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Final Frontier: Problems & Issues (Post-3.13 Update Available)

Discussion in 'Civ4 BTS - Official Mods & Scenarios' started by Jon Shafer, Jul 31, 2007.

  1. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

    Jul 14, 2002
    Please post any problems or issues you've had with Final Frontier in this thread. Putting everything in one place will make it easier for me to fix things. Please be specific in your feedback (e.g. "the AI sucks" doesn't help me much).

    Thanks. :)


    Edit: Note that this update was made prior to the 3.17 patch coming out. All fixes available are now in the official game as a part of 3.17.

    Downloadable Post-3.13 Update (Old)

    If you guys want an updated version of the mod prior to the next patch with a few fixes, then you can download this version of CvFinalFrontierEvents, and extract this ZIP into your "Civ 4\Beyond the Sword\Mods\Final Frontier\Assets\Python" directory. Let me know if you have any problems. :)

    Doesn't include a whole lot, but here's a the things it does:

    - Fix for much stronger Pirate ships spawning early in the game than there should be
    - Older Starbases now have cultural border preference over newer ones as intended (thanks Nemesis Rex)
    - Double-Clicking now brings up uncolonized Star System info instead of single-clicking (thanks Nemesis Rex)
    - Fixed exploit where player would no longer get Star System info on a system that was colonized, but that player wasn't yet aware of it
    - Fix for bug where clicking the subtract population button too quickly in city screen could send a Planet's population into negative numbers
    - Red Syndicate only gets 1 free trade route instead of 2

    Things not in this update but will be in the patch:

    - Gold is now deducted when beginning Starbase construction instead of upon completion, to deal with some exploits
    - Halved amount of points gained from territory
    - Fixing bug in map script with star system density
    - Missiles generated by Starbases no longer automatically jump to nearest city

    File removed
  2. Putchuco

    Putchuco Addictionado

    Jul 31, 2006
    Good idea, let's even sticky this if possible and meaningful I would say.

    Here's something I posted on another thread here:

    Furthermore I haven't seen the AI using a well-balanced fleet comprising of Battleships, Cruiser, Destroyers and Carriers (...AND Stealth Ships!). It's mostly Battleships all by themselves or a few Destroyers. The game mechanics are there in terms of rock-paper-scissor, but unlike in the un-modded version, the AI doesn't seem to understand the concept. The damage one can do with bomber/fighter squadrons is quite high, and if that goes unused the AI stands no chance.

    Jump lanes become available quite quickly after the Warp Lanes, and I found myself very often in a position where it was MUCH more important to just get a connection between a Starbase and a system than to build it much slower with Jump Lanes. To only build it first with Warp Lanes I had to manually tell the construction ships to build each section explicitly with Warp Lanes only. If done with the 'goto/build-to' command, they automatically build Jump Lanes. I know this is similar to the un-modded version and how road are treated when railroads become available. But, again, HAVING a connection, no matter how fast you can travel on it is often much more important in FF.

    My 2c, and thanks for the attention to these issues.
  3. Kissamies

    Kissamies Prince

    Oct 20, 2005
    I've had an AI stealth ship attack me, but it uselessly attacked my system and got defeated instead of deviously disconnecting my jump lanes, like I did to AI later. The AI was quite helpless against that tactic.

    The constant stream of pirates is somewhat annoying. I guess they are so numerous because a lot of space will remain outside cultural borders and under fog of war. Much more spawning ground for them than in regular game for barbarians. I could reduce this by building many fighter squadrons to fogbust the trouble spots, but doing this manually every round is tedious. Another point for having auto-recon.

    I wouldn't mind 1 more movement point for ships all around to make moving them a bit less tedious, but that could make scouting too fast. How about making movement somehow faster when inside own or ally borders? That would help the pirate hunting a bit.
  4. InThane

    InThane Chieftain

    Dec 16, 2004
    I'd love to be able to queue across planets within a system.
  5. Taronas

    Taronas Chieftain

    Nov 10, 2002
    I played one game through and I like the space setting :)

    But I encountered a bug in the UI:

    when I have a stack of ships, some of them carriers carrying some missiles, I cannot easily select the whole stack.

    The usual methods like

    - double-click on the stack
    - ALT-Click on the stack

    do not select the ships but the missiles!

    The only way seems to be to SHIFT-Click all ships one by one. Something seems to be reversed here.

    Anybody else seeing this?
  6. J-S

    J-S Crusader

    Apr 4, 2002
    (edit: I just realized this is a bug thread only so i'll post this as a new thread)
    This is a great idea!
    Firstly tho, I wanna start by saying that I love this mod, it was actually the main excuse for getting BTS :goodjob:
    Now for the suggestions...

    Build queue: I like the idea of being able to build imps in each planet, but it just gets too tedious having to select planet, click the build checkbox, then building, wait till it's complete, zoom in colony and do it all over again.
    Instead, I thought of 2 things:
    1) there are buildings like the Factory that apply global bonuses, so instead of having to select on which planet they have to be built and build them one by one you could just stack as many factories in the build queue as planets are available to you in the system.
    2) Then there are buildings like the mining platform that apply bonuses only to the planet it's built on. For this you could be able to stack in the build queue as many of them as planets are available, and when they are finished have them placed automatically on the most populated planet that doesn't already have one (where the building will be more beneficial). In the case of the Habitation Dome, have them placed on the planet with highest :food: :hammers: :commerce:

    Starbases and Culture: I think the way starbase culture and normal culture borders interact needs work. For example, one of my starbases in my latest game ended up inside enemy territory because of his borders' expansion.
    I think a solution would be to have Starbases expand culture only 1 plot (instead of 2 plots) but that the borders around the starbase are unmodifiable by other player's cultural expansion, forcing them to eliminate the starbase (and declare war) if they want to gain control of that territory.

