FfH2 0.15 Balance Recommendations

[Mordi]

One cannot build that innital worker fast enough, Barbarians were knocking on my door by the time i had my first worker. The 0 hammer problem is the one i'm talking about. And if there was ''enough" food to produce workers and settlers quickly (to compensate, as the second city could be placed in hammer friendly territory) it'd be fine. But floodplains are not even useful for producing settlers and workers. I had 2 cities by the time my opponent civs had 4, and the barbarians had begun assaulting my territory before I even had a second warrior to defend said city.

-Qes

EDIT: Specifically, if it was feasiable to "use the extra" food to produce units, it'd be alright...but there IS no extra food. That -1 health kicks it, you need buildings (which in the beginng you do not have) to counter act the problem. My city in all 20 squares was flood plain...crazy double river situation. Had I a single woods, it'd have been fine. Had the "extra food" been useful to produce workers/settlers it'd have been fine. As it was I had to wait 60+ turns to produce a settler. I'll also note that the size of the city didnt particularly matter except to anger people in my city. The time to build was the same.

I might be bugging into a good argument here, but I would guess a freak occurence where you had 19 floodplains in your starting city area doesn't require a balance change in the game

 

[QES]

I might be bugging into a good argument here, but I would guess a freak occurence where you had 19 floodplains in your starting city area doesn't require a balance change in the game

there were some deserts in there too. And a single hill. Couldnt develop mines fast enough to make a difference (again, lack of worker anyway).
-Qes

 

[QES]

On Barnaxus...

I realize just how uber the Luchurip can become if they have Ol barny up and promoted to high levels. The problem is that he's often not a match for things When i do finally want to use him. I tend to be pacifist with anything other than war-monger specific tactics. Barny didnt come along until most barbarians were gone...so i would either have to start a war with my niebhors or neglect him. IF i neglect him, my late-mid and late game tactics hurt, as my units cant hold up to promoted versions of my enemies. If brave (and i tend to be) i can use clever tactics, and then overwhelming force in combination, but the last war i fought with the chipries was fought to a virtual stalemate. Had Barny not died uselessly (he couldnt attack anything) and had a few levels, i might have done better. As it was, i never used him "too precious" and/or "not at war".

If ol barny had that idea of A quasi-immortality promotion, one in which he always looses 100% of experiance when he dies, it'd balance things a bit. It'd be easier to level him in the late game, but if/when he died, youd ahve to start over. It'd also keep the reward for him being used early game and merely protected late game, in that youd have all the promotions you could want and would not want to risk him anymore. But if your first war is mid/late game...maybe there should be a way to level ol barny?
-Qes

 

[vorshlumpf]

Though I don't feel Barnaxus needs any balancing, I like the idea of a sort of 'immortality' for him. Perhaps when carryable items are integrated, his death could spawn his body as an item which the Luichirp would need to carry back to their palace. Then he is re-made with his memory wiped (i.e., 0 XP).

- Niilo

 

[Grillick]

Frankly, it doesn't seem to me that a hero who requires only two technologies to be researched before he can be built needs to worry too much about barbarians about for him to kill. If you don't go for construction right away, then you should have to face the drawbacks of having focused on other aspects. Those drawbacks would include (but are not limited to) having a slightly harder time levelling Barnaxus.

 

[Frozen-Vomit]

I post it here too because it got missed in the bugs thread:

- slaves cannot explore ancient tempels (build farms over it outside of the fat crosses), with automated workers leave old improvments you then have to go and explore the tempel manually

 

[Frozen-Vomit]

Another thing:

-Could you change world units so that they can't be rushed - makes them harder to get (thesame as world wonders.)

edit:

- Loshas Valas seems to be unable to get second level spells - even though she has channeling II and death I...

 

[QES]

Frankly, it doesn't seem to me that a hero who requires only two technologies to be researched before he can be built needs to worry too much about barbarians about for him to kill. If you don't go for construction right away, then you should have to face the drawbacks of having focused on other aspects. Those drawbacks would include (but are not limited to) having a slightly harder time levelling Barnaxus.

Well i would agree, but considering the Luchurips dependancy on Barnaxus, there should be alternative methods of leveling him. Otherwise if you DO NOT go for construction as fast as possible you hamper your game, regardless of what else your doing. I'm ok with it being a specialty, but then Ol Barny shouldnt be as necessary. Maybe add (expensive) buildings that provide the same benefit barny does, a building per promotion type. This would mean youd have to build A LOT of buildings in A LOT of cities, to get the same effect as simply leveling ol barny up. It should be a redundancy not cumulative benefit. All i'm saying is that if one cannot level barny, there should be alternative methods of getting golems to be on par - maybe it should be an expensive proposition, like a ton of buildings, but there should be SOME way to do it. Else the luchurip are forced down a path every game.

Building ideas: (Each representing a Dwarven Golem "Specialist")
Golem Assembly Lines I - V. <Medium Expense> Each provides a combat * I - V appropriatly, each requireing the last version of the building to be built.
Assult Construction Yard I - III. <Medium Expense> Each provides city raider I - III appropriately, each requiring the last version of the building to be built.
Deflective Plating Shop I, II <Cheap, Expensive>- Provides Anti-archery I, II as appropriate.
Multiple Arms Shop I, II - <Cheap, Expensive>Provides Anti-Melee I, II as appropriate
Aesthetic Manipulator - <Expensive> Provides Fear promotion
Arcane Vats - <Expensive> Provides Magic Resistance
Reaction Matrix Gyromancer I, II - <Cheap, Expensive> Provides Anti-Cavalry I, II as appropriate.
Golem AutoMechanic I, II - <Medium Expense> Provides Mobility I, II as appropriate.

