Yes you have the grace turn. And no need to apologize, learning is what life's about. 
Deathmatch: Council Spoiler Thread
- Thread starter Niklas
- Start date
Nothing much happening for me. One of my surviving Jags is licking his wounds west of Grizzly, the other is trying to sneak past to scout as much as possible before he inevitably succumbs.
Here's an overlay combining our two viewports:
Note that Beorn is actually south of the "equator", so chances are we'll find Whomp north of him. That's where I'm scouting now at any rate.
Here's an overlay combining our two viewports:
Spoiler :
Note that Beorn is actually south of the "equator", so chances are we'll find Whomp north of him. That's where I'm scouting now at any rate.
Actually it looks like your Enkidu in Sumer is not necessary for happiness right now - he could move to Ur for the 1 turn that Ur is size 5, then be back in Sumer as it grows to size 4
.It's not too late if you want to change. Next turn when you get the save, you should have 12 food in the bin, so you can still switch from iron hill to silks and get growth 1 turn faster without delaying the settler.
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
Thanks Chamnix – I actually played before I found your note, but happily, I figured out that I could MM back to the silk and still be ok
Moving the EkWarrior from Summer to Ur is a brilliant Idea! I’ll totally do that. Thanks.
I also had a major surplus of shields finishing the Barracks in Summer, so I MMed it to pick up an extra commerce.
All-in-all, brought my time to finish HBR down to just 4 turns![[party]](/images/smilies/partytime.gif "Party [party]")
– but that’ll change as my maintenance costs go up here again.
Here’s the Empire:
Hopefully I’m getting close to Whomp, so I can relieve a little pressure off Niklas in the North.
Plan is to pump out another EkWarrior in Summer to guard my next settler – then I’m kinda thinking about doing another worker (since I’m in such good shape defensively, with Whomp and Beorn busy in the West) – and then building some horses before I start on a stack of swords.
Thoughts on that?
Moving the EkWarrior from Summer to Ur is a brilliant Idea! I’ll totally do that. Thanks.
I also had a major surplus of shields finishing the Barracks in Summer, so I MMed it to pick up an extra commerce.
All-in-all, brought my time to finish HBR down to just 4 turns
– but that’ll change as my maintenance costs go up here again. Here’s the Empire:
Hopefully I’m getting close to Whomp, so I can relieve a little pressure off Niklas in the North.
Plan is to pump out another EkWarrior in Summer to guard my next settler – then I’m kinda thinking about doing another worker (since I’m in such good shape defensively, with Whomp and Beorn busy in the West) – and then building some horses before I start on a stack of swords.
Thoughts on that?
Maybe Niklas has some excess money? 5g will do the job, after HBR you are done with science...All-in-all, brought my time to finish HBR down to just 4 turns
But maybe it won't be necessary, you won't need HBR too soon. Maybe even delay it to build some chariots to upgrade?
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
Switched workers around at Summer - growth now in 3 along with completing my next EkWarrior. This adds a turn to HBR, but oh-well.
Plan to turn my Middle scout North to climb the recently erupted Volcano, so I get a little less overlap with my southern most scout.
@ Niklas – any advice on how you want me to approach Beorn? Stick to the North, then drop down? Or follow your Jag straight in for maximum disruption?
@Paul – that’s an interesting idea. I guess we hadn’t fully decided if I was going to shut off research after HBR or not. If I’m going to, it probably makes sense to stall it at 1 turn left, pile up some cash while I build Chariots, and then do a mass upgrade. OTOH, Niklas and I have an opportunity to get a more long-term advantage if we can keep Beorn and Whomp 100% focused on Military while I expand and advance in Tech.
But it’s probably too early to be thinking about that – in the near term I guess I should probably focus on just units and settlers… meaning no more tech for a while after HBR.
So, a chariot is 20 shields, and costs 20gold to upgrade to a 30 shield horseman. Anyone have some thoughts on how long should I stall on HBR to pile up gold for Chariot upgrades?
EDIT: that will also mean prioritizing getting the Horse hooked up over getting the Iron. Happily, it’s very close at hand.
Empire:
Plan to turn my Middle scout North to climb the recently erupted Volcano, so I get a little less overlap with my southern most scout.
@ Niklas – any advice on how you want me to approach Beorn? Stick to the North, then drop down? Or follow your Jag straight in for maximum disruption?
@Paul – that’s an interesting idea. I guess we hadn’t fully decided if I was going to shut off research after HBR or not. If I’m going to, it probably makes sense to stall it at 1 turn left, pile up some cash while I build Chariots, and then do a mass upgrade. OTOH, Niklas and I have an opportunity to get a more long-term advantage if we can keep Beorn and Whomp 100% focused on Military while I expand and advance in Tech.
