Feedback thread

[nevill]

Today I've won a Subspace Genegator victory on Emperor. Some things I've noticed:

1) Yang has spouted "AI_NO_PEACE_TREATY_2" line or something similar once.
2) At one point my capital did revolt. The units that were stationed there were moved outside the base, but the Great Person that happened to be there was lost. Is it intentional?
3) When I recaptured the base I saved and quit. After loading the game it had a maintenance of 65 for 1 turn. 7 credits from the number of cities and distance from the Headquarters (I didn't have Headquaters, though, they were destroyed). I don't know where the rest came from. The problem fixed itself on the next turn. I have that save, but not the one from the previous turn, sorry.

Minor gripes:
4) Wild life on land is mild at best. I remember early versions of Planetfall an it was much, much easier this time. Their behavior is questionable. Early in the game, two mindworms have entered the vicinity of my capital that was defended by a single flamethrower. If they attacked both at once, I would be doomed. But only one of them attacked straight away while the other was pillaging my resourses, and even after my flamethrower survived with less than half of it's health, the pillaging mindworm didn't go for the kill. It patiently waited for my reinforcements to arrive.
5) AIs are uncooperative among themselves. At some point I've got in an All-on-One situation and had thought for a moment that AIs have united to bring me down. But mere 15 turns later I was able to establish Treaties with half of them and no one tried to really oppose since me then, not even when I've built The Planetary Transit System (my intentions couldn't have been clearer). It would be good if they teamed up on the winner, preferrably while he could still be stopped.
6) AI does not know how to plan invasions from across the ocean. I've had two 'assaults' in the whole game, no more than 5-7 low-tier units each, that were very easy to repel. I'm sure Yang could have sent a bigger fleet, seeing that he was close second in scores. Of course, the fact that I played with scattered landing pods didn't help the issue.
7) Maybe it's just me, but I feel that bunkers are impenetrable for an AI. They must have been at least partly responsible for (6).
8) There are cases when the technological progress is somewhat undesirable. Being a terraformer, I needed a large fleet to keep sealife out of my borders. For that I've built many kamikaze-like ships with the sole purpose of wearing the enemy down. The jump from submarines to hunters have done me nothing but harm because the time I needed to produce units increased by 1.5 times. The defenders had psi defense so there wasn't any advantages in increased conventional fighting strengh. Had I the choice, I would continue building subs. Perhaps there could be a cheap unit with weak conventional weaponry, designed specifically for psi combat?

Thanks for a great mod.

 

[Lord Tirian]

Today I've won a Subspace Genegator victory on Emperor. Some things I've noticed:

By the way, did you feel that the Interstellar Gate victory is too easy to achieve? I (with my mediocre play at Noble) keep getting that impression. After thinking about it (and comparing it to Civ's and SMAC's science/builder victories), I identified a couple of possible reasons:

• Centralised building: allowing you to take advantage of your best production city (Civ has spaceship parts, forcing you to spread the production or to be even slower; SMAC's subspace victory needs six different bases and Transcendence requires you to build two consecutive wonders, alarming opponents a lot earlier)
• Tech to easy to get: Thanks to Planetfall's OR tech tree, you can beeline to Singularity Mechanics too easily - it's sort of taking the "science" out of science (to compare: Transcendence basically forced you to have most of the tech tree discovered, spaceship-style victories usually require you to have a variety of techs)
• Too easy to build: SMAC and Civ force you to build "useless" buildings before starting the victory build (Voice of Planet/Apollo Project), whereas Planetary Transit System or Dimensional Gates are highly valuable in themselves, they're not really a prerequisite.

Now, I don't have immediate suggestions for a fix (especially, since not everybody perceives the same things as problems), but I thought that might be food for thought. I'd also hope Pfeffersack can weigh in, since he's a much keener strategist than I am.

