FIFA World Cup: a solution to get rid of penalty shoot-outs

Marla_Singer

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EDIT: In my initial OP, I was proposing to get rid of penalty shoot-outs and count corners during extra-time instead as a tie-breaker. However, I believe the Wikipedia article about it is more complete.


Wikipedia said:
Criticisms

As a way to decide a football match, shootouts have been seen variously as a thrilling climax or as an unsatisfactory cop-out.

Paul Doyle describes shootouts as "exciting and suspense-filled" and the 2008 UEFA Champions League Final shootout as "the perfect way to end a wonderful ... final". Richard Williams compares the spectacle to "a public flogging in the market square".

The result is often seen as a lottery rather than a test of skill; managers Luiz Felipe Scolari and Roberto Donadoni described them as such after their teams had respectively won and lost shootouts. Others disagree. Mitch Phillips called it "the ultimate test of nerve and technique". Paul Doyle emphasised the psychological element.

Only a small subset of a footballer's skills is tested by a shootout. Ian Thomsen likened deciding the 1994 World Cup by shootout to deciding the Masters golf tournament via a putt-putt game. The shootout is a test of individuals which may be considered inappropriate in a team sport; Sepp Blatter has said "Football is a team sport and penalties is not a team, it is the individual".

Some teams have regarded, or been accused of regarding, a loss on penalties as an honourable result or "no defeat at all". Inferior teams are tempted to play for a scoreless draw, calculating that a shootout offers their best hope of victory. Red Star Belgrade's performance beating Olympique Marseille in the 1991 European Cup Final is often condemned for having "played for penalties" from the kick-off; a tactic coach Ljupko Petrović freely admitted to. On the other hand, the increased opportunity for giant-killing may also be seen as an advantage, increasing the romance of a competition like the FA Cup.

Alternatives

Various tie-break methods have been proposed, both before and since shootouts were introduced.

Historically, one of the first tie-breaking procedures was contained in the Sheffield Rules between 1862 and 1871, with the concept of the rouge, scorable when the ball went narrowly wide of the goal. Rule 14 stated "A goal outweighs any number of rouges. Should no goals or an equal number be obtained, the match is decided by rouges".

Current alternatives include replaying a match that has ended in a draw. This still occurs in the quarter-finals and earlier rounds of the English FA Cup. Until 1991, any number of replays were permitted, with a record of five. (Since then, a draw in the (first) replay has been resolved by a penalty-shootout.) Only once, in 1974, did the European Cup final go to a replay.

Golden goal (sudden death) and silver goal (where the extra time was split into two 15-minute periods; if one team led after the first 15-minute period, the game ended) methods to encourage a result without resort to penalties have been tried. However, the International Football Association Board (IFAB) discontinued their use in 2004. These were not seen as a success, as they led to defensive play rather than encouraging the teams to try to score goals. The reason being that the fear of having a goal scored against them seemed more important than trying to score a goal themselves.

Other suggestions have included using elements of match play such as most shots on goal, most corner kicks awarded, fewest cautions and sendings-off, or having ongoing extra time with teams compelled to remove players at progressive intervals (similar to regular season ice hockey in North America, where players play 4-on-4 — or 3-on-3 — in the extra time). These proposals have not yet been authorised by the IFAB. However, after the 2006 World Cup, Sepp Blatter stated that he wants no more penalty shootouts in the Final of the World Cup, tentatively suggesting either a replay or "Maybe to take players away and play golden goal".

Henry Birtles' "Advantage" proposal is for the shootout to be held before extra-time, and only acting as a tiebreak if the game remains a draw after the full 120 minutes. Proponents of this idea state that it would lead to a more offensive extra-time as one of the teams would know they have to score and there would never be a match in which both teams are simply waiting for penalties. Another advantage is that players who have missed would have a chance to redeem themselves in extra-time. The obvious flaw is that the team that wins the penalty shootout would be inclined to play defensively in extra time in the knowledge that a draw would put them through. However, the advantage of the advantage is that for a team that would risk that the one goal is the difference between winning and losing. As opposed to a team which defends a single goal lead whereby a conceeded goal is the difference between winning a drawing.

Attacker Defender Goalkeeper (ADG) is an alternative developed by Timothy Farrell. ADG features a series of ten contests in which an attacker has thirty seconds to score a goal against a defender and goalkeeper. At the completion of the ten contests, the team with the most goals is the winner.
 
I thought you were going to suggest something like having the first and second halves being nominated as home and away legs to allow away goals to be used to mimic two legs. Although this is also unfair as generally more goals are scored in the second half so whoever was "away" in the second half would have an advantage.

The idea of deciding a game based on corners doesn't sound appealing as it isn't necessarily true that the most offensive team ends up with the most corners and a team that likes to play down the wings would probably be at an advantage due to crosses being knocked behind. Its also not a very intuitive idea either as teams don't play to win corners (individuals might in certain circumstances) and you might end up with the following scenario:

Its the final minute of the game with the score level and number of corners also level, the striker gets into the box with the ball and could try and pull it back to his team mate who might score or he can kick it against the leg of the defender who has already committed to a lunge and get a corner that will win them the match.

