Design: Heroes

[Xuenay]

Destroying mana nodes is a really, really strong ability, though... the last time I got to play, it was on a Large map with a whole four mana nodes. If you destroy just two of them, that's half the mana resources in the whole world... (excluding wonders)

 

[Hian the Frog]

Destroying mana nodes is a really, really strong ability, though... the last time I got to play, it was on a Large map with a whole four mana nodes. If you destroy just two of them, that's half the mana resources in the whole world... (excluding wonders)

Xuenay,

You are right. But remember :
1) that your hero dies....
2) Only mana nodes of civs you are at war with are destroyed.
3) As you says, those of the Wonders and Palaces are still functioning.

The Frog.

 

[Hian the Frog]

I think we are best to link him at Arcane Lore, thats 1 before the Archmage granting tech. That way the Amurites get an archmage a little earlier than everyone else.

Anyone want to skin Govannon using either the mage or wizard model?

Kael,

Yeap. Arcane Lore is a good choice.

Again my poor english. Sorry. What do you mean by "skinning" ?
It's the sense of Drawing ?

The Frog.

 

[Kael]

Kael,

Yeap. Arcane Lore is a good choice.

Again my poor english. Sorry. What do you mean by "skinning" ?
It's the sense of Drawing ?

The Frog.

Yeah paint the model to make the unit look good.

 

[Hian the Frog]

Yeah paint the model to make the unit look good.

Kael,

Understood. Thx.

I would be pleased to help you but i don't know how to do, neither if i have the right program to do it. My lack of knowledge in programing, skinning,...is absolutly AWESOME. It's a pity, i have time to "waste" for such a great project as FfH2. I will not work until the 1st of september......

The Frog.

 

[loki1232]

Have we figured out rantine's mechanic yet?

How about a mechanic to create an army of barbarians.

 

[Kael]

Have we figured out rantine's mechanic yet?

How about a mechanic to create an army of barbarians.

That could be cool, would it sacrifice him? If not how often could he use it?

 

[Hian the Frog]

Kael,

Is there a thread somewhere else which explain how skinning, what is necessary to skin ?

About the leader of Ember (don't remember his name.. ) why don't you use the same system as the Great Military Leader ?
It could be improved and made awesome for a single shoot use (and the death of XXX) or lessened for multiple use.

Do you find somebody for Govannon skinning ?

The Frog.

 

[Kael]

Kael,

Is there a thread somewhere else which explain how skinning, what is necessary to skin ?

About the leader of Ember (don't remember his name.. ) why don't you use the same system as the Great Military Leader ?
It could be improved and made awesome for a single shoot use (and the death of XXX) or lessened for multiple use.

Do you find somebody for Govannon skinning ?

The Frog.

This thread does an okay job of describing it: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=137265. You won't need to unpack art resource because they are already unpacked for FfH. So if you wanted to make a new skin for Govannon you could get the mage skain in /Fall from Heaven 2 012/assets/art/units/mage/christian_missionary.dds file.

 

[Hian the Frog]

This thread does an okay job of describing it: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=137265. You won't need to unpack art resource because they are already unpacked for FfH. So if you wanted to make a new skin for Govannon you could get the mage skain in /Fall from Heaven 2 012/assets/art/units/mage/christian_missionary.dds file.

Kael,

Thx a lot.

I will look for that this night, after sending my nephew and niece at bed.

The Frog.

 

[loki1232]

That could be cool, would it sacrifice him? If not how often could he use it?

I think whenever he pillaged a cottage or captured a city. They he can "recruit" a couple of barbarians that spawn around him.

 

[Kael]

I think whenever he pillaged a cottage or captured a city. They he can "recruit" a couple of barbarians that spawn around him.

Yeah, I could probably work up a modified recruit ability for him that recruited barbarian units instead of normal ones (and of course didnt kill him).

 

[Hian the Frog]

This thread does an okay job of describing it: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=137265. You won't need to unpack art resource because they are already unpacked for FfH. So if you wanted to make a new skin for Govannon you could get the mage skain in /Fall from Heaven 2 012/assets/art/units/mage/christian_missionary.dds file.

Kael,

After reading the thread, i'm ready to begin to try to do something. I've got all necessary...
Meanwhile, are you sure of : /christian_missionary.dds ?

