CS-2 - The Sun Never Sets on the British Empire

[senwiz]

Good point on the history. That is in fact what made me want to play a game like this. We were talking about colonialism/imperialism in a class I am taking currently and I immediately thought that would be a fun civ idea!

I'm willing to take another 10 turns, or we can just go to Gaspar. If you haven't played by the time I get home from work (does it look like I'm working?) then I'll play another 10. It doesn't matter to me either way.

LOL....I'm working too...Can't you tell? LMAO

Oppsie...Out of coffee...Must go get more.

 

[Eggs]

Here is the dotmap with the city spots I was mumbling about:



You are probably right that we want to fit as many cities as we can though, just to work as many tiles as we can with the little happiness that we have (especially if we don't go for a religion). With your dotmap those 4 cities would have 12-13 tiles to work each which should be more than enough for now.

Having put some more thought into it, I'm sure that's the best option .

Is it necessary to get to Ireland before settling in Scandinavia?

The colossus sounds like a very good idea . We could also go for the the great lighthouse in london to push louis' borders back and for the $$. Unless we want to take him down really fast.

With all the food resources we should probably prepare to whip , especially if we're not going to cottage them. We probably need the hammers more than the commerce anyway, glancing over all our juicy coastal tiles. I've never really whipped anything so this will be fun .

 

[Eggs]

Plz take all the turns you'd like . You don't need to put me further down the list though. If I just know what techs and buildings/units we want and when+where we want to settle I should be ok.

 

[Gaspar~]

I could play, but I'll hold of so Chriseay can get in a few more turns. Here's what I'm thinking. Space is the limiting factor here. Our island is ours, so my first priority, before thinking about how many cities we can jam in to it, would be to see how much land we can grab off of it. We can get to Europe, Ireland and Scandinavia with Galleys. As soon as AH is in, I would tech for sailing, and beeling a settler to the continent. Getting a base on the mainland would be huge. Then my next three settlers would aim for the northernmost city on the British Isle, Scandinavia, and Ireland. If we can get culture pumping everywhere (Stonehenge would be huge for us) then we don't have to worry about half-cities on the isles for a while, because our sphere of influence will be established. Stonehenge is probably the only early wonder we can realistically go for because I would be pouring all my shields into land grab. This will of course put a huge strain on the economy, so it does have its own problems.

Plan B I would think would be a tech path of Sailing -> BW, and then dropping every axe we can make on Louis to take him out early. We might lose Scandinavia with this exercise, and also Stonehenge but we probably gain half of France (Izzy will get the other half.)

There's two overarching points to be made here. One, avoid religion! While it would be nice, I think its crucial we are teching with expansion in mind, and expansion only in mind. This means Sailing, Metals, and then a beeline to CoL/Currency AFTER the AI has already researched the early religion techs to make them cheaper. We don't need the shrine income, as we are financial, and while we will need the happies from it, we can get that just as easily by letting Izzy and Gandhi do our dirty work for us and just spreading whatever religion comes to us. After we're established if we wanna make a run on Conf/Christ/Tao then that's great, but I wouldn't delay expansion. While I certainly hope we're the first to the Americas, Astronomy is a looooong way off. We need as much land as possible before then.

As far as other wonders go, Colossus and GL would both be huge for us. GL more so because with the volume of Civs and longer lasting of it, but Colossus is more likely to be the one we can get (AI's delay it like nobodys business.)

My two cents.

 

[shinku]

I like Eggs' dotmap better. But I tend to find Green Spot useless. I mean, if we put a city there, it will have 6 land tiles, of which 4 will be shared with London.
That leaves a respectable amount of sea tiles, which is good commerce wise, but production wise, London and Green Spot will be struggling.

