Early and fast exploration is key to an early dv.
[GS] Diplomatic Victory Strategies
- Thread starter RickSL
- Start date
Early and fast exploration is key to an early dv.
I've never not won with a gift of only 400 gold.
ZeroSuitSenpai
Warlord
- Joined
- Jul 31, 2017
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- 135
I can confirm that I was beaten by Wilfred Laurier in an aid emergency exactly once since GS released, with him dumping a surprisingly large amount of gold into the emergency the turn before it expired. Was impressed.
But otherwise, like @agonistes, I've pretty much never lost after just sending a few hundred gold.
But otherwise, like @agonistes, I've pretty much never lost after just sending a few hundred gold.
Morningcalm
Keeper of Records
They should change that--it shouldn't cost just a few hundred gold to win in my opinion. The algorithm for winning should weigh doing the "Thoughts and Prayers" (I know that's not its real name) project more heavily.
My recent Diplomatic victory saw the AI all rally together to remove a Diplomatic point from me, but I overcame their second Nay vote to score victory after sitting atop several suzerainties, an advanced government with +4 Favor a turn (wildcard), and tons of Recapture Carbon projects. I had something like 1200 favor to overcome the Nay votes, and it may have helped that other resolutions on the table seemed a priority for the AI.
I would be curious to see what the earliest Diplomatic Victory time has been. I would guess early victories would come from those with extra envoy bonuses (Hungary), extra favor (Sweden), or just early Domination strategies (remove the larger possibility of Nay votes by murdering AI). I think AI allied with you should be made less likely to vote against you though, so as to allow a totally peaceful Diplomatic victory.
My recent Diplomatic victory saw the AI all rally together to remove a Diplomatic point from me, but I overcame their second Nay vote to score victory after sitting atop several suzerainties, an advanced government with +4 Favor a turn (wildcard), and tons of Recapture Carbon projects. I had something like 1200 favor to overcome the Nay votes, and it may have helped that other resolutions on the table seemed a priority for the AI.
I would be curious to see what the earliest Diplomatic Victory time has been. I would guess early victories would come from those with extra envoy bonuses (Hungary), extra favor (Sweden), or just early Domination strategies (remove the larger possibility of Nay votes by murdering AI). I think AI allied with you should be made less likely to vote against you though, so as to allow a totally peaceful Diplomatic victory.
I don't think the fastest victories will come from votes, as all the Diplomatic Favour in the world doesn't convert into victory points until the Modern Era.
"Quick" diplo victories will depend on rapid exploration (and a bit of luck) in order to get Aid Emergencies early and often.
Morningcalm
Keeper of Records
True, Diplomatic Victory being restricted to the modern age makes it rather tough to get early.
How early can you get Aid emergencies?
I'm playing on a Huge New world with high disasters, and I'm having volcano eruptions all the time. I'm showing a 20% chance of volcanos erupting on my climate screen, and I sometimes have two or three Send Aid emergenices at a time.
Socrates99
Bottoms up!
I just won a turn 295 diplo vic with Kristina. Admittedly the map did have settings that helped. It was a huge map with disasters maxed. I imagine this increased the number of aid requests. Primarily build for gold and production to help in aid requests. I won 6 aid emergencies, they often cost me between 3k and 4k go. Then I pulled a win in the WC for 2 points while delaying carbon recapture and seasteads. As soon as I hit 8 points I finished the tech and civic points for the win.
Maintaining alliances and suzerainship helps a lot but I didn't hoard points that much. In the early game selling favor is a great way to kickstart your game. Just don't dump much in the late game until the diplo victory votes kick in.
Maintaining alliances and suzerainship helps a lot but I didn't hoard points that much. In the early game selling favor is a great way to kickstart your game. Just don't dump much in the late game until the diplo victory votes kick in.
I think Aid emergencies can begin as soon as the World Congress starts at the beginning of the Medieval.
MrRadar
Deity
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2014
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- 2,215
Since Medieval, as the Congress starts, I guess. At least I've got one during Medieval. Or was it only I in Medieval, and the world already in Renaissance? Can't tell now off the top of my head.
As it was already mentioned, turning disasters up to 4 and active scouting helps. It also seems helpful to cram more AI civs on the map than the intended default number for that size. More potential disaster targets, more inter-AI wars, more buyers of your strategic resources. As I mentioned in another thread, it is very devious to gift disaster victims money they paid you for your strategic resources they burn away in wars you're not involved in.
Socrates99
Bottoms up!
funny yo mention devious gifting. In that Diplo win I mentioned earlier I wasn't shy about asking for aid myself. The gold gifts ramped up my own ability to send aid to others.
They really do not to make some changes to the Diplomatic victory. Having to just wait for the next world congress session with no means of speeding it up had me just pressing Shift+Enter to force end my turn for like 20 turns in a row. They should increase the threshold to 13 victory points required and then award non-permanent diplomatic victory points for meeting certain objectives that other civs can take from you (think "longest road" or "largest army" from Settlers of Catan).
Possibilities include:
- Maintain Suzerainship over the majority of the world's city states.
- Fulfill more primary leader agendas then anyone else.
- Convert over half of the world's civilizations to your religion.
- Maintain the highest population (or possibly production) to Co2 omissions ratio among civs in the modern era or later.
- Become the world leader in domestic tourists.
- Have more level three alliances than any other civilization.
- Be on the winning side of world congress votes more times than anyone else. This one could be really interesting as you might even have to vote against your own interests in the hopes of gaining this point.