But it’s probably too early to be thinking about that – in the near term I guess I should probably focus on just units and settlers… meaning no more tech for a while after HBR.
So, a chariot is 20 shields, and costs 20gold to upgrade to a 30 shield horseman. Anyone have some thoughts on how long should I stall on HBR to pile up gold for Chariot upgrades?
EDIT: that will also mean prioritizing getting the Horse hooked up over getting the Iron. Happily, it’s very close at hand.
Empire:
Behold the power that is Abstraction!
The 16 will drop to 14 when my GA runs out, but I still have (exactly) enough time to mine one more BG. The next step of the plan will be to have workers start roading towards the front.
Some more exploration of the west shows no immediate path northwards, so it seems Whomp will be to the south after all. I might just stop and "rest" some.
The healed Jag is outrunning an archer-spear pair. I just love it how he diverts that kind of resources to hunt down a single Jag, whom he won't get close to anyway. He might herd me towards a mountie somewhere, but it will still have cost him.
The 16 will drop to 14 when my GA runs out, but I still have (exactly) enough time to mine one more BG. The next step of the plan will be to have workers start roading towards the front.
Some more exploration of the west shows no immediate path northwards, so it seems Whomp will be to the south after all. I might just stop and "rest" some.
The healed Jag is outrunning an archer-spear pair. I just love it how he diverts that kind of resources to hunt down a single Jag, whom he won't get close to anyway. He might herd me towards a mountie somewhere, but it will still have cost him.
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
Well – the tension mounts on the Western exploration front… I must be getting close!
I MM my towns and manage to pick up some extra food and commerce – Settler due next turn from Ur.
Where should I settle? Here are my ideas:
Red = A BG, a couple river tiles, and a bonus Sugar tile.
Blue = Grassland and 1 BG – but it’s on the coast, and would allow me to open up trading with further flung cities (like a Southern Passage city between Whomp and I?).
Green = Lots of forests to chop, shares a BG with Ur, lots of river tiles.
EDIT: Actually – as I look at this, I also had the idea to build a city on that hill directly south of my Red Circle (thanks to Civ4, temporarily forgot I could build just 1 tile away in Civ3!) – this location would give me immediate access to that mined BG tile when Ur isn’t using it, and would save me from having to road a hill to connect the city. It would also give me costal access… hmm – I kinda like that! Thoughts?
Of course, I could also take a flyer, and try to throw a city out in the Southern Passage right away, or one up by the Floodplains – my defensive situation seems pretty good at the moment, so maybe that’d be ok? In general, it seems like I should probably stick with building closer to home.
I plan to drop research down to 0% next turn and stockpile gold for upgrading horses.
The Empire:
I MM my towns and manage to pick up some extra food and commerce – Settler due next turn from Ur.
Where should I settle? Here are my ideas:
Red = A BG, a couple river tiles, and a bonus Sugar tile.
Blue = Grassland and 1 BG – but it’s on the coast, and would allow me to open up trading with further flung cities (like a Southern Passage city between Whomp and I?).
Green = Lots of forests to chop, shares a BG with Ur, lots of river tiles.
EDIT: Actually – as I look at this, I also had the idea to build a city on that hill directly south of my Red Circle (thanks to Civ4, temporarily forgot I could build just 1 tile away in Civ3!) – this location would give me immediate access to that mined BG tile when Ur isn’t using it, and would save me from having to road a hill to connect the city. It would also give me costal access… hmm – I kinda like that! Thoughts?
Of course, I could also take a flyer, and try to throw a city out in the Southern Passage right away, or one up by the Floodplains – my defensive situation seems pretty good at the moment, so maybe that’d be ok? In general, it seems like I should probably stick with building closer to home.
I plan to drop research down to 0% next turn and stockpile gold for upgrading horses.
The Empire:
denyd
Emperor
I also like 1 W of green, on a river (3fpt in ctr) and wheat in starting radius (that's like a BG).
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
That’s good DenyD – I like that – that would also allow me to wedge another city in there 2 tiles North-West of Ur. If I’m going to ICS, might as well do it in style!
I think I’m going to settle that hill first. It’s closer and can get up and running faster, thanks to the occasional use of a BG from Ur. (once I finish that southern BG, anyway.)
Sadly, the second mined BG I need to run a full time settler factory out of UR won’t be ready in time for this round – but next time it will be!
Science turned down to 0% - time to rack up some gold!