Essentially I would rather keep penalties as yes it can encourage more defensive play but for example it wasn't really the case with Euro 2008 as an example.
 
I sympathise with the frustration about penalties, but this wouldn't work either.

Would we have an official scoring of "penalty box corners" during the game ? If yes, then that will encourage one team just to hold out for the last 10 minutes, knowing they will win. If not, then you will finish the game without either team knowing the winner until a statistician's announcement is made from the sidelines. Both options are considerably worse than a penalty shoot-out.
 
Well thinking again about my idea, I don't believe it is that great because a secondary counting will necessarily alter the spirit of the game. Let's forget about it sorry for the bothering.

This being said, I still consider the first part of my opening post as valid: penalty shootouts affects the game in a bad way.

Warpus said:
How about this:

If the game is tied after 120 minutes, each team loses a player, every 5 minutes, until a goal is scored.
Maybe that kind of solution is probably better. But not after 120 minutes as I'm convinced no one would be able to run anymore at that stage. But I think you're right, a system in that spirit should be tried once.
 
I thought you were going to suggest something like having the first and second halves being nominated as home and away legs to allow away goals to be used to mimic two legs. Although this is also unfair as generally more goals are scored in the second half so whoever was "away" in the second half would have an advantage.

The idea of deciding a game based on corners doesn't sound appealing as it isn't necessarily true that the most offensive team ends up with the most corners and a team that likes to play down the wings would probably be at an advantage due to crosses being knocked behind. Its also not a very intuitive idea either as teams don't play to win corners (individuals might in certain circumstances) and you might end up with the following scenario:

Its the final minute of the game with the score level and number of corners also level, the striker gets into the box with the ball and could try and pull it back to his team mate who might score or he can kick it against the leg of the defender who has already committed to a lunge and get a corner that will win them the match.

Essentially I would rather keep penalties as yes it can encourage more defensive play but for example it wasn't really the case with Euro 2008 as an example.

Totally agree with this.
 
Just because you suck on penalties is not a reason for demanding a change.
 
Penalties are the fairest way to decide a drawn match after 120 minutes.

Anyway, if you're constantly playing to 120 minutes for penalties, you're going to be more fatigued in the later matches than a team that is consistently getting results in 90 minutes. It's fine the way it is.
 
Just because you suck on penalties is not a reason for demanding a change.

a huge +1

The suggestions you made in this thread seem like a desperate attempt from a penalty loosing country.

Just remember before they introduced the penalty shootout the winner was decided by a single coin flip. The shootout is pretty fair in comparison to that.
 
Penalties are GREEEEEEAT!!! The team with the nerve and the superior ability to place a dead ball past the efforts of a determined keeper into the net wins. What's not fair about it?
 
The best argument is favour of retaining the penalty shoot-out is that England invariably lose at it.

What's not to like ?
 
What's not fair about it?

Well, the rules on keepers moving forward are rarely enforced consistently, and there has been some awful gamesmanship over the years which can leave a bad taste in the mouth. If we have consistent application of the rules, then the penalty shoot-out is still a better approach than any other I've heard considered.
 
How about this:

If the game is tied after 120 minutes, each team loses a player, every 5 minutes, until a goal is scored.

This.

Or this variant on the penalty shootout. One-on-one, best of five, but kick-off from halfway, with a minute to score. If the keeper gains possession, or if the ball goes dead, the attacker fails. Or alternatively, two-on-two.
 
Put the managers in goal.
 
a huge +1

The suggestions you made in this thread seem like a desperate attempt from a penalty loosing country.

Just remember before they introduced the penalty shootout the winner was decided by a single coin flip. The shootout is pretty fair in comparison to that.
Actually, France became world champion in 1998 after reaching semi-finals thanks to penalty shootouts in quarters... so your argument fails.

No, the reason why I've started this thread is simply that it doesn't make sense ! How shooting a serie of 5 penalties prove anything about the best team? It's just like flipping a coin.
 
I've thought about this some more. The point is that you don't want to introduce a new metric (IE. number of corners), because then teams would just try to exploit that metric instead of going for scoring more goals, which is what you want. So, IMO, if you're going to introduce such a rule to decide ties, it has to be based on goals scored. For example, the first team to score a goal in that match wins in case of a tie (that would even give more incentive to attack in the beginning of the game), or the last team to score (that is, the team that scores the equaliser) loses in case of a tie.
 
Basing who wins on the people with the most amount of corners is stupid. It seems a little random, and plus it penalises teams who play more defensively, and playing defensively should not necessarily be punished for being so.
 
Basing who wins on the people with the most amount of corners is stupid. It seems a little random, and plus it penalises teams who play more defensively, and playing defensively should not necessarily be punished for being so.

Quoted For Truth.

This way of deciding draws was used for a couple of seasons in Finland in the '70s or something like that, and it's not used today, so one can make a conclusion that it didn't work.
 
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