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Culture (Unit + Quarter) Speculation Thread

Discussion in 'Humankind by Amplitude' started by Matthias Corvinus, Feb 12, 2020.

?

Who will you play first?

  1. Assyrians

    2 vote(s)
    3.0%
  2. Babylonians

    5 vote(s)
    7.6%
  3. Egyptians

    4 vote(s)
    6.1%
  4. Harappans

    11 vote(s)
    16.7%
  5. Hittites

    2 vote(s)
    3.0%
  6. Mycenaeans

    5 vote(s)
    7.6%
  7. Nubians

    3 vote(s)
    4.5%
  8. Olmecs

    6 vote(s)
    9.1%
  9. Phoenicians

    10 vote(s)
    15.2%
  10. Zhou

    9 vote(s)
    13.6%
  11. Random

    9 vote(s)
    13.6%
  1. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    Not to mention that the Statue of Liberty was originally designed and built by the French, including Gustave Eiffel, making Builder even more of a possibility. :mischief:
    I wouldn't have considered Builders for them if I hadn't known that the Industrial Era in game goes to about the year 1920.
     
  2. Siptah

    Siptah Eternal Chieftain

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    What might Russia get? Expansionist? Or agrarian with a cultural EQ/legacy trait? But be fun if they get a super cheap and easily massable infantry EU.
     
  3. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    I'd be surprised if Russia isn't expansionist just because of the size of it.
    Sure the serfdom idea was used but most of the time it was for political power, and the land wasn't very useful for improving. I have a feeling if we get an agrarian culture it might go to a Latin American country such as the Mexicans with the hacienda system.
     
  4. FinalDoomsday

    FinalDoomsday Prince

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    If the United States shows up for industrial they could be a strong expansionist candidate too but I'm not sure if they will be included in this era. If the Sioux or another plains culture shows up it might be more likely as they seem to try and get cultures that had interactions (conflict usually)
     
  5. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    I'm back and forth on whether the U.S. will show up or wait until the next era. I'm leaning towards the latter because I think the whole transcending idea makes sense if you have the ability to go from British into the Americans. I think the same will be with Russia into the Soviets and the interaction between the U.S. and the Soviet Union was way bigger.
     
    Guandao likes this.
  6. Xandinho

    Xandinho Emperor

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    I think USA makes the most sense as a contemporary, which is when it reached its maximum power level. I wouldn't be surprised to see it as a scientist.

    Are we sure that Mexicans will be in the industrial age? Almost certain that they will be agrarian.
     
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  7. CivLuvah

    CivLuvah Deity

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    Some even speculate the Argentinians, as agrarian, will be in the industrial era.
     
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  8. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

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    There appears to be a screenshot of some Spanish Latin American culture in the Industrial Era. Which one is anybody's guess.
     
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  9. mitsho

    mitsho Deity

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    Ideally, the Americans would be both in the industrial AND in the modern era. Or maybe even in the early modern era as well: Colonial -> Wild West -> Hollywood & World Power. But ideally in this phrase refers to a time when we have 600 instead of 60 cultures. And while that hight number of cultures may be good for realism, it might not work for gameplay reasons.
     
  10. FinalDoomsday

    FinalDoomsday Prince

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    Personally I'd be happy with USA just turning up in the Contempoary era but I cant discount them from Industrial yet it depends how much they want to focus on North America in the Industrial era.
     
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  11. CivLuvah

    CivLuvah Deity

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    The United States didn't become a full-fledged superpower until by the 1920s, so I think they'll put it in the Contemporary era.
     
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  12. j51

    j51 Blue Star Cadet

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    It's kind of an issue in that so many technological changes in the modern era happened in a short time span. The tech/in-game eras changed at a rate far faster than the major cultures changed.

    Like you could make ~1750 till the end of game one single era, but then you'd have military tech changing so often (example: fusiliers to infantry to mech. infantry) that it would become very cluttered and a single culture's emblematic unit wouldn't last very long.
     
  13. Boris Gudenuf

    Boris Gudenuf Deity

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    Depends on how you define "superpower": in the 1920s the USA was one of the great Industrial/Production powers in the world, and one of the top Financial (Gold) powers, but except for the US Navy, it was well down the list militarily - Germany was limited to a 100,000 man army by Treaty, the US went to an army barely over 100,000 men by choice! And diplomatically, the USA was pretty isolationist right up to 1941. It didn't really become a full-bore international Superpower until after 1943, when the US military and economic strength were both orders of magnitude ahead of any other single state in the world.