We should whip, that's a given (assuming we get Bronze Working soon enough), but in the long run it's not going to do any good. But, that's just the opinion of someone who never played an Earth map, so it's up to the ones who know how to play it

Yellow & Red spot are fine, go for it

[Edit] Well, since our variant requires us to own a good chunk of land, it's either early aggression or aggressive expansion, looks like the second gets more votes
I bend in Gaspar~'s way, we might want to befriend Louis until there is no more room to expand

 

[chriseay]

I'm liking this! Everyone is involved and posting!

You are probably right that we want to fit as many cities as we can though, just to work as many tiles as we can with the little happiness that we have (especially if we don't go for a religion). With your dotmap those 4 cities would have 12-13 tiles to work each which should be more than enough for now.

Having put some more thought into it, I'm sure that's the best option .

Is it necessary to get to Ireland before settling in Scandinavia?

I think settling east asap is the best route. We have our island and Ireland pretty much to ourselves for a while...so once we can establish a foothold elsewhere we can backfill them. We do want to make sure they are as strong as we can make them though, as they will be very defensible for a long time, while those cities on the continent won't be.

There's two overarching points to be made here. One, avoid religion! While it would be nice, I think its crucial we are teching with expansion in mind, and expansion only in mind. This means Sailing, Metals, and then a beeline to CoL/Currency AFTER the AI has already researched the early religion techs to make them cheaper. We don't need the shrine income, as we are financial, and while we will need the happies from it, we can get that just as easily by letting Izzy and Gandhi do our dirty work for us and just spreading whatever religion comes to us. After we're established if we wanna make a run on Conf/Christ/Tao then that's great, but I wouldn't delay expansion. While I certainly hope we're the first to the Americas, Astronomy is a looooong way off. We need as much land as possible before then.

As far as other wonders go, Colossus and GL would both be huge for us. GL more so because with the volume of Civs and longer lasting of it, but Colossus is more likely to be the one we can get (AI's delay it like nobodys business.)

Point 1: Yes! Exactly my thinking on not going for one originally, though I was open for the possibility if everyone else thought it wise. I like the sailing next, then bronze path, but with as much agressive peaceful settling as possible. I feel like the more land we can get peacefully the better, and then we can take out Louis if need be. He's squished to no end no matter, with us to the north, Frederick to the East, Caesar to the SE and Izzy to the South.

Let's get Stonehenge, and then spit out galleys with either settlers or axes. Of course we'll need to sprinkle some workers in there too. Whipping could be our friend with the amount of food available.

What's point two?

I like Eggs' dotmap better. But I tend to find Green Spot useless. I mean, if we put a city there, it will have 6 land tiles, of which 4 will be shared with London.
That leaves a respectable amount of sea tiles, which is good commerce wise, but production wise, London and Green Spot will be struggling.

My thoughts on green are wait a long while on it, but it should go there eventually. It could be a good commerce city (remember, we are financial) and we will be able to whip it with the seafood there. On Ireland, I want to see a little more what it looks like before I make any comments on that city, though yellow looks fine for now.

I'll play around 3:30 EST.

 

[chriseay]

Ok, here we go again for 10 more. First things first, I change that WB to a worker. It's still in the queue, so it will come up for the next player.

Turn 3 - We've got the warrior on the sheeped hill in Scotland, and like you said eggs, now there is no fog for barbs to spawn in. We'll need more military when the people start complaining, but until then we're good just like this.


Turn 10 - Ok, so nothing happened in my extra 10 turns really. I'm glad I didn't stick them on you Gaspar. We'll have AH in 3 turns, and the worker 3 in turns. Perfect timing! We're pushing on the clams, it's down to 68% French. Don't forget to change the workboat out after the worker if we don't need it.

 

[Gaspar~]

I'll try and get to this tonight, if not then for sure tomorrow morning.

 

[MasterShake]

this one has alot of promise

 

[Nuka-sama]

Lurkers coment: You could go alot of ways here on this game, but I would probably take out Louis first. France was Britians greatest enemy, and that would be one less rival making a grab for the new world.

