Cultural Diversity

Cultural Diversity

  1. Viregel

    Viregel , The Rt. Hon.

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    As I have very distant Slavic relations, I can somewhat confirm that a medieval technology would be best. In the case of Poland, the leader is medieval, so that should be fine. However, Russia only really became a powerhouse in the east after the Battle of Poltava, which was early Industrial era, so I'm kinda split on that one. Eastern Europe was dominated by large Slavic empires during the Medieval Era, so I'd say that's the best choice.
     
  2. JFD

    JFD Kathigitarkh

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  3. Viregel

    Viregel , The Rt. Hon.

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    I'm going to say late medieval here.
     
  4. janboruta

    janboruta Artistriarch

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    Late medieval as well. So after Civil Service and Theology, or around Steel or whatever. Late Medieval was a golden age for most Slavic states and their neighbours east of Russia, and Russia itself was then on their way to recovery after the Mongol power waned. (Poland - defeats the Teutonic Order and enters personal union with Lithuania; Lithuania vice versa; Bohemia - 14th century sees the rule of Vaclav II, 15th century enters the renaissance; Hungary blossoms under Angevin kings and in 15th under Jagiellons). Armenia is quite the exception here, but they were fiercely independent for most of the period so it fits the theme.

    I really like perma-resistance during war. Very fitting, given all the underground movements during WW2 and even the Cold War.

    I quite like other LastSword's ideas. Especially the idea behind gold penalty (strong nobility which often hamstrung the ambition of kings and blocked decisions in the parliament, see Poland in late 17th and all of 18th century). There's a nice pool of options there for the Slavs, it will be tough to choose a good list.
     
  5. COF

    COF Emperor

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    Would it be possible to make the Golden Tent provide a free Yurt in the city where it was constructed?
     
  6. arrghmatey32

    arrghmatey32 Chieftain

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    I have a couple of ideas related to the "Middle Eastern" division.

    I think that a great historical name for this group would be "Dar al Islam", although unfortunately, this name is tied to religion, which might make it awkward from a gameplay perspective.

    The most obvious routes to go would be trade routes and religion, but I think there are a few more flavorful, further outside of the box ideas that would be interesting.

    I think that diplomatic bonuses would be an interesting way to go. Historically, while this hasn't held true universally, I think that the Islamic world has had a much greater tendency to cooperate between countries than has the Christian world. This is reflected by the idea of the Caliphate. This could be represented by bonus towards diplomatic relations with others from the same culture group, or with others with the same religion.

    I think that another interesting trait historically was the cooperation with and absorption of outside groups into the dominant culture and government of the Middle East. The great Arabic empires incorporated many thousands of peoples whose descendants now consider themselves Arabic. Moroccan culture was formed through a synthesis of Arabic and Berber culture. The Ottoman empire was highly multicultural. There are a lot of ways that this could be shown through bonuses. I think that game mechanic that most closely resembles this is tourism, but an ability that reduces unhappiness in conquered cities might also do the trick.

    I think that an interesting penalty would be increased unhappiness from being influenced by another ideology.

    Just a couple of ideas from the top of my head.
     
  7. JFD

    JFD Kathigitarkh

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    After Civil Service it is then. Thanks.

    Yes, I can do that.

    Thanks for the ideas, I'll keep them in mind. I haven't thought too much about the Middle-Eastern civs, but I did want them have to a faith to science mechanic involved.
     
  8. COF

    COF Emperor

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    Some feedback concerning the Steppe Civs

    I played a game with the Uyghurs, since I figured that their incredible UA and UB would nullify the annexed city penalty and would allow me to conquer a lot.

    I spawned on a decent location near England, and thankfully close to China, Greece was on the same Continent but further away. I rushed Horseback riding to spam the Altaic rider and take out England before they expand, which wasn't tough at all due to my Units having no Combat penalty against cities.
    Even though I intended to avoid founding my own cities I just had to take a mountain location next to the Old Faithful. I figured that it would be useful since it opened up the way to Bejing, which was my priority at that time.

    Naturally there was barely any resistance, and at that point I was unstoppable.
    The only thing that suffered was my economy, I lost huge amounts of Gold due to Unit Maintenance.

