Democratic Party direction post-Harris

I doubt that continuing fighting the election they have lost will get the democrats anywhere.

And the thread title is: Democratic Party direction post-Harris
 
As Donald Trump is old and very unlikely to stand again, how does boosting "thermostatic public opinion" about him, help the Democrats ?
 
Part of thermostatic public opinion is boosting it as much as possible. A constant barrage of “he’s a billionaire felon” is needed to create the narrative. There are still millions of Americans who think he is simply a successful businessman.
As much as that's true, it's a story that goes nowhere, and CNN would be right to not make a huge deal out of it. His supporters will point to the things he'll do (right or wrong) in the near future and ask why should some Manhattan kangaroo court invalidate that...?
 
As Donald Trump is old and very unlikely to stand again, how does boosting "thermostatic public opinion" about him, help the Democrats ?
The Lich King is immortal as long as he never stops. His dopamine cycle is his horcrux. And anyway, all the Chavez's have their Maduros.

I think that a major factor of Trump winning is the "elephant in the porcelain room", i.e. more about the potential to wreck havoc on "the system" by sheer unpredictability and lack of restraints. As such, "pandering" by Trump might actually serves him well, because people can imagine him doing what a more reasonable/honest/restrained person wouldn't dare. While pandering from the "adult in the room" might be taken as just words that won't actually do anything.
In other words : empty words by Trump are perceived as they could lead to a bull doing some dumb thing that actually move other things around, possibly breaking the system (which is perceived already broken by a significant majority, and even more among the Republican voters), while empty words by the Democrats are perceived as just "pandering" that won't lead to anything.
I agree with what you are saying but I probably don't agree with the implied "Therefore we should..."

This is a time to GO HARD and not worry about image in that way.

Elon Musk could hire a team of artists to make his propaganda images for money he'll forget existed, fractions of his wealth changes as traders react to just how well he heiled that arm. But that dude is just using midjourney himself to post images of himself buff, looking out, with American flags, etc. "AI art is corny" too bad I already saw it and its in my consciousness.

A strength of the dems is that we ARE honest, scientific, the adults, play fair, etc, all to a point and that we attract the good people that way.

But the fight is ugly and we can't be afraid of any of the old signifiers. "Oh no what if we judge ourselves" jesus. NSFW language by the guy who told us in 2012 Donald Trump would "choose" our next president.

Michael Bay/Donald Trump/Elon Musk/ these guys are going for the jugular, straight for the balls, right to the heart. Kamala Harris's only time doing that was talking about her friend's step dad (yeesh).

Rightwingers get duped by Russian meme farms, leftwingers are too smart and clever. Our memes were better........ until AI art.

We won back in the day with https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/7109916_700bwp.webp

But also the American Left half is like "eww AI art that's gross" yes, sure, except when I visualize Elon Musk I visualize 4 images:
AI Art Hero Musk first, because its the most signal to least noise visual cue straight to my brain
Sig Heil Musk because its recent and... well you know
Smoke Weed Musk because it was a meme
Dancing Weird Musk because I dunno. But these take digging.

and really not much else. Maybe shirtless potbelly musk but that one isn't consistent with the imagery in the rest.

AI Art Hero Musk wins. Donald Trump? Mugshot, Fist in Air After Getting Shot, and Hero AI Art Trump.
 
A strength of the dems is that we ARE honest, scientific, the adults, play fair, etc, all to a point and that we attract the good people that way.
is that so ? Any part of it ? Sure it doesn't look so from places .
 
As much as that's true, it's a story that goes nowhere, and CNN would be right to not make a huge deal out of it. His supporters will point to the things he'll do (right or wrong) in the near future and ask why should some Manhattan kangaroo court invalidate that...?
BECAUSE THE UNDERDOG COURT OF FREEDOM AND JUSTICE IS SAVING AMERICA FROM AN EVIL TYRANT!!!1111 :band: :rockon: :ar15:

Chatgpt failed to make this because it refused to make the president look like Trump, and Midjourney is having trouble with the angles.

edit: this is going horribly awry
Spoiler :

Screenshot 2025-01-22 at 2.22.10 PM.png
 
we have this same thing here for the last quarter of a century . Hold them by the hand and take them to the top and they will still fail . Much as Democrats will be doing from now on . Yours is a controlled opposition , toothless and all . Much as ours is . We will survive the moment the control lapses by some foreign interaction . How are you going to break your yoke ? Aliens ? Oh yes , now they are 10 feet tall Nordics and will answer to psycic or whatever you write that word .
 
