Does FFH need a Lizardman Civ?
- Thread starter Ekolite
- Start date
xienwolf
Deity
Maybe have unique versions of Tiger/Gorilla/Lion/Bear cages which each add some promotion or stat to units created in that city?
Could also go the "Swarm" mentality of having the units you actually build PATHETICALLY weak, but able to "Group" into a single unit with a much higher (probably has to be limited still though) potential strength.
Hrm, interesting possibility would be that they can only ever build the basic Scout and Warrior units. All others must be created through combining units on the field with specific promotions? ie - Scout with mobility 1 + Warrior with Combat 3 = Knight.
Could also go the "Swarm" mentality of having the units you actually build PATHETICALLY weak, but able to "Group" into a single unit with a much higher (probably has to be limited still though) potential strength.
Hrm, interesting possibility would be that they can only ever build the basic Scout and Warrior units. All others must be created through combining units on the field with specific promotions? ie - Scout with mobility 1 + Warrior with Combat 3 = Knight.
it-ogo
Hedgehog
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What is easy to make is just few changes in xml: copy-paste, links to new graphics, change some names, add much lore, +/- strength for few units, +/- some percents here and there and - voila - new civ. Even I can do that. Maybe. 
That is a way you make a new civ in vanilla civIV.
To make something that will really change gameplay, like xien's swarming, you should go at least to python, maybe even to SDK and it is much more difficult to code and especially to debug.
That is a way you make a new civ in vanilla civIV.To make something that will really change gameplay, like xien's swarming, you should go at least to python, maybe even to SDK and it is much more difficult to code and especially to debug.
Hian the Frog
TR Designer and XML
Woodelf,
I agree with you. If possible, we have to avoid to use some new python/SDK codes but only XML. But it will be difficult if we want to add some specific bonuses with jungles chopping and food production for example.
About religion, having the Lizardmen Agnostic is acceptable. If you follow my history of the lizardmen, it makes sense. To compensate, the basic "Pagan Temple" could be renamed and a bit better to represent their specific religion.
Hian the Frog.
I agree with you. If possible, we have to avoid to use some new python/SDK codes but only XML. But it will be difficult if we want to add some specific bonuses with jungles chopping and food production for example.
About religion, having the Lizardmen Agnostic is acceptable. If you follow my history of the lizardmen, it makes sense. To compensate, the basic "Pagan Temple" could be renamed and a bit better to represent their specific religion.
Hian the Frog.
Ekolite
Deity
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Yeah exactly. Hian + woodelf what is the theme of your lizzies? Alignment? Spheres? Beliefs? etc.
All I know about is that they've got their hands on a dragon egg and they're trying to hatch it.
Also I'm going to d/l the drconia mod tommorow to check out the lizzardmen units, I've seen some pics and they loook pretty awesome. Did you already ask the maker if we could use them? If not I'll PM him if you like.
All I know about is that they've got their hands on a dragon egg and they're trying to hatch it.
Also I'm going to d/l the drconia mod tommorow to check out the lizzardmen units, I've seen some pics and they loook pretty awesome. Did you already ask the maker if we could use them? If not I'll PM him if you like.
I'm working on the Dragonia mod as well and am currently asking winddelay to make us some more lizzie units.
Hian the Frog
TR Designer and XML
That's what i was thinking too. It's a solution despite my wish to have a better one. But why not ? If the bonuses are well thought, it can be a very good idea. A suggestion.
A basic "Pagan Temple".
Cost: 100
Tech: Mysticism
+ 10% culture
Can turn one citizen into priest.
+1 happy face from incense.
to compare with
Temple of the Worm
Cost: 100
Tech: Mysticism
+ 20% culture
Can turn one citizen into priest.
+1 happy face from incense.
+1 happy face with religion civic.
Free "strong" or "loyalty" promotion to all animals and beasts (if we suppose that we include them).
I haven't yet chose the promo.... both are interesting.
Hian the Frog.
Been reading this thread for a few days now and it's sort of sparked me off.....
It's quite late here now so it won't be a long one..... *everyone sighs*
There's a couple off thoughts that occurred to me to add a certain amount of uniqueness to them.
1) Jungles are always renowned (infamous) for their poisons, so poison use would be almost a certainty, how about a hidden resource (same as lanun pearls) that when obtained allows poison blade units to cast a spell similar to "hold" freezing the target in place for x number of turns or maybe slowing them down... they are after all slavers and it would be very useful in that line of work. Also not bows...blowpipes!
2) I don't know if this one's possible but due to their synergy with with jungle, all units (or maybe just recon) have increased visibilty when within jungle... its a major boon as the great danger in jungle (I find) is simply finishing your move adjacent to a barb/animal, without being able to see it comming. Possibly also jungle invisibilty for recon.
3) extra bonuses or unit/building ties with existing jungle resources, sugar, dyes and banana...... OH NO ..... +1 BANANA AFFINITY!!!
4) I'd also suggest very little in mage line... adept only. But really push the herbalist/ druidical /nature priest side.
Do people envisage a high tech ability ie libraries etc? Or maybe slave for research without going AV path
It's quite late here now so it won't be a long one..... *everyone sighs*
There's a couple off thoughts that occurred to me to add a certain amount of uniqueness to them.
1) Jungles are always renowned (infamous) for their poisons, so poison use would be almost a certainty, how about a hidden resource (same as lanun pearls) that when obtained allows poison blade units to cast a spell similar to "hold" freezing the target in place for x number of turns or maybe slowing them down... they are after all slavers and it would be very useful in that line of work. Also not bows...blowpipes!