    Overall I really like the new gameplay aspects it adds and I can't wait to play Bosnia with the Slavic mod.:goodjob:
     
  9. Krajzen

    Krajzen Deity

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    Lol, so currently we are going to have 15 cultural groups - not too much? :0

    Anyway - my new pack of ideas! I must say, I love this Mod Project and thinking on it :)

    All those suggestions are... Well, suggestions; especially numbers are highly debatable. Also, I don't have many ideas on Cultural Objectives.
    Because I love immersion, each group Bonus and Penalty has its own Fancy Name ;)

    CLASSIC CIVILISATONS - Greece, Rome, Carthago, Phoenicia (??) et cetera.

    Spoiler :
    Bonuses
    • Birth of Republic - Liberty, Aestethics, Patronage and Honor policies are 20% faster to gain.*
    • Pax Romana - Improvements and building construction time decreased by 20%.
    • Phoenician Expansion - National wonders can be built when half of the requirements are met**.
    • Classical Philosophy - Minor science and cultural boost for every Great Person born.
    • Ductus Exemplo - Each National Wonder present in city increases unit strenght of units build in it by 5%.***
    Penalties
    • Divide et Impera - Tradition, Piety and Rationalism policies are 25% slower to gain.****
    • Epicureism - All religious buildings and units are 33% more expensive.
    Unique Building
    [*]Thermae - +2 food and culture in city
    Unique National Wonder
    Forum - +2 happiness per city connection.
    Cultural Objectives
    • Build X tiles of roads. [One Time Boost]
    • Builds X aqueducts, thermae, harbors or amphitheatres. [OTB]
    • Maintain the biggest land army and largest fleet in the world.
    • Additional culture points for each enemy capital conquered.
    • Additional culture points for each Great Work in the empire, and Great Tile Improvement.

    * - ya know: Carthago, Rome, Greece and Phoenicia had big republican tendencies, and even when they were failing, all these states were 'WIDE' empires :)
    ** - I mean, when half of cities in the empire have certain building. Also... Come on, Heroic Epic! National Epic! National College! Grand Temple! Circus Maximus! These guys have to have some National Wonder bonus :0
    *** - Homer, tyrteism, Illada, Eneid, imperial glory, inspired hoplites and legions, right?
    **** - Those civs were also relatively 'liberal' in terms of Tradition and Piety. Rationalism is more controversial but I would like to balance this group... On the other hand: Roman/Carthaginian/Phoenician scientific achievements were rather achieved on military/architecture/infrastructure/law field than purely intellectual one. One could also say that while Greek philosophers had giant accomplishments in science, this is already reflected by Classical Philosophy for Great People and their early policies bonuses, while later Greek science stagnated. Eventually, scientific revolution in Europe was achieved not because of Greek philosophy (this doesn't contradicts its importance!) but because of denying infinite 'Greek knowledge', goddamn Aristotle and his wildly unscientific methods :p



    OCCIDENT CIVILISATIONS - England, Spain, Portugal, Netherlands, France, Germany, Venice, Denmark, Sweden.

    Spoiler :
    Bonuses
    • Scientific Revolution - costs of military and economic technologies since Medieval to Modern Era are halved.
    • Capitalism - +100% to yield of specialists, +50% to their great people bonus generation points.
    • Seven Seas - Each sea trade route sent to other Cultural Group increases gold and production by 5% in all cities, up to +25%.
    • Fire and Steel - +20% to ranged attack of all ranged units, +20% to ranged defense for all melee/cavalry units.
    • Colonialism - All cities on different landmass receive Palace, each city on different landmass does not increase policy/technology cost.
    Penalties
    • Discrimination- Unhapiness from cities with different religion or occupied cities increased.
    • Dark Ages - When no religion in majority of cities (before Renaissance), great people and social policy cost [and technology??] increased by 20%.
    Unique Building
    [*]Borough*
    Unique National Wonder
    [*]National Bank
    Cultural Objectives
    • Conquer or convert capital on other continent. [One Time Boost]
    • Culture for every trade route with other cultural group.
    • Culture for every natural wonder discovered. [One Time Boost]
    • Have the highest gold output in renaissance, or the highest production output in industrial era.
    • ???

