
Difficulty: Monarch
Land Form: Pangea, 60% ocean, standard map.
Geology:3 billion years old, Cool, wet.
AI Aggression: Highest.

Conquest-Class Bonuses:

1. Start with an extra worker and scout

Predator-Class Equalisers:

1. Barb attack bonus removed.
2. Number of citizens born content dropped to 1.
3. AI cost factor reduced to 8.

 

[Htadus]

First thought. Move anywhere.

My settler will follow the scout untill we find a good place to settle. Most like ly toward south. Then we will most likely go for a cultural victory.

 

[killerkid]

My thoughts: Scout to go S,S. I agree htadus, about a 20k if possible, if not, diplo. The raging barbs, and highest aggression level means to definitely watch out for neighbors, and get warriors/spears cranking. Start location gives me an impression that the sea is to our north, and good land is south. I can't tell, but is that a wheat top SE,SE of our start position. I hope this game is a good one!

P.S: Ainwood, are you SURE that there are most aggressive AI this time??

 

[archphoenix]

with scout I likely to explore at most 5 turns before settle.
without settle at once or wander 10 turns.

 

[Ansar]

A little off-topic but : When this comes out, does COTM27 results come out?

 

[ainwood]

P.S: Ainwood, are you SURE that there are most aggressive AI this time??

Yeah - won't make that mistake again.

@Ansar - I'll catch up on results, but maybe not for a week or 10 days yet.

 

[AndySir]

It does look like a smelly place to settle - not ususally one to go wandering for a place to found city number 1 but I probably will in this game. At least for 1 turn.

But most importantly, can we have the Predator Challenge? Cultural victory seems to have been mentioned, and I've yet to try for a 100k...

 

[PoorAxl]

Why not settle in place? The city will use max. 12 squares anyway, so few tundra tiles will not make a difference. There are furs for luxuries, trees to be chopped, river, so not a bad start. Second city can become a settler factory. Scout will go S to find a place full of milk and honey.

 

[PaperBeetle]

I can't tell, but is that a wheat top SE,SE of our start position.

Yes, I think that is correct. It would certainly recommend 1S as a good place to settle.

 

[Più Freddo]

Looks like a quite straight-forward game except for the AI aggressivity. The bonuses and maluses are, let's say, linear.

Because of the aggressivity we'll not want to move too far before settling and also not rely too much on scouts surviving close encounters. Still, this is a rotten place to settle in. It's more suitable for a RCP3 town say on the tundra by the ocean, on the river. So somewhere in the south-east I'll look for a place to settle down. 2SE is probably furs in forest over grass. Bad. Over plains would be better.

As for worker actions, fur forests must be chopped a.s.a.p., there's at least one hidden shield to collect. Another reason no to wander too far. These 10-shield deliveries will come in handy given the need to get settled properly before the first attack from the AI, which will probably come earlier than we're happy with. Worker to fur forest to boost the start.

Aggression is the way to handle aggression, so barracks must come early. I don't count on more than a combo factory if any. Barracks first make all troops veterans. But first of all some more scouts. It's a pangea after all. A fairly large one.

 

[PaperBeetle]

2SE is probably furs in forest over grass.

Um, not sure about fur down there, but as for the wheat, I think we both meant 2SW, not 2SE.

 

[DBear]

With this being a large pangaea, and with Russia's UU being cossacks, I'm thinking that our opponents will be those with horse-based UUs: Ottomans, Arabs, China, Mongols, Iroquois, Egypt, Hittites.

I played a test game against these and it went well. But that was on a standard pangaea, not a large one...

 

[Norton II]

Yes, I think that is correct. It would certainly recommend 1S as a good place to settle.

Agreed. 1 S looks good. I'd probably settle in place if it weren't for all the tundra. As for initial builds, I'd say scout, warrior (because of the raging barbs and the aggressive AIs), granary, then settlers. Maybe a settler before the granary if the scout reveals a second settler factory location nearby. Worker actions? First, move to the wheat, irrigate and road (no need to road the grassland en route, since the river negates the movement bonus and that tile won't get worked for a while anyway). BTW, I don't know how any of you can tell there's wheat there, but I'll take your word for it. After that, maybe mine and road the BG, then chop the fur forest to speed up the granary (though it depends on what else exploration reveals).

