[R&F] Emergency, Just some Free Gold?

[Lily_Lancer]

It seems that player can handle emergencies much better, while AI are not good at capture cities/convert cities, indicating that emergency just brings some free gold to player, whatever he being target or participant, he is always sure to "win" the emergency.

So how to trigger emergency to get these free gold may actually be the topic, since fulfilling reqs of emergencies are very easy. 1000~3000 gold is not very little amount, and is sure to be helpful.

 

[rjg85]

Any Emergency that involves liberating or reconverting a city is going to be ridiculously easy to defend against - you will already have an army of units/Apostles stationed next to the city from the conquest/conversion, and we all know the AI will send in units one at a time to die against them.

It would only really be a challenge if the AI used the Emergency as a pretext to opportunistically invade, pillage and capture civilians in the rest of your land, as any human player would. But i'm pretty sure they will be hard programmed to head straight for the Emergency target and completely ignore anything else on the way or nearby, which pretty much guarantees that you'll suffer no penalties for triggering one.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Any Emergency that involves liberating or reconverting a city is going to be ridiculously easy to defend against - you will already have an army of units/Apostles stationed next to the city from the conquest/conversion, and we all know the AI will send in units one at a time to die against them.

It would only really be a challenge if the AI used the Emergency as a pretext to opportunistically invade, pillage and capture civilians in the rest of your land, as any human player would. But i'm pretty sure they will be hard programmed to head straight for the Emergency target and completely ignore anything else on the way or nearby, which pretty much guarantees that you'll suffer no penalties for triggering one.

I haven't watched the Monday streams, but in the devs stream Mongols:
1. Had some hard fighting with India off screen.
2. Brought significant forces to the target city after a while.

So, both points don't seem valid.

Surely, human player has significant tactical advantage over AI, but I wouldn't underestimate its strategic approach (unless it's restrained for gameplay reasons).

 

[craney1987]

This is something that I'm most interested in.

If the AI does handle emergencies well, 5-6 AI coming at you, or a specific target of yours, could prove very challenging.

If the AI struggles with these, they will indeed become free money as OP believes.

As to how to trigger them? Capturing City states seems like a gimme to me.
I wonder if this is possibly exploitable by gifting captured city states then recapturing, reviving and attacking them again? If warmonger penalties aren't something you care about this seems like some easy coin

 

[BenZL43]

Since we know the quality of AI.. I figured I might be as well as fine if extra AI units with attack stance suddenly appears near the target city out of nowhere. Just do whatever it takes to make it challenging for human player, please.

 

[darkace77450]

If a player is in a position to easily handle an emergency then he or she is in already in a position to easily win the game. Free gold speeds the process of winning the game. I don't see this as a bad thing. That doesn't excuse the sorry state of the AI, but I just don't see how this particular system is problematic.

 

[Olleus]

If a player is in a position to easily handle an emergency then he or she is in already in a position to easily win the game. Free gold speeds the process of winning the game. I don't see this as a bad thing. That doesn't excuse the sorry state of the AI, but I just don't see how this particular system is problematic.

This exactly.

I'm not so sure Emergencies are going to be the rubber band mechanism that's been described. Everything so far points to it being more of a "slingshot" that will make a very likely victory even faster.

 

[mrwho]

Given the state of the AI, emergencies feel like they'll be more relevant in multiplayer than single player. It's a great addition to multiplayer (which I never play), but I fear it will just amount to free gold in single player.

 

[Disgustipated]

I certainly won't turn down free gold. Especially after trade routes take a little hit (meaning you aren't getting that gold from those until you get the first building up). Will the human player utilize this better than the AI? Of course. But the same can be said with nearly all the game mechanics. The real question is whether they will be fun. If they are fun, then I will be happy for their inclusion into the game.

I can also see many emergencies that are too far way for me to deal with. A city state emergency that's over 30 tiles away can't be resolved in 30 turns (even with 2 move units it takes time to actually conquer the city).