    * - because I would like Occident to have any reference to 'barbarian states' and also not being so 'progressive' :p



    SLAVIC CIVILISATIONS - Poland, Russia, Hungary, Lithuania, Czech, Kievan Russia, Bulgaria, I still support Byzantium here :D

    Spoiler :
    Bonuses
    • Antemurale Christianitas - defense increased in city with state religion by each faith point generated*
    • Eastern Cavalry - all mounted units receive promotion, which makes them deal +10% damage for every movement point spent while attacking enemy** :crazyeye:
    • Between Orient and Occident - Faith and culture boost when trade with other Cultural Group.
    • Slavic Empires - +20% production and faith while at war, +20% gold and culture while at peace.
    • Spark of God - Great People provide golden age boost when born.
    Penalties
    • Corruption- Unhappiness for high amount of citizens in cities.***
    • Gate to Europe - Penalty for naval and economic technologies.
    Unique Building
    [*]Seymik - bonus to culture and cavalry production.
    Unique National Wonder
    [*]Royal Castle Unhappiness from number of cities halved, technology cost for cities removed.


    * - up to 50% of 'normal' city defense, or some kind of similar balance.
    ** - I love this idea, but I don't know it is possible to create via lua.
    *** - here some kind of lua magic would be needed to calculate additional unhappiness for tall cities... Why Slavs? Because: eastern Europe was always less inhabited than western, had less Big Cities, more wide empires, and bad luck with political turmoil/uprisings/revolutions/anarchy, and I have no other idea for reflecting that. Initially I thought also about unhappiness for each social policy adopted, but I'm really not sure about this solution...


    Ok, so this is my vision of Europe. I am STILL convinced that Byzantium with its 'religious fortress' and 'powerful cavalry' and 'messy political life' fits rather into Slavs than Classical Group :D

    now, we get the hell out of this booooring Europe...


    ANCIENT CIVILISATIONS - Egypt, Babylon, Sumer, Assyria, Persia, Hittites, Harappa (??) et cetera.

    To be honest, I would prefer adding Persia to Crescent group, because it is rather Wide Rich Empire than Tall Early River Civilisation... And for most of its history, Persia was muslim :p

    Spoiler :
    Bonuses
    • Cradle of Civilisation - science bonus for ancient era techs.
    • Code of Hammurabi - each social policy from Honor and Piety tree gives X happiness/whatever else
    • River Irrigation - fresh water bonus is available since Agriculture/Pottery.
    • Ancient Architecture - internal trade routes provide bonus to wonder construction; they are 50% more effective.
    • Wrath of Tigris - bonus attack for garrisoned units or units attacking enemies adjacent to rivers.
    Penalties
    • Immortal Despotism- each post - ancient social policy tree generates 1 unhappiness for each policy.
    • Stagnation - penalty for discovering medieval technologies.
    Unique Building
    [*]Sewer - provide fresh water on tiles adjacent to city.
    Unique National Wonder
    [*]Golden Throne - Palace yield is doubled.

    Cultural Objectives:
    - Be the first civ to discover Writing or Wheel.
    - Be the first civ to conquer other civs' city.



    BHARATA CIVILISATIONS - India, 4civs from incoming Indian Civs Pack, Sikh, Harappa (??), Nepal, Tibet (??) etc.

    Spoiler :
    Bonuses
    • Spirituality - faith contributes to Great Scientist creation, culture contributes to Great Prophet generation.
    • Bless of Wishnu - writer guild is available since Writing, artist guild since Currency; double great work slots in National Wonders, which provide happiness when filled.
    • Jambu Dweepa - farms and plantations provide +1 food with religion and +1 faith with Philosophy tech.
    • Elephant Army - each Bharata civ can recruit unique units of other Bharata civilisations. Artillery has +1 movement.
    • Urban Centers - each resource tile worked by city increases wonder production by 1%.
    Penalties
    • Overpopulation- each citizen decreases city gold production by 1%, up to 25%.
    • Caste System - unit production speed decreased by 20%.
    Unique Building
    [*]Mandir - faith for every social policy tree finished.
    Unique National Wonder
    [*]Mahal - 3 great works of Art slots, each of them provides +3 gold when filled.

    Cultural Objectives:
    - Be the first or second civ to found a religion (bonus halved for second place)
    - Have the most popular religion in the world
    - X amount of culture per X happiness over 0


    ...and my old three completed Groups:


    AFRICAN CIVILISATIONS - Ethiopia, Nubia, Kilwa, Zulu, Zimbabwe, Kongo, Benin, Nri, Mali, Songhaj, Kanem - Bornu

    I added building ideas.