Turn 38
– that would also allow me to wedge another city in there 2 tiles North-West of Ur. If I’m going to ICS, might as well do it in style! I think I’m going to settle that hill first. It’s closer and can get up and running faster, thanks to the occasional use of a BG from Ur. (once I finish that southern BG, anyway.)
Sadly, the second mined BG I need to run a full time settler factory out of UR won’t be ready in time for this round – but next time it will be!
Science turned down to 0% - time to rack up some gold!
Turn 38
Some pics from my turn, didn't have time to upload an hour ago:
The Archer-Spear pair has disappeared from view, they must be in the marked area:
Some bad luck with my explorers (or good strategy from Beorn) means I'll most likely lose both my Jags next turn:
The Archer-Spear pair has disappeared from view, they must be in the marked area:
Some bad luck with my explorers (or good strategy from Beorn) means I'll most likely lose both my Jags next turn:
Regarding your settler strategy, I think your reasoning is sound, with one exception. It's very unlikely that we will ever get to Map Making in this game, let alone build any harbors, so coastal locations will only mean less good workable tiles for you.
I like denyd's suggested site, rule #1 should be to settle on the river whenever possible, unless there are good reasons not to. Settling the hills will be good since you can share the tiles with the capitol, but it will take you longer to grow. I think that's fine though, and it will allow you to settle a town on the river 3 N of the capitol to get the BG there, maybe even 4 N.
I like denyd's suggested site, rule #1 should be to settle on the river whenever possible, unless there are good reasons not to. Settling the hills will be good since you can share the tiles with the capitol, but it will take you longer to grow. I think that's fine though, and it will allow you to settle a town on the river 3 N of the capitol to get the BG there, maybe even 4 N.
Sometimes I hate being right.
For this turn I'm trying to be a bit clever:
The red lines mark where I think his archer-spear pair has gone to. So instead of taking the extra step, I've stopped at the position in the picture, hoping they will take another step forward so I can sprint past. It may be a bit worse for the Enkidu though, he won't do well against a vArcher. Not sure what we should do with him.
My other Jag will try to hunt down a mountie. I'll try to move one more turn towards the NW, then I'll employ a stalker tactics.
denyd
Emperor
The EW should move 1 E to force the any attacks to be across the river (+10%) if he's fortified that would make his defense 3.2 to the archer 2 attack. With that a Reg EW is 58% chance to win. Use the JW to draw him into that trap, then send the JW along the shoreline. When he makes it to the mountains, he'll be to beat against anything except MW.
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
Turn 40
Well – it probably going to be an ugly turn for me
- hopefully I’ll help to take a little pressure off Niklas at least.
@Denyd – good idea, but you posted about 10 minutes after I’d already played the save
I made a break for the East with my top EkWarrior – and wound up right next to that Archer Niklas warned me about. Now I just have to pray for a lucky RNG. More likely, I’ll just be drawing the archer away from Niklas – so hopefully I give his Jags the break they need!
In the South, I spied a Mounted Warrior on a Mountain, so I moved onto the hill, rather than retreat. I know it’s not great odds, but if he wants to attack me, he’ll have to come across a river and onto the hill. Still, since he has two units that can reach me, I’m probably a dead man. Again, the best I can really hope for is that I draw the Mounted Warrior away from my southernmost scout, allowing him to penetrate deeper into Whomp Land.
Back on the homefront, I built my 3rd city, and started on a regular EkWarrior to perform MP duty. Then I think I’ll build a worker, as I desperately need those. Both mines are now finished, so I’ll road those tiles – then it’s off to hook up the horse, and then the Iron.
Summer will build 1 more EkWarrior after this one, then a worker, then I should be ready to go on Chariots – so I’ll start pumping those out for eventual upgrade to Horsemen.
I’ve also mapped out my next 3 cities
Please comment on any part of these plans! I need all the help I can get, lol.
Well – it probably going to be an ugly turn for me
- hopefully I’ll help to take a little pressure off Niklas at least. @Denyd – good idea, but you posted about 10 minutes after I’d already played the save
I made a break for the East with my top EkWarrior – and wound up right next to that Archer Niklas warned me about. Now I just have to pray for a lucky RNG. More likely, I’ll just be drawing the archer away from Niklas – so hopefully I give his Jags the break they need!
In the South, I spied a Mounted Warrior on a Mountain, so I moved onto the hill, rather than retreat. I know it’s not great odds, but if he wants to attack me, he’ll have to come across a river and onto the hill. Still, since he has two units that can reach me, I’m probably a dead man. Again, the best I can really hope for is that I draw the Mounted Warrior away from my southernmost scout, allowing him to penetrate deeper into Whomp Land.