Finally, I've some interesting modcomps while browsing around and was wondering if Planetfall could pillage some of them (or parts of them). Both are by Afforess (who's a mean code-spewing machine! ):

• Advanced Diplomacy: Not everything, of course, but trading contacts (especially with the spawing expansion factions) sounds interesting; even more interesting is the AI bit (using techs/gold to bribe other AIs to war, embargoes or peace). I'm not too keen about embassies, right of passage (weakens open borders, IMO) and trading units.
• Advanced Unit Automations: Now, automations aren't for everybody - but they're nice for beginners (plus I remember somebody liked the idea of automations, because SMAC had them - and this modcomp can apparently even fully automate aircraft, with rebasing etc.!). What I really want from these are "Auto Air Recon" and "Gather Intel", because both of these missions are often boring clickwork. "Border Patrol" might be neat as well, but I'd have to see it in action in Planetfall to see how well it works.

Both bits are really more suggestions to go on the (probably never-ending) list of stuff, nothing pressing! They're big and probably hard to merge in, depending on the amount of changes Planetfall already has there...

Cheers, LT.

 

[nevill]

By the way, did you feel that the Interstellar Gate victory is too easy to achieve?

Absolutely. In fact, I was tired that nothing was happening for the last 50 years and just beelined to the tech with all production set to research. Got there in 20 turns from the middle of a tech tree.

By the way, Wealth is way better than knowledge for research purposes. If those extra +25% didn't add to research I might have considered switching, but 10% to research just don't cut it. By the way, out of the 3 choices, Wealth seemed a little too overpowered. As did Planned. I've never switched an economy civic since I got there. Well, with a Hybrid the story might have been different, but I still think +35% is too big a bonus for Terraformers. Free Market is still useful early in the game when Happiness is a concern, though.

I identified a couple of possible reasons

Your points are valid. However, I might add one more - production times. I've built the Subspace Generator in 2 turns. Making Material Supplies available on that tech might not be such a good idea.

And while in SMAC everyone could join the race immediately upon building VoP (though by the year that happens the one who've built it would hurry it in 1 turn with credits alone), this isn't the case for Planetfall. Well, I guess it wouldn't matter much even if it was, but if there would be a separate tech path dedicated to industrialisation, it might discourage someone from beelining to the tech early.

 

[Maniac]

1) Yang has spouted "AI_NO_PEACE_TREATY_2" line or something similar once.

I'll see if I can track this down.

2) At one point my capital did revolt. The units that were stationed there were moved outside the base, but the Great Person that happened to be there was lost. Is it intentional?

Certainly not intended. Was that a barbarian revolt or a revolt towards another faction?

3) When I recaptured the base I saved and quit. After loading the game it had a maintenance of 65 for 1 turn. 7 credits from the number of cities and distance from the Headquarters (I didn't have Headquaters, though, they were destroyed). I don't know where the rest came from. The problem fixed itself on the next turn. I have that save, but not the one from the previous turn, sorry.

Yeah I know, but given that it's only a one turn problem, I don't consider this important enough to track down the exact causes and figure out how to fix this.

5) AIs are uncooperative among themselves. At some point I've got in an All-on-One situation and had thought for a moment that AIs have united to bring me down. But mere 15 turns later I was able to establish Treaties with half of them and no one tried to really oppose since me then, not even when I've built The Planetary Transit System (my intentions couldn't have been clearer). It would be good if they teamed up on the winner, preferrably while he could still be stopped.

I agree. But first I need to have a good idea how the Interstellar Gate victory will finally work, before telling the AI what sign to look out for.

6) AI does not know how to plan invasions from across the ocean. I've had two 'assaults' in the whole game, no more than 5-7 low-tier units each, that were very easy to repel. I'm sure Yang could have sent a bigger fleet, seeing that he was close second in scores. Of course, the fact that I played with scattered landing pods didn't help the issue.

That's a matter for Better AI. Though jdog5000 has already made many improvement in this area. Naval invasions at the moment are probably as good as they'll ever get. What can I say?

8) Perhaps there could be a cheap unit with weak conventional weaponry, designed specifically for psi combat?

1) The AI wouldn't understand how to use such a unit optimally.
2) Barbarians are one side of the issue, but native Life when built by factions can be seen as a counter against factions who are outteching and outproducing you. If those factions could massproduce a cheap native life counter, they (along with all pro-Planet players) would be completely screwed.