    Spoiler :

    Bonuses
    • Long - Distance TradeLand trade routes have doubled range.
    • African RichesLand trade routes income bonus from various resources is tripled.
    • Glorious InfantryAll melee pre - Industrial units can randomly receive one of unique African promotions: Elephant (50% chance that defeated enemy unit will provide gold bonus - slaves :( ), Bull (33% chance on double damage), Lion (+33% to defense when adjacent to friendly city) .
    • Tribal CultureTourism from Great Works of Music doubled, each your city receives adjacent Artifact while entering Renaissance Age.
    • Great Bantu MigrationCivilian units' speed is doubled.
    Penalties
    • Slave Trade-25% to speed of creating buildings in cities and terrain improvements.
    • Oral CultureScience from scientific buildings decreased.
    Cultural Objectives
    • Have X number of units with X experience level.
    • Earn X gold via Trade Routes.
    • Don't loose cities to other African civilisations.
    • Have the biggest culture output or land army in the world.
    Unique Building
    [*]Black Market - bonus towards We Love the King Day. Sorry but I couldn't resist with this name :D
    Unique National Wonder
    [*]Royal Court - instant gold and culture boost.




    CRESCENT CIVILISATIONS - Arabia, Ayyubids, Ottoman, Morocco, Persia, Durrani

    I added building ideas.

    Spoiler :

    Bonuses
    • Faith of ProphetsEach world city with non - Crescent religion increases faith by +1, faith gain this way cannot be higher than 66% faith of the most religious non - Crescent civ.
    • Golden Age of IslamEach faith point produced in your cities (no religious CS and 1st ability) gives 1 point of science; half of the science points contribute to Great Prophet accumulation.
    • JihadAll military units gain +15% strenght while fighting with units and cities of civ with other majority religion; bonus doubled for Mounted.
    • Abrahamic ReligionsFree courthouse, halved resistance and culture boost after capturing city with different religion (no bonus while conquering pantheon city!)
    • Thousand NightsEach 5 desert tiles increase Great Writer birth rate by 1, trade routes from desert cities have increased income.
    Penalties
    • Dark Age of Islam-25% to normal science output.
    • Fall of Caliphate+15% to social policy cost .
    Cultural Objectives
    • Conquer X cities of different religion.
    • Have your state religion in majority of your cities.
    • Have at least 3rd faith, cultural or science output in the world (cultural points for every one High Amount of these)
    • Maintain the biggest cavalry army in the world.
    • +X culture boost for each new Great Work of Writing, Great Scientist or trade route created.
    Unique Building
    [*]Jannah - +1 food for desert tiles near the city.
    Unique National Wonder
    [*]Dynastic Library - Thousands Nights bonus doubled; 3 slots for Great Works of Literature, which provide +2 faith and +2 science when filled.





    ORIENTAL CIVILISATIONS - China, Chinese civs, Korea, Vietnam, Japan? :p

    I added buildings ideas.

    Spoiler :

    Bonuses
    • Four Great InventionsResearch pace increased while developing military, cultural or social technologies.
    • BureaucracyEach citizen in city provides X % bonus to culture and production.
    • Rice CultivationAmount of food required to gain new citizen and amount of points required to get Great Person decreased by X % per number of cities in the empire. :crazyeye:
    • Silk RoadNon - Oriental trade route incomes to the city provide increased income for both civilisations
    • Legacy of the Red RiverMilitary bonus for fighting adjacent to enemy or friendly cities, increased by number of citizens of given city.
    Penalties
    • Decline of ConfucianismOwn religious spread and own trade route income decreased by 33%.
    • IsolationPenalty for developing post - Medieval economic and naval technologies.
    Cultural Objectives
    • Be the most technologically developed nation in the world or have the highest tourism in the world.
    • Bonus culture for each Great Work, Wonder or Great Tile Improvement for each Era passed since its rise.
    • Control every yours original city.
    • Culture per each trade route incoming to YOUR civilisation.
    • +X culture for X number of experience points gain by your military units.
    Unique Building
    [*]Academy - units trained here are upgraded for 1/3 cost. [this reflects East Asian adaptation and modernisation, as well as their developed military technology]
    Unique National Wonder
    [*]Imperial Citadel - bonus happiness per citizens/cities.



    ...and FINALLY few single ideas for others - already covered - groups.