Back on the homefront, I built my 3rd city, and started on a regular EkWarrior to perform MP duty. Then I think I’ll build a worker, as I desperately need those. Both mines are now finished, so I’ll road those tiles – then it’s off to hook up the horse, and then the Iron.
Summer will build 1 more EkWarrior after this one, then a worker, then I should be ready to go on Chariots – so I’ll start pumping those out for eventual upgrade to Horsemen.
I’ve also mapped out my next 3 cities
Please comment on any part of these plans! I need all the help I can get, lol.
Sigh, this isn't going too well. He's put up a complete block of the northern path now:
I only have one Jag past that line now, on a mountain but within range of a MW, so likely he won't last long regardless. I guess it's time to hit plan B... or rather, devise a plan B.
I only have one Jag past that line now, on a mountain but within range of a MW, so likely he won't last long regardless. I guess it's time to hit plan B... or rather, devise a plan B.
denyd
Emperor
It looks like there's a path to the south (where the EW are). Leave a couple of JW to harass the spearmen and send any new JW that direction.
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
Turn 41
Well, it was a blood-bath, as expected. Happily, two good things came out of it. First – I managed to kill at least one unit! Whomp’s warrior.
Second, it looks like I got a nice burst of War Happiness
I’m up to first place in land area and second in population – so even though our war isn’t going so well, at least it looks like I’m pulling ahead in # of cities. I have another settler set to finish next turn.
I finally found Whomp’s borders!
I plan to move NW to the hill, then West to the Mountain to spy out his land. Hopefully I won’t be intercepted by a MW before I can at least get a peek.
Well, it was a blood-bath, as expected. Happily, two good things came out of it. First – I managed to kill at least one unit! Whomp’s warrior.
Second, it looks like I got a nice burst of War Happiness
I’m up to first place in land area and second in population – so even though our war isn’t going so well, at least it looks like I’m pulling ahead in # of cities. I have another settler set to finish next turn.
I finally found Whomp’s borders!
I plan to move NW to the hill, then West to the Mountain to spy out his land. Hopefully I won’t be intercepted by a MW before I can at least get a peek.
The blockade continues:
His archer moved SE to threaten the Jag I had fortified there. I really don't want his blockade to reach the river in full, so I intend to make a "last stand". I've gathered three Jags on the tile N of the moving one in the picture, and one more on the plains as seen. Together they have 74.2% chance to kill off a spear, and on average one should retreat. I'd be trading 45 shields for 20 of his, but better that than the alternative.
His archer moved SE to threaten the Jag I had fortified there. I really don't want his blockade to reach the river in full, so I intend to make a "last stand". I've gathered three Jags on the tile N of the moving one in the picture, and one more on the plains as seen. Together they have 74.2% chance to kill off a spear, and on average one should retreat. I'd be trading 45 shields for 20 of his, but better that than the alternative.
General_W
Councilor & Merlot Noble
Turn 42
.. and yet, I still strangely feel like I’m missing some part of the answer to the big questions.
Whomp pursued me with his MW, but thanks to the rugged terrain, I’m going to be able to elude him for now.
In happy news (and we’re in sore need of some) – it looks like I’m going to put at least a small crimp in Whomp’s expansion plans. I’ve happened across a settler of his with only a warrior for protection. That’s relatively safe for Whomp – but he also knows what I know… that my Ekindu’s days are numbered anyway, and I might be crazy enough to gamble on a 20% shot of killing a settler… so hopefully I can delay him into a game of cat-and-mouse at least.
In any case, it looks like I’m going to be able to get a mountain vista view of Whompland, unless he’s got more MWs lurking to take up position on those mountains.
In other news, I finished another settler, and it’s headed for location #1 – two tiles NW of my capital.
My lower worker is done with his road, and will now head for my horse to hook it up.
.. and yet, I still strangely feel like I’m missing some part of the answer to the big questions.
Whomp pursued me with his MW, but thanks to the rugged terrain, I’m going to be able to elude him for now.
In happy news (and we’re in sore need of some) – it looks like I’m going to put at least a small crimp in Whomp’s expansion plans. I’ve happened across a settler of his with only a warrior for protection. That’s relatively safe for Whomp – but he also knows what I know… that my Ekindu’s days are numbered anyway, and I might be crazy enough to gamble on a 20% shot of killing a settler… so hopefully I can delay him into a game of cat-and-mouse at least.
In any case, it looks like I’m going to be able to get a mountain vista view of Whompland, unless he’s got more MWs lurking to take up position on those mountains.
In other news, I finished another settler, and it’s headed for location #1 – two tiles NW of my capital.
My lower worker is done with his road, and will now head for my horse to hook it up.