The Lich King is immortal as long as he never stops. His dopamine cycle is his horcrux. And anyway, all the Chavez's have their Maduros.


I agree with what you are saying but I probably don't agree with the implied "Therefore we should..."

This is a time to GO HARD and not worry about image in that way.

Elon Musk could hire a team of artists to make his propaganda images for money he'll forget existed, fractions of his wealth changes as traders react to just how well he heiled that arm. But that dude is just using midjourney himself to post images of himself buff, looking out, with American flags, etc. "AI art is corny" too bad I already saw it and its in my consciousness.

A strength of the dems is that we ARE honest, scientific, the adults, play fair, etc, all to a point and that we attract the good people that way.

But the fight is ugly and we can't be afraid of any of the old signifiers. "Oh no what if we judge ourselves" jesus. NSFW language by the guy who told us in 2012 Donald Trump would "choose" our next president.

Michael Bay/Donald Trump/Elon Musk/ these guys are going for the jugular, straight for the balls, right to the heart. Kamala Harris's only time doing that was talking about her friend's step dad (yeesh).

Rightwingers get duped by Russian meme farms, leftwingers are too smart and clever. Our memes were better........ until AI art.

We won back in the day with https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/7109916_700bwp.webp

But also the American Left half is like "eww AI art that's gross" yes, sure, except when I visualize Elon Musk I visualize 4 images:
AI Art Hero Musk first, because its the most signal to least noise visual cue straight to my brain
Sig Heil Musk because its recent and... well you know
Smoke Weed Musk because it was a meme
Dancing Weird Musk because I dunno. But these take digging.

and really not much else. Maybe shirtless potbelly musk but that one isn't consistent with the imagery in the rest.

AI Art Hero Musk wins. Donald Trump? Mugshot, Fist in Air After Getting Shot, and Hero AI Art Trump.
Agree. I think the pattern is that right wing memes attempt to monopolize strength, while Dems attempt to monopolize righteousness.

The problem with the latter is that an increasingly cynical public do not trust the defenders of the system to deliver or think righteousness as Dems define it is relevant to improving their lives, or, because of value differences, begin their evaluation of that Dem claim from a longstanding conviction they're morally hideous. No shot with the latter. It's also hard to get away from. Elite rhetoric for the entire Trump era has been all about pointing out his lack of righteousness, and people follow.

The progressive movement is also egalitarian as a matter of righteousness. I think the imperative there is "equality because it's right" rather than "equality because what weakling would accept subordination?". That's somewhat predictable. Influential media voices are usually not actually from the poorer strata.

I dunno how you'd change it. You could try top down? Shift at leadership, see if the base follows? I kinda doubt it, though. Trump is so repulsive, particularly to the elite, like he repulsed nobody so much as Atlantic writers and readers, and they're leadership, so I dunno I'd they could resist.

I don't expect agreement, but this is partly why I advocate a decentralized approach to social issues. If you wanna change the spirit of the party, you probably first need to get back chunks of the (white and increasingly Latino) working class guys. After that spirit would change organically.
 
Speaking of strength vs righteousness, one of the most successful branding moves by conservatives has been to cast the left as broadly feminine - “caretakers.” This unfortunately carries the automatic belief of being “weak” due to mainstream misogyny. There’s no actual facts behind it, it’s just now broadly accepted Dems/left = women = weak.

This is why when LeBron James runs as a Dem, he will win 40 states. Look at his face and head.
 
Speaking of strength vs righteousness, one of the most successful branding moves by conservatives has been to cast the left as broadly feminine - “caretakers.” This unfortunately carries the automatic belief of being “weak” due to mainstream misogyny. There’s no actual facts behind it, it’s just now broadly accepted Dems/left = women = weak.

This is why when LeBron James runs as a Dem, he will win 40 states. Look at his face and head


midjourney's attempt at the same but AOC lol https://cdn.midjourney.com/b9d01ec4-fe6a-4090-b7a3-48d28f34ae03/0_0.png
 
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Speaking of strength vs righteousness, one of the most successful branding moves by conservatives has been to cast the left as broadly feminine - “caretakers.”
I dunno if I like the word "cast" as it's deployed there. It implies it was made up from whole cloth.

It'd be more accurate to say the population just sorta noticed the Dems baby certain causes and have double standards for different identity groups... which, yeah, is not super well aligned with classic conceptions of masculinity.