So I don't really see a good solution to this issue.


Regarding the cost of the Subspace Generator, I certainly agree it's too cheap. My thought for the victory would be to create several stages of the Subspace Generator, which require the previous stage to build the next one. That way one can make the building much more expensive, while still offering the player a bonus for having completed part of the large project. It also makes it easier for the AI to know who is closest to achieving victory and so who they should gang up on. Something I've asked about a couple times and WHICH NO ONE HAS EVER ANSWERED ME is what the combined cost should be of the different Subspace Generators buildings. It should be high enough to give other players a shot at trying to conquer the base where the Subspace Generator is built. Given I play less games of Planetfall than most people posting here, especially games that reach the end game, I'm not the right person to answer this question.

 

[nevill]

Certainly not intended. Was that a barbarian revolt or a revolt towards another faction?

The former.

Yeah I know, but given that it's only a one turn problem, I don't consider this important enough to track down the exact causes and figure out how to fix this.

Well, I was confused for a moment - should I rebuild HQ first or should I go for Nuclear Reactor (it said it was going to fix maintenance problem)? The bug might be worth a place in Known Issues section.

I agree. But first I need to have a good idea how the Interstellar Gate victory will finally work, before telling the AI what sign to look out for.

They'd better look for higher scores. It's too late when someone is aiming for the victory.

That's a matter for Better AI. Though jdog5000 has already made many improvement in this area. Naval invasions at the moment are probably as good as they'll ever get. What can I say?

I'd say that this might be partially sealife's fault. It is too strong compared to it's land counterparts. I was outteching everyone and had a few high-tier units to spare, but never left my own island, because crossing the sea of fungus between me and my opponents required a huge navy. If more sealife had animal AI and didn't actively seek my ships out... Do they know where my units are on the map, or don't they?

Something I've asked about a couple times and WHICH NO ONE HAS EVER ANSWERED ME is what the combined cost should be of the different Subspace Generators buildings. It should be high enough to give other players a shot at trying to conquer the base where the Subspace Generator is built.

This is a question that is hard to answer without deciding few things first. Lord Tirian have made excellent points. Is it going to be a centralised or decentralised build? Will the parts require the same tech, or different ones? I think that Interstellar Victory was made strictly for terraformers and should consider their production rate (80-120 minerals per turn). 20 turns are good enough for others to try and stop the winner, provided that they know beforehand what he is up to. And of course, the one attempting an IV should not be able to hurry production by any means.

 

[Maniac]

Hmm... for locusts, it should be highly dependant on the state of planet - locusts shouldn't occur at all during the early game

Yep, that's already the case. Varying the spawning diversity between mind worms and spore launchers should be possible.

This however...

Ideally, most "lone" native life you encounter are worms, only stacks with 3+ units should have a quarter of them as spore launchers to assist with collateral damage.

Isn't really possible, as random non-fungal bloom barbarian units are created alone.

I'd say that this might be partially sealife's fault. It is too strong compared to it's land counterparts. I was outteching everyone and had a few high-tier units to spare, but never left my own island, because crossing the sea of fungus between me and my opponents required a huge navy. If more sealife had animal AI and didn't actively seek my ships out... Do they know where my units are on the map, or don't they?

Three words: Stealth special ability. I've told the AI to give high preference to using the Stealth spec ab for their transports as well, and in my experience that works. So I don't know if native sea life is really the issue. Perhaps the transports return home if their visible escorts are destroyed. Or perhaps the AI thinks you're too far away to even bother attacking. I don't know. In any case, this would be easily solved by playing on my recommend setting (Scattered Landing Pods off), which seems to improve AI performance.

This is a question that is hard to answer without deciding few things first. Lord Tirian have made excellent points. Is it going to be a centralised or decentralised build? Will the parts require the same tech, or different ones? I think that Interstellar Victory was made strictly for terraformers and should consider their production rate (80-120 minerals per turn). 20 turns are good enough for others to try and stop the winner, provided that they know beforehand what he is up to. And of course, the one attempting an IV should not be able to hurry production by any means.