    Spoiler :

    Colonial Bonuses:
    - bonus happiness/culture for different religions
    - tourism from great works doubled
    - no science and culture penalty for cities settled after Medieval Era
    - +20% strenght for units fighting outside national territory and -25% experience required for the next level.
    - +5% science and production since industrial era, bonus increases with each era by 5%

    Penalties:
    - -20% strenght for units fighting on national territory :crazyeye: [this reflects lack of big defensive colonial wars for]
    - -15%, -10%, -5% for research in early ages

    So, to sum up, this looks like that: ancient -15% science, classical era -10%, medieval -5%, renaissance 0%, industrial +5%, modern +10%, atomic +15%, information +20%.

    Building - Outpost, instantly grabs 6 tiles near borders
    National Wonders - Independence Vow, instant Golden Age and free Great Person.

    aaand few more buildings' ideas.

    Native American Tribes
    building - Totem - bonus culture/whatever for every great person born in that city
    wonder - Sacred Field - +1 happiness for every camp/pasture

    Native American Civilisations
    building - Obelisk - bonus yield from number of buildings in city
    wonder - Sun Temple - bonus science from terrain improvements in city


    OH MY GOD. That's all. :D

    Please review it, guys ;)

    Also, we should make Final Group Division and already think on few Controversial Civs:
    - Armenia, Israel
    - Nubia, Garamantes
    - Goths, Celts
    - Tibet
    - Polynesia, Maori, some other native tribes from all over the world.
     
  10. JFD

    JFD Kathigitarkh

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    Thanks for the feedback. Sounds like the Steppes worked out as I had hoped. You don't recommend any further penalties, or anything? Or do you feel the economic depression you had was enough to stop the Steppe civs from being too powerful (I mean, obviously as more and more civ's get their group effects it'll naturally balance out, but still).

    Hopefully the slavs will make steamrolling over civs as the Steppes much harder.

    Some more excellent ideas for me to consider. I really appreciate it, Kajzen, you've given me a good place to start with these two groups. I was going to put Mali and Songhai in the sub-saharan group, which would emphasis gold and trade, as you've already begun doing. They're Muslim civilizations, but as Janboruta said, we should avoid grouping civs based upon religious affiliation (as such, the Mughals would probably go to the Indian group, and the Timurids are a part of the Steppe group).
     
  11. Krajzen

    Krajzen Deity

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    Which ideas are your favourite ones (and seem to be balanced/possible to create?) :p Look also at Oriental Group ;)

    Yesterday I am going to think about Indian Group (to be honest this seems hard to differentiate from Mandala group... my poor knowledge of major Indian achievements includes Great Scientists (mathematics!), awesome architecture and infrastructure since Harappa, Great Works, cool artillery and elephants, agriculture, sacred rivers, SPIRITUALITY AND FAITH and... Oh, I changed my mind during writing this :D ), Western European Group (pros: sea trade, navy and exploration, army, specialists, social policies; cons: awful 'ecology' and tolerance ;) ), Ancient East Group and Ancient Mediterranean Group.

    Are Colonial and Indigenous America Groups defined? :p
     
  12. Leugi

    Leugi Supreme Libertador

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    Yep :p , check page 3, post 50
     
  13. JFD

    JFD Kathigitarkh

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    Crescent Civs

    I especially like faith to science (especially because it was an idea I was going to go with anyway :) ), but I didn't think of turning some science into Great Prophet points. Now that's neat.

    I'm not sure about the free courthouse and halved resistance, et al. Mostly because halved resistance is a policy from Sovereign Revisal, and I want them to be as compatible as possible. Maybe the courthouse by itself, but the culture boost seems a bit over-saturating with too many different effects for this group.

    And some kind of bonus against cities following a different religion is pretty much a given. Doubled for cavalry is interesting (now we need a Mamluks civ).

    I'm not sure I could do the whole Great Writer points from desert thing (just starting to branch out into modding with plots/tiles).

    The penalties are great; very thematic.

    African Civs

    Definitely something with trade routes - longer land trade routes seem the most natural. Possibly resource diversity; though it runs the risk of invalidating Portugal (or maybe it makes Portugal even more special). I don't know about the culture on trade routes, though, as this definitely gets in the way of Morocco. And what is the science from sea trade routes based on?

    The penalties are pretty good, although I'd go with a general research penalty rather than a less science (the latter might be a bit of a hassle for me to code).

    Oriental

    Research pace increased while developing military, cultural or social technologies. - yes. Love it.

    The less food needed for a new citizen is an interesting idea. I don't know how possible, but certainly one that catches my interest especially.

    A penalty to religious spread could be good; again, I don't know how possible though (some game values allow a negative value, some don't).