Whether it's a problem or not is I suppose left to the individual, but it's not like that perception is purely a product of right-wing propaganda.
 
A strength of the dems is that we ARE honest, scientific, the adults, play fair, etc, all to a point and that we attract the good people that way.
What 'good people'? Biden? Harris?

I wouldn't say Dems play fair as much as they're not willing to fight as dirty.

Dems are a snoozefest. Even Bernie who I like, frankly is pretty predictable/boring. Working families, lower prescription drug costs, the 1%. You could program a Bernie AI in 5 minutes.

And Dems aren't inclusive (in any deep sense of the word). Sure they'll give you a token black lady nobody likes but they're not actually inclusive.

RFK for instance, claimed to be Democrat, why did he run to Trump? Because he's a grifter, a lousy person? Maybe. Why else? Because you think the Harris campaign would have anything to do with him? Of course not. They kicked that senator to the curb for posting a joke photo with some woman sleeping on a plane (forget the dude's name this was 2015 or 2016 I think). Any little thing that makes you look bad, you're out, nevermind any upside. So you end up with the most milquetoast and wonder why they can't win.

Democratic elites are very impermeable membrane. No one getting in unless they meet a strict set of requirements.

I'll use an analogy.

Trump is like a 16 year boy with loads of money & libido who's parents are out of town for the weekend, he'll invite ANYONE to the party if he thinks they'll flatter him or f*** him. He promises an epic party. Nevermind the drinks will be watered down, the drugs will be fake, he'll have 3 dudes for each chick and he'll try to feel up your girl, he's at least acknowledging people want something (even what's on offer is a dystopian version of that something). Biden/Harris are like, 'A party? Your life is already a party thanks to Democratic led prosperity, have you seen the stock market & this chart about jobs?! You don't need drugs or sex or fun, you're already winning, anyway even if we had a party none of YOU LOT could come anyway, we scanned your emails & you have some unsavory opinions that could reflect poorly on us'

Trump is like a crazy movie that will probably end in disaster, Dems are like a boring movie that will end will some cheery fake ending while all the systemic issues remain the same or get slightly worse.

It's not like mainstream Dems are gonna solve climate change. They'll spew some word salad about 'tackling it' but normie Americans just read that as ('this won't actually help but will make your live worse rn'). Meanwhile Trump is 'drill baby drill' which is vile but, hey, road trip!!

I think the pattern is that right wing memes attempt to monopolize strength, while Dems attempt to monopolize righteousness.
Well put. Impotent righteousness.
 
RFK for instance, claimed to be Democrat, why did he run to Trump? Because he's a grifter, a lousy person? Maybe. Why else? Because you think the Harris campaign would have anything to do with him? Of course not. They kicked that senator to the curb for posting a joke photo with some woman sleeping on a plane (forget the dude's name this was 2015 or 2016 I think). Any little thing that makes you look bad, you're out, nevermind any upside. So you end up with the most milquetoast and wonder why they can't win

Dude come on. RFK is a grifter. He has multiple instances of sexual assault on his record. He’s staunchly anti vax, anti science, and pro Putin. Of course Harris wants no part. Even Republicans besides Trump don’t.
 
Dude come on. RFK is a grifter. He has multiple instances of sexual assault on his record. He’s staunchly anti vax, anti science, and pro Putin. Of course Harris wants no part. Even Republicans besides Trump don’t.
RFK sounds like a consimate s***bag. I hadn't heard about pro-Putin bit before. From what I've read he had diaries which spelled out escapades with dozens of women while his wife lay dying. Bill Clinton was also friends w Epstein and did who knows what. The point is that no one in our internet age is squeaky clean & voters are numbed out with all the allegations of this & that to the point where they just block it all out (otherwise how would we have Trump).

Not saying Harris should've necessarily embraced RFK but it's just a default to shun anyone these days w a sketchy past & therefore joining up w the right is the only viable option for them (bringing their supporters w them).

We're in an era of desperation & that leads to the desire for naked power.
 
Not saying Harris should've necessarily embraced RFK but it's just a default to shun anyone these days w a sketchy past & therefore joining up w the right is the only viable option for them (bringing their supporters w them).
Shunning people who don't share your values, won't vote for your policies, and will generally be disruptive to whatever it is you're trying to do isn't "shunning". "shunning" is a moral argument. Excluding people who will not help you achieve your goals is logical. Rational, even.

This is exactly why the Democrats don't embrace the left wing either. But I don't see them being criticised for "shunning" in that case.
 
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