European Halloween - good or bad?

SanPellegrino

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What do you think of the trend to celebrate Halloween that came up in the last years? Is it just nice to have another occasion to celebrate? Or do you think it is some sort of "cultural imperialism" because Halloween hasn't any background in most european countries?

I myself love to celebrate but this commercialisation is a pain in the ass. It just seems all branches agreed, "hey the last event was months ago, summer is over and still 2 months till xmas, let's establish Halloween so people have something to spend their money on."
 
Hallowen wasn't celebrated in my little city 10 years ago or so.. Now it is widely celebrated with some 'special parties'. I don't like it. I prefer the 'Day of all Saints', but maybe I'm too used to our European heritage ;)
 
Your completly wrong SanPellegrino.
Halloween has a strong cultural link to europe, it has its origins in ancient celtic europe, and even other ancient cultures who all feared the winter.
Winter to us is no big deal, but back then it mean't the end of harvest and the coming of death through starvation and disease.

I posted this in another forum titled 'The origins of Holloween'

'Halloween is an annual celebration, but just what is it actually a celebration of? And how did this peculiar custom originate? Is it, as some claim, a kind of demon worship? Or is it just a harmless vestige of some ancient pagan ritual?

The word itself, "Halloween," actually has its origins in the Catholic Church. It comes from a contracted corruption of All Hallows Eve. November 1, "All Hollows Day" (or "All Saints Day"), is a Catholic day of observance in honor of saints. But, in the 5th century BC, in Celtic Ireland, summer officially ended on October 31. The holiday was called Samhain (sow-en), the Celtic New year.

One story says that, on that day, the disembodied spirits of all those who had died throughout the preceding year would come back in search of living bodies to possess for the next year. It was believed to be their only hope for the afterlife. The Celts believed all laws of space and time were suspended during this time, allowing the spirit world to intermingle with the living.

Naturally, the still-living did not want to be possessed. So on the night of October 31, villagers would extinguish the fires in their homes, to make them cold and undesirable. They would then dress up in all manner of ghoulish costumes and noisily paraded around the neighborhood, being as destructive as possible in order to frighten away spirits looking for bodies to possess.

Probably a better explanation of why the Celts extinguished their fires was not to discourage spirit possession, but so that all the Celtic tribes could relight their fires from a common source, the Druidic fire that was kept burning in the Middle of Ireland, at Usinach.

Some accounts tell of how the Celts would burn someone at the stake who was thought to have already been possessed, as sort of a lesson to the spirits. Other accounts of Celtic history debunk these stories as myth.

The Romans adopted the Celtic practices as their own. But in the first century AD, Samhain was assimilated into celebrations of some of the other Roman traditions that took place in October, such as their day to honor Pomona, the Roman goddess of fruit and trees. The symbol of Pomona is the apple, which might explain the origin of our modern tradition of bobbing for apples on Halloween.

The thrust of the practices also changed over time to become more ritualized. As belief in spirit possession waned, the practice of dressing up like hobgoblins, ghosts, and witches took on a more ceremonial role.

The custom of Halloween was brought to America in the 1840's by Irish immigrants fleeing their country's potato famine. At that time, the favorite pranks in New England included tipping over outhouses and unhinging fence gates.

The custom of trick-or-treating is thought to have originated not with the Irish Celts, but with a ninth-century European custom called souling. On November 2, All Souls Day, early Christians would walk from village to village begging for "soul cakes," made out of square pieces of bread with currants. The more soul cakes the beggars would receive, the more prayers they would promise to say on behalf of the dead relatives of the donors. At the time, it was believed that the dead remained in limbo for a time after death, and that prayer, even by strangers, could expedite a soul's passage to heaven.

The Jack-o-lantern custom probably comes from Irish folklore. As the tale is told, a man named Jack, who was notorious as a drunkard and trickster, tricked Satan into climbing a tree. Jack then carved an image of a cross in the tree's trunk, trapping the devil up the tree. Jack made a deal with the devil that, if he would never tempt him again, he would promise to let him down the tree.

According to the folk tale, after Jack died, he was denied entrance to Heaven because of his evil ways, but he was also denied access to Hell because he had tricked the devil. Instead, the devil gave him a single ember to light his way through the frigid darkness. The ember was placed inside a hollowed-out turnip to keep it glowing longer.

The Irish used turnips as their "Jack's lanterns" originally. But when the immigrants came to America, they found that pumpkins were far more plentiful than turnips. So the Jack-O-Lantern in America was a hollowed-out pumpkin, lit with an ember.

So, although some cults may have adopted Halloween as their favorite "holiday," the day itself did not grow out of evil practices. It grew out of the rituals of Celts celebrating a new year, and out of Medieval prayer rituals of Europeans. And today, even many churches have Halloween parties or pumpkin carving events for the kids. After all, the day itself is only as evil as one cares to make it.'
 
Ech... Come on, it's fun :)

If there's no demand for halloween it will seize to exist, anyway..
 
Seconded... as it stands today, European Halloween is a marketing ploy.

Then again, people celebrate whatever they want to celebrate. It's a free world.

I don't celebrate Halloween because it's not (yet) part of my culture... and being just a wee bit conservative about these issues, I don't see why exactly it should become a part of my culture any time soon.