    The traditional 4X Historical Game way around the speeding up of developments in the late game is to have turns with less intervals: Ancient Eras with turns lasting 40 - 50 years, Modern Era with turns lasting 1 year, so that each Era is actually the same length in Turns even while being vastly different in length in Years.

    This is only a partial solution, though, because no amount of fiddling with turn length can disguise the fact that, for examples, a Roman Legion stayed about the same for 600 years and the European Knight remained an armored horseman with lance for 500 years, but the black powder rifleman was ony the main infantry force for about 40 years and the single engine monoplane fighter aircraft was introduced in 1933 (The Soviet I-16, to be exact) and was made obsolete just 12 years later by the jet aircraft (Gloster Meteor, German Me-262 and US P-80 all in 1944 - 45). Unfortunately, in most games 12 turns isn't enough time to build, deploy and use a weapon or Unit unless the enemy is conveniently located a few tiles from your capital!
     
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  14. mitsho

    mitsho Deity

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    Being a superpower is not a condition for inclusion in the roster. Rather, amplitude constantly repeats the word emblematic instead of unique. The idea is to create a world that lives and that also means filling it with connected civs.

    That's why I expect there to be duplicate options - when they have reached 120+ included cultures: the Colonial Time & Founding fathers, but especially the "colonization" of the Wild West is just so very much emblematic. Playing "Cowboys and Indians", Gold Rush and the Civil War with all its Southern Antebellum slavery "glory", just so emblematic. And you can't really depict this with transcended English, Franks, Teutons or Norsemen. As the English themselves by the way are in dire need for an early modern implementation around Henry VIII, pirates, theatre and fighting with Scotland. And the Franks by the way need one with Francis II, the religious wars and the Huguenots as well as up to Versailles. They're missing out on Versailles at the moment!

    So again, if you want to provide a full historical picture, you need a few more options. The challenge will be the naming of them, since I do agree, we absolutely need the modern era United States! But let's first enjoy the vanilla game :)

    I think that's the biggest challenge for a historical all-encompassing strategy game. Since Humankind has battles that are resolved in around 3 turns during one turn, that simplifies this problem a bit. But in general yes, the solution is to simplify the units very strictly: going directly for the jet fighters and bombers, chosing one contemporary look for both of them and that's it. Or maybe a future game will do wars like humankind does battles: on a separate map that resolves in one turn. Might make you prepared for war better.
     
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  15. Catoninetales_Amplitude

    Catoninetales_Amplitude Prince

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    Sounds more at home in an Old World mod, given his personal history... :p
     
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  16. mitsho

    mitsho Deity

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    Or in Crusaders Kings III, though to be fair he would be a tame angel there. :)
     
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  17. ehecatzin

    ehecatzin Emperor

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    I've been examining the latin american screen, and it does look like half of Palacio Nacional in Mexico city, but at least to me it looks a bit incomplete? maybe they decided to cut in half so that it doesn't jus tlook like a big square? I certainly hope they went for the Porfiriato to represent Mexico, It's honestly the only part where Mexico in industrial would make sense, early independent Mexico was a hot mess.

    I'll be honest, I would have prefered Chapultepec castle for the city center....but I guess they could also use it for the military quarter graphics.

    And...is there any chance the Americans will get 2 cultures? I mean, yeah America was important during the industrial Era, but it should be a contemporary power to butt heads with the USSR.
     
  18. Narcisse

    Narcisse Warlord

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    I have the same statement than you, it's seems to be unfinished, the square in the court is really weird, and the lack of details comparing to the Russian one for exemple.
    Maybe it will be a mix of Palacio Nacional and Chapultepec, the CC are not always 100% the same than IIRC, but some sort of interpretation sometimes. Maybe in the court there will be the little tower of Chapultec.
     
  19. ehecatzin

    ehecatzin Emperor

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    I'd say if nything maybe they took some liberties and added details from other's Mexican state's goberning palace. but it does look very suspiscious like the inner courtyard of the Palacio Nacional.

    Spoiler front :


    Spoiler inner courtyard :


    I'm gessing as well It's a WIP, right now it looks sort of rectangular instead of square. Besides the coloring could be a bit more vivid.


    EDIT: Also tomorow It's Mexico's independence day, any chance we might get Mexico reveal?
     
  20. Narcisse

    Narcisse Warlord

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    Yep, we make this comparaison on discord with the aerial view. Seems the most evident possibility.
     

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