I'd keep it as a centralized build (plus six Dimensional Gates) and only Singularity Mechanics as a requirement for the Subspace Generator. Do you really want to be forced to research the whole tech tree even if you're clearly in the lead? That's just stalling the inevitable.

I think you should still be able to hurry production of the Subspace Generator. Though perhaps move Material Supplies to another tech. For this reason I'm looking for some numbers of what people's hammer production and maximum possible credit production is at the end of their games for their whole faction (provided they're playing on a standard-sized map), rather than only their most productive base. By allowing you to use your entire faction's economy to create the Subspace Generator, it will automatically vary how long it takes to achieve victory. If you can use your entire economy because you're well ahead and no one can threaten you militarily, then it will take the least time and you're least likely to get bored. If you're forced to still spend resources on your military because you're not clearly in the lead, building the Subspace Generator will take longer, and researching Singularity Mechanics won't be an automatic win button.

 

[GeoModder]

I definitely agree with moving Material Supplies to another tech. I think in my (small-sized map) game where I achieved the Subspace Victory it took me 5 or so MS's to build it. And since the Planetary Transit SP was built beforehand it only took a breeze to finish.

 

[nevill]

Three words: Stealth special ability.

Yes, my every single ship had to pick this ability to survive longer than 5 turns outside of the borders. Something is not quite right here, I think.

I'd keep it as a centralized build (plus six Dimensional Gates) and only Singularity Mechanics as a requirement for the Subspace Generator. Do you really want to be forced to research the whole tech tree even if you're clearly in the lead? That's just stalling the inevitable.

Well, I surely don't want to stall things. After all, the reason I chose an IV was because I got bored. Still, I think that scattering tech requirements a bit might be worth it. I also think that the PTS project is too overpowered. At the very least, let other bases participate.

By allowing you to use your entire faction's economy to create the Subspace Generator, it will automatically vary how long it takes to achieve victory. If you can use your entire economy because you're well ahead and no one can threaten you militarily, then it will take the least time and you're least likely to get bored. If you're forced to still spend resources on your military because you're not clearly in the lead, building the Subspace Generator will take longer, and researching Singularity Mechanics won't be an automatic win button.

I want it to take 20 turns regardless of how powerful your economy is. If you are not in the lead, then how come you are aiming for an IV? Why haven't the leader done so already? I think we might accept that more often than not the one attempting to build the SG will be the leader, and that he can only be stopped by the rest of the crew by combining their powers. 20 turns isn't that much, but it is possible to try and swarm the leading faction in that timeframe. But should the leader put his whole economy to the single goal, others might not make it in time to the base that is building the project. It means there wouldn't be a reason for the leader to build a stronger military in the first place.

 

[Lord Tirian]

Well, I surely don't want to stall things. After all, the reason I chose an IV was because I got bored. Still, I think that scattering tech requirements a bit might be worth it.

Scattering the tech requirements mainly one goal: making it a more significant investment in terms of strategy. If you want transcendence, you need to prioritise Centauri techs and planetfriendly cities. If you want a military victory, you need to prioritise military/production techs and production cities (or go for worms, in which case you have to invest into Centauri again). The Interstellar Gate victory, however, sits on top of a very powerful tech branch (physics gives you cruisers, nuclear reactors, planetbusters, bunkers, dimensional gates, supercollider and more stuff) and gives you winning on top.

To compare: Achieving transcendence requires you to devote almost as much research into Centauri as into physics, but you need to keep green and have to fend off terraformers. Compared to that, the gate victory requires much less planning to get it - it's sort of a by-product of researching science/military-focussed techs.

Scattering tech prerequisites forces you to focus on different techs, i.e would make that an actual science victory. Scattering the projects themselves between bases would enforce investment into various good production bases, making it more of a industry victory. The mix is probably somewhere in between (and a matter of taste, I guess).

I want it to take 20 turns regardless of how powerful your economy is.