 

[S.ilver]

Definately looking to be a top notch SG. I'll be lurking this one to see both the pros and the newbies. Probably will learn a lot here too.

 

[Gaspar~]

Ok. Have to say, nice thing about an earth map is no real need for scouting if you took a geography class. Having realized that Russia starts pretty far to the west, I'm thinking getting a foothold on mainland Europe is probably out of the question. So my thinking is first settler to Scandinavia, second to the killer site next to the sheep, and then get open borders with Izzy and move into Africa. Also, maybe make an effort to get a site or two into the eastern half of Russia which will probably take longer to settle. War wise, Paris is a killer site, so I definitely think the French will be the first target, but I would think that will wait at least til Macemen. So, all that's long term. This will be 20 turns where I might get the second settler out and otherwise I'll mash enter a whole lot.


3200 BC: Meet Izzy, there shall be peace in our time.

3160 BC: AH in. The crucial techs for us right now are Sailing, Masonry, Wheel and Mysticism. I'm gonna get Masonry and Wheel first so Stonehenge can be completed with the stone bonus for the entire production. I hope this doesn't lose us Stonehenge, but I highly doubt it unless Louis is feeling particularly frisky. Handily, horses pop on the only non-bonus tile in land-based London. That city is going to be size 17 before 1000 AD. So my theoretical research path is Sailing -> Masonry -> Wheel -> Mysticism. I won't complete anywhere near all of that, but its my thinking. Start sailing. Start a warrior in London as work boat still is useless. My thought process for London build is warrior ->settler -> galley. And this is the most talking you'll see from me for 20 turns.



3000 BC: Cow Pasture in, move to Horse Pasture.
2920 BC: Warrior completes, start Settler. Sailing due in 6. Hinduism FIDAL. Caesar converts to Buddhism. I fear Izzy's religion sphere of influence will get all of Europe which will make a war declaration on Louis quite dicey.
2840 BC: Horses done. Go to wheat.
2720 BC: Sailing done, start Masonry.
2640 BC: Wheat farmed, head to other Cows.
2560 BC: Settler done, start Galley.
2440 BC: Masonry, start wheel. Cow Pasture completes, move to stone for quarrying, London hits size 4. And so ends the reign of Gasptoria I.

Here's a picture of London in all her glory. Note France already has 10% influence on London herself. We're going to have pump the culture like mad or kill Louis.



So, as soon as that galley comes in, I'd get the warrior settler pair over to Scandinavia. Mysticism should be the next tech, my unofficial estimate says Stonehenge should be about 6 turns when it does come in. I wouldn't be super particular about where to settle, anything on the Scandinavian coast which catches a bonus will do, I'd shuttle the worker over right after, maybe with another warrior for scouting. After Mysticism I'd pick up BW, reassess when we see copper. I'm sure one of the hills in the north will have one of the metals, this is Britain after all, if we don't get iron and coal, that map creator should be shot.

After Stonehenge is in I'd grab another settler for reddot on Eggs map, then have one of the other cities pump settlers nonstop till the economy crashes or we run out of room, whichever comes first. Note that sites in Russia and/or Africa will be expensive, but I feel necessary. Last but not least, London will hit happy cap in 3 turns, but I'd let her keep growing, we can probably support 3+ citizens over the cap with all those bonuses and just whip them in, maybe for a late run at Pyramids if everything else goes well, for infra if not. I normally don't support whipping in the capital, but theres no way we can keep up on happiness with all those bonii, and running specialists is going to be a waste until we get some good infra in.

Ok, I'm talking way too much, Eggs is on the clock

The Save:

 

[chriseay]

Good turns and good thoughts Gaspar! I don't think there's anything I disagree with. Eggs, you're up for 20 turns. If you have any questions before you play, feel free!

 

[shinku]

Lurkers coment: You could go alot of ways here on this game, but I would probably take out Louis first. France was Britians greatest enemy, and that would be one less rival making a grab for the new world.