 

[sonicmyst]

Conversely, if you were invited to an emergency and misjudged the other civs by thinking they will join, but eventually turns out you will be the only participant, and the target is sooo far to make it by 30 turns, then it is free gold as well to the AI civ. (sorry for too long sentence)

 

[Amrunril]

I'm not so sure Emergencies are going to be the rubber band mechanism that's been described. Everything so far points to it being more of a "slingshot" that will make a very likely victory even faster.

I think this is part of the point. The idea is that if the other players are in a position to stop the leader, the emergencies system encourages them to do so. If, on the other hand, the leader is in a position that the other players' can't stop them, it allows them to win faster. That ability to stop is measured based on the AI's combat ability is problematic, but the principle of keeping games close when possible while allowing games that are already essentially won to end faster is a good one.

 

[Tiger Genocide]

One thing that concerns me the most is if the AI can calculate the distance needed to even address the emergency. It's annoying already to get joint DOW by a Civ on the other side of the map that has no chance in hell of getting even one troop near your border in even 40 turns, then you white peace with them in 10 turns, but the other AI actually near you gets crushed with no help. I have already seen lots of complaints against Joint War mechanics in this game and if it is no different than joint war now, in regards to distance, emergencies will indeed be a cheesy feature for free gold like Lily Lancer said.

 

[tedhebert]

It seems that player can handle emergencies much better, while AI are not good at capture cities/convert cities, indicating that emergency just brings some free gold to player, whatever he being target or participant, he is always sure to "win" the emergency.

So how to trigger emergency to get these free gold may actually be the topic, since fulfilling reqs of emergencies are very easy. 1000~3000 gold is not very little amount, and is sure to be helpful.

As a defender, I totally agree, unless the AI plays this really well and you're in an early deity game

As an attacker, a little less convinced... first of all, the money will be divided by the number of participants, which could be high... also, a recapture city halfway across the map will most likely NOT succeed, as we know how efficient the AI is...

guess we'll see

 

[Hammurabbit]

There are three cases (if you disregard multiplayer):
1) Player is a candidate to participate in an emergency (join as attacker). This could be very interesting, as you may have have been unprepared for war and you don't know who's joining. So I think this case have a lot of potential to be a fun element and something that throws you off your beaten path.
2) Player is a defender in emergencies. As the OP speculates, this is potentially free gold and can even be exploited. Assuming that the tactical play by the AI is only slightly improved in R&F, what we can hope for is massive aggressiveness and large coalitions that make emergencies something to worry about, and not something to exploit. From the latest "devs play R&F" that doesn't seem to be the case, so I'm worried about this case.
3) AIs having emergencies against AIs. More war = More fun, so I'm looking forward to that.

 

[Victoria]

The answer is to take a city state and that's what I was hoping they would discourage with this release.
Its done already and helps start a steamroller in the first place. It reduces the challenge.
In its simplest form... do nothing you do not already do and the gold will come to you.

 

[Lily_Lancer]

Conversely, if you were invited to an emergency and misjudged the other civs by thinking they will join, but eventually turns out you will be the only participant, and the target is sooo far to make it by 30 turns, then it is free gold as well to the AI civ. (sorry for too long sentence)

I definitely don't want others to join. If others join this means I cannot declare war on them in 30 turns, while split emergency gold with them, this is too terrible.

30 turns is a long time. If game mechanism remains unchanged this time is enough to wipe out 5~6 Civs if you prepared your army beforehand, not a single city.

As a defender, I totally agree, unless the AI plays this really well and you're in an early deity game

As an attacker, a little less convinced... first of all, the money will be divided by the number of participants, which could be high... also, a recapture city halfway across the map will most likely NOT succeed, as we know how efficient the AI is...

guess we'll see

Since you have 30 turns, it's enough to cross over the map, even enough to take everything on the path. I remember some Gotm Pangea games that I capture everything, leaving everyone else a single city, at around T90.