    Also, Japan has to be in its own group, with an emphasis on isolationism.
     
  14. Beefie

    Beefie Warlord

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    Few ideas I put together:

    Royal Families of Europe
    Austria, England, France, Netherlands, Portugal, Spain

    Bonuses
    • Begin with Tradition unlocked
    • Unhappiness from population in capital reduced by 33%
    • Length of WLTKD increased by 50% and increases gold output of that city
    • Signing a DoF with another Royal Family of Europe results in a culture and gold boost for both parties
    • Combat bonus against City states on other continents

    Penalties
    • Cities without a connection to your capital generate extra unhappiness
    • +1 Unhappiness for each SP and Great Works combined which you have less than the Royal Family with the most
    • Specialists consume additional food

    Cultural Objectives
    • Possess the largest navy in the world (+5 culture per turn)
    • Possess the largest treasury in the world (+2 Culture per turn, +8 happiness)
    • Host the world congress (+40% Tourism when host)
    • Establish a trade connection from a city on another continent to your capital (+250 if first amongst the Royal Families, +100 otherwise)
    • Have a spy in a Royal Family capital (+15% against their units for 20 turns if they declare war)

    Unique technology: Divine Right. Requires Chivalry. Unlocks the Palace of Versailles wonder and the Royal Court building, automatically establishes an embassy in all met civs as long as you are not at war.

    Palace of Versailles: +2 culture, comes with a filled Great work of art slot and +33% tourism against civs which have a diplomat or spy in this city.

    Royal Court: Great Work of art slot, when filled acts as a luxury resource for Trade Route purposes

    I excluded Sweden, Denmark, Germany, Norway, Tuscany etc as I suspect there are more suited groups for them.

    To add to the colonial suggestions, a few ideas I had where:
    • They would receive an additional random cultural objective from those of the first chiefdom, pre-Columbian, aboriginal etc cultural group they meet. (So as to increase competition between them and further define their relationship with the natives)
    • Penalty: Would begin the game with a strong diplo hit with all Royal Families, or whatever European power denomination you decide upon (Upstart might give the colonies ideas!) but
    • On first signing a DoF with civ of this culture group initiates a golden age and WLTKD in all cities (International recognition as separate entity)

    Hope this are helpful ideas :)
     
  15. JFD

    JFD Kathigitarkh

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    Oh, as being this way politically inclined, you've really got me hooked with this idea. But I don't think it's appropriate to tie cultural groups to their government form, unfortunately. That said, I'm just going to "take" (don't worry, I'll credit) some of these ideas for Sovereign Revisal. Some bonuses for DoF with the same government type (in SR, you choose between a Monarchy or a Republic) is a great idea. I'm already using Versailles in SR, too.

    But some of these objectives will be useful for Cultural Diversity, definitely. And unconnected city unhappiness is a great penalty for someone. Brilliant. Thanks very much!
     
  16. SuperWaffle247

    SuperWaffle247 Secretary General

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    Really love the concepts in this thread...it's really interesting. Are you planning/interested in releasing the content you create for this (wonders, techs) standalone? I might play TSL games with the big cultural traits occasionally but I'd use the wonders and such regularly.
     
  17. JFD

    JFD Kathigitarkh

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  18. TPangolin

    TPangolin Just the worst person

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    IMO -


    Latin America (These are unique enough to be included in their own subset)
    Bolivia, Gran Colombia, Chile, Brazil, Argentina, Peru, Paraguay, Central American Repiblic

    Leugi outlined some great ideas for the above civs.

    Colonialist Legacies/Frontier Civs (These are civs originally founded by European powers to explore the great unknown and harness the resources on the edge of the world)
    Australia, America, Mexico, Canada, Philippines, Rhodesia, Boers, Texas

    These guys should focus more on Tourism, the harvesting of Natural Resources and bonuses for exploration and having a the most land. They should be relatively minor powers throughout the early game, but should become really emergent in the Industrial Era.
     
  19. COF

    COF Emperor

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    Nah, the economic depression was most likely my own fault since I didn't do much exploration and hence didn't have much trading options.
    One thing I should probably point out is that I barely felt the science penalty, in fact I did pretty well. Maybe because I used the more beliefs mod with certain :c5science: beliefs.

    Also, would it be possible to give Great Generals more movement? By the time they catch up with my cavalry I already took the opponent out :crazyeye:
     
  20. JFD

    JFD Kathigitarkh

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