Overall strategy: first, this is monarch, so the slingshot shouldn't be too hard to pull off as long as we have decent land. Second, given the AI aggression level and barb settings, a little more emphasis on early military wouldn't hurt. I'd probably have each city build a warrior or archer before workers. Hard to say after that. Assuming a decent REX, any victory besides 20k should be attainable (maybe that too, but not at an early date), but I'll probably go for domination or conquest.

 

[PaperBeetle]

BTW, I don't know how any of you can tell there's wheat there, but I'll take your word for it.

I'm looking at the object I ringed in red in the attached image.
The inset on the right is a wheat in plain view (from the start of the Carthage game) at the same magnification and colour balance.

I'm not 100% about it, as the jpeg image compression can sometimes throw up artefacts that look like stuff in the fog but turn out to be just empty grassland or something (lets call them mirages, heh), but I'm certain enough to do a spreadsheet for it.

 

[Norton II]

I'm looking at the object I ringed in red in the attached image.
The inset on the right is a wheat in plain view (from the start of the Carthage game) at the same magnification and colour balance.

I'm not 100% about it, as the jpeg image compression can sometimes throw up artefacts that look like stuff in the fog but turn out to be just empty grassland or something (lets call them mirages, heh), but I'm certain enough to do a spreadsheet for it.

I see. Never mind about some of those worker moves, then; I thought you meant across the river (don't know how I thought that when you clearly said 2SW, but whatever). In that case, worker goes 1SW, roads the BG, then 1 more SW, irrigates and roads the wheat, then moves back to the BG to mine. Settler still goes 1S and builds city. But I'll send the scout S first, to make sure that's really wheat.

Depending on who the other civs are, would it be faster to trade and pop huts for alphabet and writing than to research them?

 

[F-86 Sabre]

Why not settle in place? The city will use max. 12 squares anyway, so few tundra tiles will not make a difference. There are furs for luxuries, trees to be chopped, river, so not a bad start. Second city can become a settler factory. Scout will go S to find a place full of milk and honey.

I'm not so much interested in settling in place, but I doubt I'll wander for long. I'll send the scouts south and east--I will be on conquest and have two scouts--and unless they find something ultra cool, I'll probably move the settler to the SE and settle at that bend in the river across from the furs.

Of course, I've been known to change my mind inside the space of a pre-game discussion thread, so we'll see! Probably going for a 100K cultural victory.

 

[F-86 Sabre]

With this being a large pangaea, and with Russia's UU being cossacks, I'm thinking that our opponents will be those with horse-based UUs: Ottomans, Arabs, China, Mongols, Iroquois, Egypt, Hittites.

I played a test game against these and it went well. But that was on a standard pangaea, not a large one...

First, DUmmie Funnies ROCK!

Second, I think you're right, and that's why I'm optimistic about this one and thinking of going for domination. You see, the last two games I played on my own were pangaeas with all the horse civs.

In the first one I played the Iroquois and won a domination victory after fighting a modern war against the Hittites and Russians that featured about a million bombers pounding their cities.

The second is in play right now, I'm playing the Ottomans, am in the late 1700s and have eliminated the Russians. I've scaled several others back a bit, including reducing the Arabs to one city. I just came out of a world war where it was every other civ against me at the same time. I managed to peel everyone off with peace agreements ranging from pricey to free of charge, and now only Egypt is left.


For this one it's either domination or 100K culture...I'll give it some thought.

 

[Abegweit]

C3C + Pangea = Domination

 

[denyd]

I'm sure hoping that this doesn't follow recent XOTM pattern of a us on a smallish island with no goody huts available for our scouts to pop. Of course the island will have no strategic resources and only 1 or 2 luxuries and we will need to build galleys to be able to settle enough cities to build the FP.

[Just a little bitterness after having to abandon the English COTM and just recently finishing the Viking GOTM successfully, though with a below average score for me. BTW: BESERKS ROCK !!! ]

But enough with the trival matters. I too will settle Moscow 1S after sending my scout 2S to check out the locale. Worker to BG to start mining. Research on Alphabet trying for the Republic Slingshot. Early builds will be 2 Scouts and then a warrior (unless I have a neighbor too close).

BTW: Do goody huts give workers or settlers?

 

[azzaman333]

@Ansar - I'll catch up on results, but maybe not for a week or 10 days yet.

So, when are the updates coming?