An solution to that might be a timer - finish the gate and it takes X turns to turn on... until then, your enemies see the project base and have time to destroy/capture it. Probably easier to balance than only through mineral costs.

Cheers, LT.

 

[nevill]

Scattering tech prerequisites forces you to focus on different techs, i.e would make that an actual science victory. Scattering the projects themselves between bases would enforce investment into various good production bases, making it more of a industry victory. The mix is probably somewhere in between (and a matter of taste, I guess).

Yes, this is exactly what I would like to see.

An solution to that might be a timer - finish the gate and it takes X turns to turn on... until then, your enemies see the project base and have time to destroy/capture it. Probably easier to balance than only through mineral costs.

The idea is great, but defending a single base for 20 turns is quite easy. Perhaps destroying one of the Dimentional Gates should add another 5 turns to the timer - that way, the leader would have to protect 6 bases instead of 1. Of course, if this is implemented, PTS have to go.

 

[GeoModder]

The idea is great, but defending a single base for 20 turns is quite easy. Perhaps destroying one of the Dimentional Gates should add another 5 turns to the timer - that way, the leader would have to protect 6 bases instead of 1. Of course, if this is implemented, PTS have to go.

I'd say destroying one of six required Dimensional Gates should outright cancel the project as the prerequisites aren't met anymore. Of course, a way around that is owning the Planetary Transit SP (or have a few backup DimGates in other bases).

 

[nevill]

I'd say destroying one of six required Dimensional Gates should outright cancel the project as the prerequisites aren't met anymore.

We are discussing the idea of a countdown that starts right after the SG is built. By then, I don't see a need for meeting prerequisites to build it anymore.

Of course, a way around that is owning the Planetary Transit SP (or have a few backup DimGates in other bases).

Getting around that with a single project seems too cheap. Backup DimGates sound good, though. I don't know anything about modding Civ IV, but is there a way to make it so that PTS lowers the cost of building Dimensional Gates by half or something like that?

 

[GeoModder]

Maniac, could you take a look at this save?

I switched from the University to the CyCon in this game, started wars with Hive and Morganites and emptied my only city of defenders. Next turn (MY2148) a Morganite siege tank barges in and I'm of course defeated. The GUI froze at that point. I could only access the Datalinks and the game options screen.

This is under patch 13m, and I added LT's CyCon files over it.

 

[Maniac]

Scattering the tech requirements mainly one goal: making it a more significant investment in terms of strategy. If you want transcendence, you need to prioritise Centauri techs and planetfriendly cities. If you want a military victory, you need to prioritise military/production techs and production cities (or go for worms, in which case you have to invest into Centauri again). The Interstellar Gate victory, however, sits on top of a very powerful tech branch (physics gives you cruisers, nuclear reactors, planetbusters, bunkers, dimensional gates, supercollider and more stuff) and gives you winning on top.

To compare: Achieving transcendence requires you to devote almost as much research into Centauri as into physics, but you need to keep green and have to fend off terraformers. Compared to that, the gate victory requires much less planning to get it - it's sort of a by-product of researching science/military-focussed techs.

Personally I actually prefer victory to be a 'by-product' of simply good gameplay. I absolutely hate Civ4's cultural victory for instance. You're supposed to spend lots of resources on something that is completely useless in great numbers for anything other than victory. In Planetfall however, the actions that lead to a Transcendence victory are useful and good for your faction even if there was no transcendence victory. Hence I cannot really agree with your opposition between Transcendence and Interstellar Gate.

I don't think adding a couple tech requirements will significantly alter the strategy that leads to an Interstellar Gate. Isn't the thought process that leads to the Interstellar Gate basically "Oh I've reached the end of the tech tree, so I guess I might as well go for the Interstellar Gate"? It would of course be nice to make the Gate a bit more interesting than that, but I don't think just adding a couple tech requirements is going to do it.

Scattering tech prerequisites forces you to focus on different techs, i.e would make that an actual science victory. Scattering the projects themselves between bases would enforce investment into various good production bases, making it more of a industry victory. The mix is probably somewhere in between (and a matter of taste, I guess).