I don't understand what i'm looking.

The Frog.

 

[Jono]

Since I've only been playing Hippus lately, I was wondering what Magnadine would be like? early/mid/late game, strength~, movement~, unique ability (or non-unique, like air magic), etc.

 

[Chalid]

Kael,

After reading the thread, i'm ready to begin to try to do something. I've got all necessary...
Meanwhile, are you sure of : /christian_missionary.dds ?

I don't understand what i'm looking.

The Frog.

There are several files.
christian Missionary.dds is his clothes an his head
Other files are for his shoulder pads and for his cape.

Simply try what happens if you paint it.
You can use the Nif Viewer to check your results.

 

[Kael]

Since I've only been playing Hippus lately, I was wondering what Magnadine would be like? early/mid/late game, strength~, movement~, unique ability (or non-unique, like air magic), etc.

I dont know yet. Hes a mounted mercenary lord. High movement, probably mid to late game, high str. His special ability will probably be something similiar to recruitment. I was postpining making him until the mercenary mod comes in, at which point I was going to have him able to steal other civs mercenary units.

 

[Samuelson]

I dont know yet. Hes a mounted mercenary lord. High movement, probably mid to late game, high str. His special ability will probably be something similiar to recruitment. I was postpining making him until the mercenary mod comes in, at which point I was going to have him able to steal other civs mercenary units.

I thought the mercenary mod was already out. They use it in the Realism mod.

 

[Kael]

I thought the mercenary mod was already out. They use it in the Realism mod.

Its been out for a while, we had it in FfH2 but it failed testing because of some multiplayer and AI issues. TheLopez has been awesome and is working on an even better version that I am excited to try out.

 

[Maian]

I've been thinking about heroes for a while. I've been reading how players typically use them and noticed how I've used them myself.

Namely, how players are much more reluctant to send their heroes into combat than typical units. How combat-oriented heroes often have less use in combat than spell-caster heroes, just because they are thrown in only when the odds are overwhelmingly in their favor.

This is wrong. By the very nature of its scarcity, heroes end up being unheroic. One has to wonder how they got to be heroes in the first place when they fight less than their fellow soldiers.

By giving a unit the status of "hero", a player will naturally start becoming a bit attached to it. This happens all the time in RPGs so it's not surprising it happens here. So it also makes me frustrated when the hero does get killed even with overwhelming odds. Not fun at all.

On the other hand, the danger of the hero being killed does add a tactical consideration. Protecting your hero should be important, and killing enemy heroes should be major victories.

This is the heart of the problem. The goal here is to make heroes important and non-expendable, yet also encourage them to play a heroic role in campaigns, instead of standing back and let the pawns do all the work.

So how do other strategy games that integrate heroes do this? They do so in a couple ways. One way is to make the hero more of a general/spellcaster that is only killed when the army is killed, ala Heroes of Might and Magic. Lots of games have the concept of hitpoints plus tactical retreats, allowing players to recall heroes when they are losing in the middle of a battle. Some games allow resurrection of heroes at varying costs. RTS games give units 100% chances of winning over weaker units (for example, pit a hero against a lowly foot soldier and the hero will always win).

I'm not sure how this can be done in Civ4. Chance needs to play far less of a role for heroes. In particular, simulating tactical retreats in battles would be ideal. Concerning resurrection, I'm not in favor of that since that diminishes the importance of killing enemy heroes.

 

[Jono]

I dont know yet. Hes a mounted mercenary lord. High movement, probably mid to late game, high str. His special ability will probably be something similiar to recruitment. I was postpining making him until the mercenary mod comes in, at which point I was going to have him able to steal other civs mercenary units.

How about:
10~12 Strength, 4~5 Movement, starts with Air III and Summoning (or Divine if you feel like creating a few new spells, like change wind current for +1 movement for all units in tile and +15% offense), can summon a recruiter with Dimensional I after pillaging hamlet-town/razing a city...

I know it's kind of absurd, a mercenary with magic, but I really felt like the Air side of Hippus wasn't shown enough. Even with the Hippus summoner, he only has 1 Air spell and no connection to the mounted mercenaries.

Edit: Just wanted to add that instead of Dimensional I you could use Rebase from vanilla.