By the way, I can't help to mention this... the best episode of any tv show ever deals with Halloween... "The curse of Frank Black" of Millennium.
 
Originally posted by gael
Your completly wrong SanPellegrino.
Halloween has a strong cultural link to europe ...

yes, I know that, but I think the event in its current form is an US-american event and has very little to do with spirit possession and such things in our times. fact is, in Germany and other countries, Spain for example, like yaroslav wrote it wasn't celebrated 10 years ago and the upcoming of it in the last years has very little to do with a "strong cultural link" but more with the advantageous date in the calendar. I am not "against" it but it seems so organized and commercial here, it has little to do with a fun festivity. maybe Ireland is another case of course, but here the word halloween was unknown to most except "peanuts" readers.
 
No I don't like it. I see it as cultural imperialism and above all, as a commercial exploit. It will take a very long time, if at all, to get me to celebrate Halloween (wouldn't know how anyway). But that's probably because I didn't grew up with it. If I were 5 now I would probably like it, just like all the kids now.
 
A commercial exploit??

You spend like $5 on candy.
Its a great excuse to dress up & party, which is more then worth the 5 bucks.
 
Originally posted by SanPellegrino


yes, I know that, but I think the event in its current form is an US-american event and has very little to do with spirit possession and such things in our times. fact is, in Germany and other countries, Spain for example, like yaroslav wrote it wasn't celebrated 10 years ago and the upcoming of it in the last years has very little to do with a "strong cultural link" but more with the advantageous date in the calendar. I am not "against" it but it seems so organized and commercial here, it has little to do with a fun festivity. maybe Ireland is another case of course, but here the word halloween was unknown to most except "peanuts" readers.

I think your problem isn't with Halloween SanPellegrino, your problem seems to be with americian culture based on some sort anti-americian sentiment.

In your first post you you went on about how Holloween wasn't european and its some sort of Americian import thats posioning your culture.
Holloween is European, but like everything thing else its meaning has become redundant over time and its celibrated as a holiday.
It has probably come to your country through americia, but so has a lot of stuff, most I'm sure you like.
Everything is comericalised, just look at christmas. Get over it.

Its another holiday, the more holidays the better i say.
 
Halloween is annoying u have to give kids sweets and stuff, then 14 yr olds come round and want money.
so i just dont answer the door and if im buying sweets, im eating them.
 
Halloween is hype. Just like Thanksgiving. I don't need it but it is being shoved down my throat nevertheless.

Christmas and New Years is different. Its about family, good food and getting drunk.
 
As has already been said Halloween in the US is a holiday of celtic origin. If it has returned to Europe as a commercialized American holiday that is too bad. Here in the US it has a commercial element but is really just an excuse to throw the best party of the year. It is the US's answer to mardi gras, more fun for adults than for children.:D
 
I'd just like to say that Haloween is the by far the bes holiday in America and it is one of the things that should be exported. Long live haloween!!!! Yes I'm drunk because that's what Americans do on haloween. Some things that are American should be kept out like the plauge by the rest of the world, but haloween should be tresured like other American exports like Nirvana, Audio Slave and Coca Cola.
 
Originally posted by Ebitdadada
I'd just like to say that Haloween is the by far the bes holiday in America and it is one of the things that should be exported. Long live haloween!!!! Yes I'm drunk because that's what Americans do on haloween. Some things that are American should be kept out like the plauge by the rest of the world, but haloween should be tresured like other American exports like Nirvana, Audio Slave and Coca Cola.
:D Welcome to CFC and Off topic. I spent Halloween in Uptown and have now washed up at home happy, drunk and satisfied. It was like a bad acid trip gone good. With company and a license to ill.:D
 
It's kind of ridiculous. But children like it. Admittedly, I also started a Halloween celebration routine: I usually get drunk and go to some goth clubs (where I will be the only person not dressed in black leather or pierced). Then I'll get a little more drunk and find myself a goth babe that likes to talk about her favourite methods for attempted suicide. Did I mention that I will be too drunk to care?

And, yes, I did take about three Aspirins before I was able to get up today.
 
I don't want to kill the fun some are having during halloween, despite knowing that it was introduced for companies to make money (what's not? e.g. Santa's colors were decided by Coca Cola, but that doesn't make Santa evil). So, I'm soon going out to buy candy for all the kids, which I think last year were actually only 3, so that they won't wreck our house. )

We already have a similar tradition, easter, where kids dress up as witches and wizards and walk from house to house getting candy. Is that a Swedish tradition, or do other's do it too?
 
Originally posted by gael


I think your problem isn't with Halloween SanPellegrino, your problem seems to be with americian culture based on some sort anti-americian sentiment.

:confused: :eek: no, that is not true, I have no anti-american sentiment whatsoever. I hang out on an american game board, play an american game (and sometimes drink coca cola thereby). :)

you make it yourself very easy to put word in peoples mouth they never said.

I know Christmas for example is commercialized too, but because it is implemented in culture here you still can celebrate it in a decent manner. If I lived in the US I would like Halloween too, but my point is in Europe it is different. it is only, like written before, one big marketing ploy. if Halloween would be only a week after Carnival it wouldn't be nearly as interesting for Industry.
 
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