Department of Turnplay

[Whomp]

Here's our research screen. I went engineering for the speed and buchets. At 50% -4gpt.

 

[Crakie]

I'm way too late, but for the record, I concur with Engineering. We really need libraries though.

 

[Whomp]

I got the save.

 

[Whomp]

Here are a couple F1 screenies...

 

[Daghdha]

Beautiful report Whomper

 

[Tubby Rower]

I'm sorry that I have been deficient in my posting. I've been busy lately and the Olympics doesn't add free time either. Thanks to Whomp for picking up the slack.

 

[Kickbooti]

I'm sorry that I have been deficient in my posting...the Olympics doesn't add free time either.

I didn't know you were an Olympic fan Tubby. In homage maybe Mistfit can put your slacker figure on a luge.

 

[Tubby Rower]

The save is available now

Todo for turn 99

• Diplo
  1. none
• Micromanagement
  1. Dunderhead -> start library
• Workers (it's ok for workers to join in on tasks)
  1. continue to road and improve (mine green; irrigate brown)
  2. mine hills
• Other stuff
  1. eastern settler settle Crackhead on wines
  2. western settler move to the northern wines (1 N of Iron Hill)
  3. two GS are scouting the eastern shores and hopefully can get behind their initial city "wall" stay at least two tiles away from Greek borders if you can
  4. leave D'head's new GS in the core
  5. moving all GS to EWR and/or Senilityville unless busting fog (or shadows)
  6. move reg warrior near SKWTD down south to Effing Whomping Rower
• Other MM
  1. check for happiness @ end of turn (might be able to turn it down)
  2. get relative strength via F3 for MIA
  3. check F3 for barb camp locations
  4. press enter and then select "Save & Exit"

I think that that's it.

 

[Daghdha]

Allrightie then...I'm on it

 

[Whomp]

Daghie check my F1 for MMing. There are a few tiles that need to be changed. IE Ignoramus takes back the FP wheat

 

[Daghdha]

OK, I haven't played it yet and I got an offer to go to the pictures w my g/f on Valentines so you might just pic it up instead and do what has to be done. I'll check in here when I come back.

 

[Tubby Rower]

I got it .. . .

 

[Tubby Rower]

Not a whole lot happened. I think that a couple of MIA's cities can be taken immediately. I have a couple of GS stationed in the core in case MIA sneak attacks us like D'nut did to TNT.

I think that we might be able to sever their lux road with our GS's behind Flaxon Musk

 

[Daghdha]

We will soon have to decide on which way to go about MIA. Are we going for a sonner attack and thus a guerilla approach, or do we wait for the cav. invasion?
Fore some reason it seems that interest has dropped rapidly and maybe an attack on MIA could make things more fun again?

 

[Tubby Rower]

I'm with you Daggie. I think that our GS are getting into good position to sneak attack them. Also we have a few cities that could be +10 spt and should be able to stop a counter-attack. But who knows.

Either we will be victorious, go down in flaming defeat, or be muddled in a long war to which soon we will have Monarchy and can switch easily and MIA's only option is to go to Despotism.

 

[Whomp]

If we plan to battle with MIA then I suggest we hold the save until the admins make a decision on this treaty.

Tell me if I'm being ridiculous and I'll drop it but from what I can tell the admins feel we should've received benefits from the TNT trade (which we asked for). My view is if one part of the agreement is broke then the whole agreement is broke and we should be able to attack now.

If MIA makes us whole on this agreement then we should consider a term of peace and go pound on TNT. They're weak compared to us, lost a core city and we can put in and drop off units from our west coast all day. It would have a total element of surprise, possibly catch them in anarchy and immortals are no match for our GS as we saw with the MW's.

I thought the treaty was terminated, and you have to wait 10 turns before war.The treaty hasn't been in effect since turn 94. It's just that you can't declare war until 104.

They traded with TNT before turn 94 so if the treaty was in effect from turns 84-94 then "favoured nation" status would still be in effect. Turns 94-104 means no agreement and turns 104 and beyond anything goes.

If the treaty was in effect from turns 84 to 94 and M.I.A. traded with TNT during that time, then parts 4 and 4a would still be in effect. It is past that time, however, so I'm wondering what you'd like me to find.

If it's past the time then I wonder if at turn 100 whether the whole treaty is invalid? If they don't give us satisfaction on "favoured nation" (which we asked for) then my interpretation is our whole treaty, including the peace treaty, is invalid and we are free to attack.

It's a bit late to 'press charges'...but even still, you can't go back and to try to find a way to attack them sooner.

The treaty is still intact...you could say that clause is now not intact anymore, because one side broke it, and it is a bit late to go back to change it (considering it will run out soon)...really, the whole treaty is defunct except for the part about no war before turn 104.

We asked them in writing to satisfy our request for "favoured nation" and they disagreed. As far as I'm concerned this whole agreement is broke.

I will give them one more shot or I feel we can do as we please without repercussions.

 

[grahamiam]

Well, if we feel we have the legal right to do so, and can back that up, then who cares what the admin's feel. However, are we ready now or should we wait till 104?

 

[Kickbooti]

I think that we should focus on MIA. Right now Nuts will have to focus on TNT, they may be weakened, but they are not out. The Nuts will want to consolidate (that's my guess) and avoid active, foreign entaglments.

That being said, I want to play an honorable game. IF we are being wronged by the Admins, and IF the agreement has been violated without sanction then we can't allow a fecless UN be the brake on the interest of our self-interest. Hit them.

Having said that, we MUST be able to make a clear and compelling case that we are in the right for the Nuts, otherwise they will NEVER make a worthwhile agreement with a partner they can't trust.

I think that Dag and Crakie would be the best Devil's advocates about the 'rightness' of our legal arguments. If Whomp and Tubs can lay out a case that convinces them that our pre-emptive attack is justified. And if we can make that case to the Nuts and they are comfortable with it - then hit MIA.

Remember, its just business.

 

[Daghdha]

I think Whomper may right if we look at the treaty as it stands in writing. The problem, IMHO, is that we ourselves in contact with MIA have stated that we consider the tech-part of the treaty fullfilled if we were at tech parity after the big swap. Indeed we were after Poly was included. I feel we didn't wanna press charges on MIA's tnt-dealings before the swap because we were too far behind in techs and wanted that deal to go through, so we said "everything is cool". We also stated that the peace part should be in effect after the swap and in exactly the way that was written, i.e. say nothing until 10 turns after the swap, them one side can declare war in form of a 10 turn notice.
So we have two levels to consider where one is the written treaty, and the other how we have interpreted and communicated it in contact with MIA.
I'd rather we stick to the plan and play "uber honorably", because I feel we can take them anyway and it will look so good.
I would like to add that I have the deepest respect for Whomp as an honorable gamer and by disagreeing I'm not saying our beloved General Idiot is stretching the paragraphs and playing unfair. I just have a slightly different view on how things have come about, but that's cool. Let it be a team decision .

 

[Tubby Rower]

I'm torn. I think that we should hit them now, but would like make sure that there is no hint of dishonesty. After all, we are playing a lot of these same guys in the civ4 MTDG. The teams kind of stuck together so any deal in the other game WILL be influenced by this game.

Let's just play the next 5 turns cool as a cucumber then hit them in their soft underbellies.