Thought so at first, but if you take a look at the save (or have very good eyes and carefully observe the screenshot), you can see Spanish borders south of Paris, and German borders at the east.
So Louis will have, at best, two contiguous cities, and a few others he will have squeezed here and there, far from his capital. Not much of a threat.

 

[Eggs]

I'll play my turns in a couple of hours .

It's looking pretty good . It's only a shame that we probably won't get the great lighthouse. The trade routes would come in really handy with all this distant expansian we're planning. I guess even if we go chopping it will take too long to get a normal lighthouse and then TGL. We'll also need another warrior to keep London happy.

 

[chriseay]

I'll play my turns in a couple of hours .

It's looking pretty good . It's only a shame that we probably won't get the great lighthouse. The trade routes would come in really handy with all this distant expansian we're planning. I guess even if we go chopping it will take too long to get a normal lighthouse and then TGL. We'll also need another warrior to keep London happy.

That is true, plus we don't have much too chop. Remember for now only one military unit can do MP'ing. We need Herditary for more than that. Good luck!

 

[Eggs]

The warrior we have in London will soon be leaving for an exciting new adventure though.

I think I'll settle a town on our side of Norway first if there is a food resource for fast growth (even though I think it might have a bunch of mountains then). We can then place our 4th city (assuming our #3 will be in Scotland) more carefully in Sweden. It should be so that the AI can only get to Sweden through Finland, and that should mean that the only ones I can see going there would be Russia and perhaps Germany if Russia is far enough to the East. Will we be in time with our Swedish city if we do it like this? Or should I take our warrior and settler to Sweden (or even Finland?) right away and look for a sweet spot there while securing enough land?

 

[Gaspar~]

I would get the first city in Norway, wherever theres food and or happies (preferably pre-Calendar since I'd guess we'll delay Calendar a bit for Stonehenge goodness.) Then the Scottish city. While I want to expand aggressively, it makes good sense to avoid heavy distance from palace penalties immediately. Then I would make the next settler as far a reach east by land from the first Scandinavian city, backfilling later. Which brings a point:

Don't sign Open Borders with anyone who can reach us until we've sealed off our contiguous land (British Isles, Ireland, Scandinavia.)

Once we have all that full, OB = ok as we drive into Africa and Eastern Russia unless we have a real opportunity to seal off more land. My guess is we'll need trade routes more though.

As far as wonders, I would love to get Pyramids, GL and Colossus. In that order. But every hammer we tie up in the wonder effort is one less for expansion, and I think we should ignore it until we're in a comfortable place. Remeber as soon as we get metal we're going to need to gung ho the military, we'll have a lot of border tension and the only way to dissuade aggression is a high soldiers rating. On that same note I would not take someone else religion until we have a good picture of the political situation. Keep in mind if this plays out the way we want, we'll have borders with all the western Euro civs, Russia, Mali/Egypt, and perhaps even Mongolia or China. Also keep in mind Europe is going to fight a lot because they're all crammed in like a sardine.

Lot of fun to talk about so far.

 

[chriseay]

The warrior we have in London will soon be leaving for an exciting new adventure though.

Excellent point! Sometimes I don't think.

On settlement, even going to Scandanavia is a bit of a reach this early, so just find the best place you can on the coast. Food should be a must, and if there are any happies all the better. Like Gaspar said, I think we need to get a toehold over there...I might in fact take two over there first if we can. We'll need a land base in Europe eventually, and it's better to take it this way than by force.

Let's also think about getting down to Africa in the medium term. If we can start our self a string of coastal colonies down there we can work our way around and get a lot done before astronomy hits and we have to beeline west. Just a thought to think about.

 

[Gaspar~]

Good point on Africa, Chriseay. Not entirely sure how possible SE Asia and Australia are pre-Galleons, but a southern foothold at least opens the door. The Asian congestion surely is less than the European, so its another area to give ourselves a fighting chance.

Given all this talk, how desperately are we going to be beelining for State Property?