2) I don't know if this one's possible but due to their synergy with with jungle, all units (or maybe just recon) have increased visibilty when within jungle... its a major boon as the great danger in jungle (I find) is simply finishing your move adjacent to a barb/animal, without being able to see it comming. Possibly also jungle invisibilty for recon.
3) extra bonuses or unit/building ties with existing jungle resources, sugar, dyes and banana...... OH NO ..... +1 BANANA AFFINITY!!!
4) I'd also suggest very little in mage line... adept only. But really push the herbalist/ druidical /nature priest side.
Do people envisage a high tech ability ie libraries etc? Or maybe slave for research without going AV path
Hian the Frog
TR Designer and XML
Been reading this thread for a few days now and it's sort of sparked me off.....
It's quite late here now so it won't be a long one..... *everyone sighs*
There's a couple off thoughts that occurred to me to add a certain amount of uniqueness to them.
1) Jungles are always renowned (infamous) for their poisons, so poison use would be almost a certainty, how about a hidden resource (same as lanun pearls) that when obtained allows poison blade units to cast a spell similar to "hold" freezing the target in place for x number of turns or maybe slowing them down... they are after all slavers and it would be very useful in that line of work. Also not bows...blowpipes!
2) I don't know if this one's possible but due to their synergy with with jungle, all units (or maybe just recon) have increased visibilty when within jungle... its a major boon as the great danger in jungle (I find) is simply finishing your move adjacent to a barb/animal, without being able to see it comming. Possibly also jungle invisibilty for recon.
3) extra bonuses or unit/building ties with existing jungle resources, sugar, dyes and banana...... OH NO ..... +1 BANANA AFFINITY!!!
4) I'd also suggest very little in mage line... adept only. But really push the herbalist/ druidical /nature priest side.
Do people envisage a high tech ability ie libraries etc? Or maybe slave for research without going AV path
Hey man,
Some of your ideas are interesting but very uneasy to add without a big work of coding in SDK/Python.
Poison must be included, that's sure. It's exactly what woodelf and i are looking for some ranged (maybe recon) units.
About "magical" units, you are right. It will be close to something linked to nature, beasts and animals masteries, etc.
I'm also thinking about 3). Very interesting idea. Instead of having a basic granary, lizardmen could have a kind of vegetables and fruits granary. Corn, wheat, etc would be replaced by fruits, sugar, etc.
Feel free to comment, add your suggestions. These ones were very interesting.
Hian the Frog.
it-ogo
Hedgehog
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3) extra bonuses or unit/building ties with existing jungle resources, sugar, dyes and banana...... OH NO ..... +1 BANANA AFFINITY!!!
1)They should have separate monsters with different techs and resource affinities: Sweet Monster (sugar aff.), Colored Monster (dye aff),... Banana Monster i suppose...
2) Unique building: Ruins, replaces hunting lodge.
Hian...thanks
It's another thought about game balance;- against human civs you're not gonna be very popular. Firstly you're the thing stopping them from simply burning the jungle, and second where are the slaves coming from? It seems you maybe spending a lot of time at war. It would be good to give some benefits that allows you a unique trade option simply to keep you useful enough not to eliminate.
I did think of temples giving +1 happy from dye rather than incense, whereas sugar, banana give extra health maybe no boni from cattle/sheep though pig scores as it can be jungle. It creates an independence of exterior imports.... though someone more knowledgable than me would have to work numbers.
It's another thought about game balance;- against human civs you're not gonna be very popular. Firstly you're the thing stopping them from simply burning the jungle, and second where are the slaves coming from? It seems you maybe spending a lot of time at war. It would be good to give some benefits that allows you a unique trade option simply to keep you useful enough not to eliminate.
I did think of temples giving +1 happy from dye rather than incense, whereas sugar, banana give extra health maybe no boni from cattle/sheep though pig scores as it can be jungle. It creates an independence of exterior imports.... though someone more knowledgable than me would have to work numbers.
As regards animal mastery, there maybe justification for allowing giantspider build as nationalised unit but with the ability to release back into the wild, (similar to bears). This should happen quite early as hunters tend to eat new spiders, but should be a relatively expensive unit, could afford to build say 2 or 3, no mass spider spams.
This race is actually starting to make the jungles REAL dangerous!
Anyway goodnight guys.
This race is actually starting to make the jungles REAL dangerous!
Anyway goodnight guys.
Personally, I think that Lizardmen would be weaker than normal units, with the addition of poison damage, but I think their main strength would be in hit and run tactics, like with cavalry. If you made larger Lizardmen the cavalry, you would not need the Horse or Nightmare resource, and you could effectively create a war of attrition. Also, their recon line would be good, but I don't think it would be their main thing. Maybe higher level Lizardmen could give an enemy the Poisoned promotion in battle randomly. Just a few thoughts...
Wyrmhero
Wyrmhero
Ekolite
Deity
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Hey Hian, have you got a civ name for your lizzies?
Also, I like the lizzie granary idea. I think it would be good if we could add a marsh terrain to FFH.
- would require water walking or lizardman promotions to cross
- maybe just 1 food normally but a fair bit more for lizzies.
- resources found: fish and eels (new resource)
- the improvement for these resources would be built by lizzie workers.
Then for their smokehouse they could have +1 health for fish, eels and pigs. (jungle pigs)
Also, I like the lizzie granary idea. I think it would be good if we could add a marsh terrain to FFH.
- would require water walking or lizardman promotions to cross
- maybe just 1 food normally but a fair bit more for lizzies.
- resources found: fish and eels (new resource)
- the improvement for these resources would be built by lizzie workers.
Then for their smokehouse they could have +1 health for fish, eels and pigs. (jungle pigs)
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