About: Bare in mind that these are all intended to be redundant with Barnaxus abilities, this is only "in case he dies". The expense of trying to build all these buildings in different cities would be astronomical and time consuming, plus technolgoies would be required. In this, there is a "Second Option" if things go badly. Also not every promotion should be available through building forms. There are no withdraw or terrain bonuses, becuase I think those sorts of tactics shouldnt be available. But that's just me.
-Qes

 

[dreiche2]

I wouldn't mind if he would come back after he dies, simply because of the AI. I doubt it manages to both level him up and keep him out of danger at the same time.

 

[Nikis-Knight]

about: Bare in mind that these are all intended to be redundant with Barnaxus abilities, this is only "in case he dies".

You are aware that he only gives combat I-V promotions right? Not saying other buildings are or aren't a good idea, but Barnaxus doesn't give city raider, etc.

 

[QES]

You are aware that he only gives combat I-V promotions right? Not saying other buildings are or aren't a good idea, but Barnaxus doesn't give city raider, etc.

I wasnt aware, but im not surprized. Every time i play the Luchurip my "war timing" is never in tune with when Barny is useful. I had no idea what he gave, because Im not at war when str 5 might be useful. Almost always my wars are during str 3 or str 7-9 eras. And of course the be all end all str 12+. So str 5 never is really a time i choose to be at war..not sure why, just never really happens. When barny is useful im busy doing other things not wanting to get invovled, but by the time i get to 9 and 12....my golems are feeling the pinch. I really dont even BUILD golems, just lots of archers and cavalry, because the golems are a bit of a joke if unupgraded. Slow pudgy and not effective.

These building ideas were meant to supplement ol Barny in the late/mid and Late game. I still like them, even if barny doesnt add all the options.
-Qes

 

[Nikis-Knight]

More of a question than a recommendation. I have a scout, give it woodsman or guerilla, then upgrade to a raider or other cavalry. Does this promotion still effect it, or does the no terrain defenses override this? I'd check, but I can't see the odds when I'm attacked.

 

[Grillick]

You can see the odds when you're attacked.

After a battle, open up the Combat Log. It's one of the tabs available through the little book in the top left corner.

 

[Jono]

More of a question than a recommendation. I have a scout, give it woodsman or guerilla, then upgrade to a raider or other cavalry. Does this promotion still effect it, or does the no terrain defenses override this? I'd check, but I can't see the odds when I'm attacked.

It works fine, it's a great asset when you need only 1 more movement to attack or withdraw

 

[TheBoatman]

Well i would agree, but considering the Luchurips dependancy on Barnaxus, there should be alternative methods of leveling him.

It is mainly about patience. Choose a weak city of a weak civilization, stack defense, siege, mages, medics. Reduce defenses and fireball it. Finish with Barnaxus (95+ odds) -> get 1XP or 2XP. Repeat till you get 26XP and Combat5.
Joining Barnaxus with Great Commander makes this even faster.

 

[QES]

It is mainly about patience. Choose a weak city of a weak civilization, stack defense, siege, mages, medics. Reduce defenses and fireball it. Finish with Barnaxus (95+ odds) -> get 1XP or 2XP. Repeat till you get 26XP and Combat5.
Joining Barnaxus with Great Commander makes this even faster.

Tried that a couple times. An assassin or shadow usually gets him. While waiting in the stack to wither down the opposition. I just hate being "Forced" to attack early when i get barny.
-Qes

 

[TheBoatman]

if you're speaking about approx. str7 units situation, counter the shadow with longbows/crossbows or just rangers and it should be safe. providing the camping stack is in forest/on hill. ai isn't that tough in active defending. it can cost a bit, but you do it for all your golems.

(i'm not sure if anti-melee is against golems as well)

 

[QES]

if you're speaking about approx. str7 units situation, counter the shadow with longbows/crossbows or just rangers and it should be safe. providing the camping stack is in forest/on hill. ai isn't that tough in active defending. it can cost a bit, but you do it for all your golems.

(i'm not sure if anti-melee is against golems as well)

The assassins and shadows target the weakest unit in the stack, so if ive got barny and units above 5 str, he's the weakest and gets picked off. General tactics aside, its the tech level that usually causes problems. And multiples add up. Ouchy.
-Qes

 

[TheBoatman]

hmm, i didnt know that, i usually exterminate those bastards while attacking (hate +50melee).

maybe using a warrior as a dummy and exterminating assassins next turn? or the new lifespark? just hypotheses ...

I usually fight str4-5 wars after founding of 3religions to know who are my long-term enemies, so i have a good use of barnaxus. i had to level him late only once and i had no problems, probably because i attacked civ not teching recon units.

 

[QES]

hmm, i didnt know that, i usually exterminate those bastards while attacking (hate +50melee).

maybe using a warrior as a dummy and exterminating assassins next turn? or the new lifespark? just hypotheses ...

I usually fight str4-5 wars after founding of 3religions to know who are my long-term enemies, so i have a good use of barnaxus. i had to level him late only once and i had no problems, probably because i attacked civ not teching recon units.

My general theme (though not on purpose) has been early wars, no war, then end game wars. I'm able to avoid the 4-6 strength bracket, but war usually erupts about 9 and definately 12. Sometimes i get involved early during 3 str wars...but i dont have barny at that point yet.
-Qes