Personally at the moment I just consider Interstellar Gate an 'economic victory'.

PTS have to go.

The PTS costs the same as Six Dimensional Gates, so victory-wise it's only benefit is that you need to defend one or two instead of six or seven bases.

Maniac, could you take a look at this save?

I switched from the University to the CyCon in this game, started wars with Hive and Morganites and emptied my only city of defenders. Next turn (MY2148) a Morganite siege tank barges in and I'm of course defeated. The GUI froze at that point. I could only access the Datalinks and the game options screen.

This is under patch 13m, and I added LT's CyCon files over it.

Downloaded. Haven't looked at it yet, but I don't hold much hope I could find the cause. I assume the cause is the same as whatever causes save files of when you switched to another faction to be messed up.

 

[Lord Tirian]

I don't think adding a couple tech requirements will significantly alter the strategy that leads to an Interstellar Gate. Isn't the thought process that leads to the Interstellar Gate basically "Oh I've reached the end of the tech tree, so I guess I might as well go for the Interstellar Gate"? It would of course be nice to make the Gate a bit more interesting than that, but I don't think just adding a couple tech requirements is going to do it.

Problem with that is that the Planetfall tech tree is very non-linear, meaning you reach the IG a lot earlier than you reach the end of the tech tree.

Personally at the moment I just consider Interstellar Gate an 'economic victory'.

I consider it as a builder victory (which plays into science and production). For a builder, most of the fun comes from building up a thriving economy - and that's why the spaceship victory is fun: It's testing how well your economy works, since you require a standing and working defense and enough production sites to finish it before the game ends (or somebody else builds it or goes for a cultural/diplomatic victory).

The IG doesn't do that - it only requires one well-built city, hence it doesn't feel as rewarding. You build it and think "well, that was nice, why did I have the other 9 thriving cities?", that's also why hurrying feels a bit like cheating. Transcendence, however, is a great builder victory right now: You keep working at one larger goal (and having synergy with the overall economy is great), see how the FC rises bit for bit - and no magic button to get around that! ... and once you win, you get the pay-off for the work.

Of course, with a thriving economy, you could also churn out enough units to steamroll a couple of factions... but the whole point of a builder victory is winning without using military!

Anyway, for more constructive input: I played two games (Noble, standard map, speed and options), both times going for green (and ultimately winning Transcendence) I got to Singularity Mechanics and could've built the Subspace Generator for the win in less than 20 turns (sans Material Supplies or Great Engineers), i.e. had a production of ~45 minerals in the capital. If we use nevill's number for Terraformer production (80-120 minerals per turn), that suggest a total building cost in the region of 2000 minerals; that would also mean that even Green players could win it ~40 turns without help (with material supplies, probably faster). Though I definitely think that a final countdown (akin to the flight time to Alpha Centauri) would make it easier to balance. Would also make it more fun - a bit like watching the FC creep towards 100!

Cheers, LT.

 

[nevill]

The PTS costs the same as Six Dimensional Gates, so victory-wise it's only benefit is that you need to defend one or two instead of six or seven bases.

The benefit is huge. It allows you to archieve an ultimate builder victory with a single fully developed base. If you have more than six bases, you won't have to defend specific bases, any of them would suffice. You could also build Colony Pods and the newly built bases will come with DimGates. That makes the possibility of AI interrupting your plans very slim.

 

[Maniac]

The IG doesn't do that - it only requires one well-built city, hence it doesn't feel as rewarding. You build it and think "well, that was nice, why did I have the other 9 thriving cities?", that's also why hurrying feels a bit like cheating.

I don't understand how you come to the conclusion that hurrying feels like cheating. If you want your whole empire involved in a builder victory, shouldn't you like a project that costs a lot more but can be hurried with crawlers, meaning it's beneficial to have more than one good production base?

Transcendence, however, is a great builder victory right now: You keep working at one larger goal

Here's an idea to allow you to work towards an Interstellar Gate from earlier in the game: allow Great Scientists to forcebuild a stage of the Subspace Generator, similar to FfH's Altar of the Luonnotar. It can be assumed that using a Great Scientist in this way represents retro-engineering Progenitor artifacts rather than original research.