Ties would not count, you would need to be the only civilization to meet these conditions to get the point.
Possibilities include:
- Maintain Suzerainship over the majority of the world's city states.
- Fulfill more primary leader agendas then anyone else.
- Convert over half of the world's civilizations to your religion.
- Maintain the highest population (or possibly production) to Co2 omissions ratio among civs in the modern era or later.
- Become the world leader in domestic tourists.
- Have more level three alliances than any other civilization.
- Be on the winning side of world congress votes more times than anyone else. This one could be really interesting as you might even have to vote against your own interests in the hopes of gaining this point.
Ties would not count, you would need to be the only civilization to meet these conditions to get the point.
Questions for those who won few (several?) Diplo Victories.
1. What was your typical "favor per turn" in the late game? What numbers are needed to feel comfortable with winning Diplo (let's assume standard 8 civ game).
2. What was your main source of favors through the entire game? Being a suzerain, alliances, trading with other civs, events/ emergencies, others?
1. What was your typical "favor per turn" in the late game? What numbers are needed to feel comfortable with winning Diplo (let's assume standard 8 civ game).
2. What was your main source of favors through the entire game? Being a suzerain, alliances, trading with other civs, events/ emergencies, others?
Socrates99
Bottoms up!
I won 2 DVs. In both I had over 20 favor per turn, one of them I think I hit 29 per turn. I made sure to maintain 5 alliances as much as possible and spread my envoys out to get the most suzerainships possible. The CS thing was different for me because I usually focus on just CSs with bonuses I like. That DFavor wonder (forget the name, starts with an O) felt like a necessity.
I dont know if I have a goal though. The favor thing felt secondary. The games mostly focused on gold and production for the aid requests. Diplomatic favor was a side issue for me. I tried to spend it wisely but it's not a massive deal. If you lose the vote it gets refunded and you just have to wait longer. In my shorter game I only had to win the vote once to hit 8 pts then it was just 9 more turns to get seasteads and carbon recapture. From what I understand its easiest to win the vote if you have less than 8 points.
I dont know if I have a goal though. The favor thing felt secondary. The games mostly focused on gold and production for the aid requests. Diplomatic favor was a side issue for me. I tried to spend it wisely but it's not a massive deal. If you lose the vote it gets refunded and you just have to wait longer. In my shorter game I only had to win the vote once to hit 8 pts then it was just 9 more turns to get seasteads and carbon recapture. From what I understand its easiest to win the vote if you have less than 8 points.
I've been thinking about this. I haven't actually played out a game to test the theory yet, but it seems like there are two strategies for victory here. Either you save some bonus DV points for after you get 8, so that you don't need to win your final DV points through a vote. Or, you try to overpower the other civs to win the final vote despite them all voting as a block against you.
If you’re trying to win your final points with a vote in the world congress, do you actually want to have alliances with the AI? With the way the diplomatic vote costs scale, it seems like the extra diplomatic favor you get from having an alliance with an AI will translate into fewer votes for you than it does for your alliance partner. Since they’re going to vote against you in the world congress, this seems entirely counterproductive. Getting your final DV points outside of the world congress sounds like the superior strategy, but if you get stuck and have to get your final points through the vote, should you cancel all of your alliances?
If you’re trying to win your final points with a vote in the world congress, do you actually want to have alliances with the AI? With the way the diplomatic vote costs scale, it seems like the extra diplomatic favor you get from having an alliance with an AI will translate into fewer votes for you than it does for your alliance partner. Since they’re going to vote against you in the world congress, this seems entirely counterproductive. Getting your final DV points outside of the world congress sounds like the superior strategy, but if you get stuck and have to get your final points through the vote, should you cancel all of your alliances?
Leucarum
Emperor
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2018
- Messages
- 1,485
I've won twice. Once as Canada - tourism was my main source of DF. I would have won ny culture if not for a really strong pair of competitors. It was a massive slog as I had no aid emergencies at all.
2nd game was as Cree. There having 5 maxed out alliances and all the city states under my control (thanks to wonders) was the source of DF.
Sagax
Emperor
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2013
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- 1,219
This was my Diplo Win endgame as Canada. 8 civs, 12 CS:
Definitely an overkill - a steady stream of about 20-30 DF per turn should be enough for the victory, as long as you don't waste it on other proposals. Suzerainty and alliances should be your main focus. If things get dragged into late game, then consider running Carbon Recapture project and re-running Future Civic - 30 DF and 50 DF per completion, respectively.
Don't freak out over "+19 from Tourism". When you have 1964 Tourism per turn, Diplomatic Victory should not even be part of your consideration. Yes, I had to disable CV in this game...
Definitely an overkill - a steady stream of about 20-30 DF per turn should be enough for the victory, as long as you don't waste it on other proposals. Suzerainty and alliances should be your main focus. If things get dragged into late game, then consider running Carbon Recapture project and re-running Future Civic - 30 DF and 50 DF per completion, respectively.
Don't freak out over "+19 from Tourism". When you have 1964 Tourism per turn, Diplomatic Victory should not even be part of your consideration. Yes, I had to disable CV in this game...
In order to win Diplo Victory you are actually better off without Alliances. Ironic...
Troy Bruckner
Prince
- Joined
- Jan 26, 2019
- Messages
- 433
I have a strategy to guarantee a DV. Play normal until you get to 8 DV points then eradicate all the other players except one leaving them with one city. This way they can't gang up on you and vote you negative DV which has happened both times I have tried for a DV. I had 29 and 30 votes respectively and I got ganged up on by my alleged allies.