Anyway, for more constructive input

What's the mineral output of your entire faction?

 

[Lord Tirian]

I don't understand how you come to the conclusion that hurrying feels like cheating. If you want your whole empire involved in a builder victory, shouldn't you like a project that costs a lot more but can be hurried with crawlers, meaning it's beneficial to have more than one good production base?

Sorry, slight misunderstanding: The current material supplies feel too efficient in relation to the total cost of the project (or in other words: it already feels like having one base is more than enough). Of course, if the mineral cost rises, it that will change.

Here's an idea to allow you to work towards an Interstellar Gate from earlier in the game: allow Great Scientists to forcebuild a stage of the Subspace Generator, similar to FfH's Altar of the Luonnotar. It can be assumed that using a Great Scientist in this way represents retro-engineering Progenitor artifacts rather than original research.

That... sounds pretty cool, I like that!

What's the mineral output of your entire faction?

Crap, forgot to make a note of that. I have to see whether I still have a savegame around. If not, I'll do so during the next game.

...and I just realised that having material supplies is a great way to emulate the vanilla spaceship part building (plus extra versatility, since you can use material supplies for other stuff as well). And that it means that a Hybrid economy (many little bases that can build MS) can compete with a Terraformer economy (few huge bases that can churn out a lot of minerals)!

Cheers, LT.

 

[Lord Tirian]

Crap, forgot to make a note of that. I have to see whether I still have a savegame around. If not, I'll do so during the next game.

About that: Don't have the saves any longer (I delete saves once I win/lose a game - and testing/modding tends to overwrite the autosaves...)

However, I finished another game over the last three days. Played Lal, went for Transcendence; used a semi-Hybrid economy (small number of big bases, using settled Transcends to keep the Planet-value high, despite having 10+ bases), used Planned to boost the HQ output. Had a total of six bases, HQ produced 64 minerals/turn, total faction output 119 minerals/turn during the turn before Transcendence victory (though due to the eco-wars, war weariness had cost ~8 minerals in HQ, ~14 minerals total). This time I couldn't have gone for IG that easily, because I kept warring with neighbours (Domai was a pain in the ***), drained a lot of resources.

Other observations:

• Transcendence is a fun victory, I like it better and better... except for one thing: I was in the lead (i.e. highest no. of points in Team Transcendence consisting of Lal/Deirdre/Cha Dawn) - and at a fFC of 96-97... Yang suddenly joined and three turns later, Transcendence. Looks like a potentially abusive strategy: Keep semi-green, try to remain tucked away - and when Transcendence is almost achieved, join (though requiring Secrets of AC as tech might keep that in check a bit). Perhaps include a "deadline" for joining Team Transcendence?
• Transcendence requires a FC of 85+ - mixed opinion on that right now: On the one hand, allowing the big team to form would be too good, on the other hand, it really enforces the hybrid-terraformer wars, I wished that would occur a bit earlier.
• Apart from Deirdre, the AI seems to be reluctant to build Dawn of the Planet - I'd like to see fungus boy more often!
• Luttinen kept going for a negative Planet Attitude (though not by much) in the last three games. Theme-wise, I'm not sure whether that's fitting - the appear to be among the people seeking Transcendence most (though as a tool for humanity, with Planet as a partner at best, not as an object of veneration) - but they really don't have synergy with that (I'd almost say Roze's bonus of -25% planet damage from pop fits better with her). Plus, producing eco-damage/pollution sounds a lot like "inefficiency", not Consciouss-like!
• Is it intended that Hybrids don't get improvement growth (i.e. Farms) once the FC hits 50 - I assume that's because the FCx2 is the speed reduction in %, resulting in reduction by 100%?

Cheers, LT.

 

[Pfeffersack]

I have a problem with the Morgan Corporations in my current game (started with patch l, continued under patch m; Consciousness City Set added). All corporations show up as pink squares in the base build menu and tring to build one immediately freezes the game.

Save is attached, just load and try to build one of the corporations in any base.