    Conquering systems: it would be cool IMHO that the only way to actually conquer an enemy system would be to drop troops in it, having spaceships be unable to attack troops or conquer systems (like the gunship in regular civ). Any spaceships that are in the system when troops conquer it are expelled from the tile.

    Conquering starbases: I thought it would be also nice to be able to drop troops into a starbase and conquer it, as an alternative to blowing it up. Starbases could house up to 2 troopers in case an enemy tries this. Any spaceships that are in the same tile as the starbase when troops take control of it are expelled from the tile.

    Each trooper could have a % chance of being shot down by starbase/system defenses before landing for combat.

    Starbase missiles: missiles should be able to rebase between starbases or not rebase at all. Also, starbases should have a maximum of missiles that they can carry.

    Other functionalities for Starbases: yeah, maybe they could start of as simple space platforms that spread culture in that one tile. Then with certain technologies they could be upgraded into millitary platforms (like the actual starbase) where you can build a squadron base (to house squadrons), a missile battery (that produces missiles), etc., or upgrade them into a research platform (creates a resource that gives +:science:) or vacation center (creates a resource that gives +:) ). So as to not unbalance things, bonus platforms could be very expensive to build (like starbases are now) and each type of bonus platform could serve as a resource, meaning that more than one does not give extra bonuses, but can be traded with other players.
    Also, you could have certain platforms only buildable on asteroid fields...

    Training yards: I just think training yards should give global bonuses to the system, only 1 per system, instead of 1 per planet like it is now.

    Exploring systems: it would be nice to be able to view a system's planets before colonizing.

    Civics: Monarchy should have it's bonuses, I think, reduced since this is usually a game with very very few systems in it.

    Resources: just add more! :p
  7. eoghammer

    eoghammer Chieftain

    Jul 18, 2007
    I didn't find any civic that allow to hurry a production with gold?
    Was it planned like this?

    There is also no spies so after having finishing the research, i was "forced" to raise "culture" because science wasn't anymore needed, credits wasn't required in huge amount to allow to hurry production in some system and EP wasn't spend in espionnage mission...
  8. MusX

    MusX Prince

    Apr 17, 2006
    here are my bug list for Final Frontier, bts v3.02:

    - there is option to hurry production via gold but there are no civic that allow hurry via gold :| shoudn't it be removed?

    - quantum control tech civilopedia's info is not correct i think, it leads to two identical techs (astral ascesion)

    - i was able to win multiple time in one game. quite strange:
    1) first i won domination victory (i got win screen, graph, hall of fame, message: MusX Wins a domination victory, etc...)
    2) second i won diplomacy (i didn't get any message about winning except results of voting)
    3) third i won by human ascendancy (i got win screen, graph, hall of fame, message MusX Wins a human ascendancy victory, etc...)
    if i'm not wrong, in normal c4/c4war i was able to win game only once

    - i got very high espionage, i'm able to view AI's city, i'm able to change planets which his city use, i even remove using of all planets so his city starving. next turn AI return this to normal, but overall i shoudn't been able to change this

    - there is a switch "permanent alliances" in pre-launch settings but there are no tech that allow player to have permanent alliances :| at least Galactic Diplomacy should give access to perm alliances, or just remove the switch

    - ai should be improved imo
    - tech cost should be very strongly increase, there are no chance to build so many building in many planets and also building good combinated army, generally I can handle to improve 1-2 planets per solar system, there is no time for more. at start of game is quite ok but later techs are to easy and you have no time to build building which they give
    - ai should not try to get all religions first, on higher difficuilt level (prince and up) you have no chance to get a religion, even with building research from start! ai should low his priority for religions as soon as he got one already
    - perm alliances, why not? you can play cooperative with your human friend against AIs
    - automation buttons in city (growth, hammers, research),I think it can be very hard to do
    - AI should learn some basic things, I'm killing his construction ship using Stealth Ship and he bring next construction ship without any security and I'm killing his construction ship again
    - great general new graphic :p

    best mod from BTS, great job Jon Shafer :goodjob: :goodjob: :goodjob:
  9. YS1

    YS1 Chieftain

    Apr 9, 2006
    France, European Union
    I repost here the "Game hangs during initialization" bug already mentionned there. Steps to reproduce (works each time on my computer) :
    1. Load the Final Frontier mod
    2. Select Solo, Custom game (Partie personnalisée in French)
    3. Modify at least one team assignment so that there is at least one two-player team.
    Result : the game does not go past initialization. However, setting up a custom game without a two-player (AI or human players) team seems not to trigger this bug. I tried
    • checking the "No barbarians" options
    • closing a player slot (10 civilizations instead of 11 on the map)
    • switching team assignments (player in slot 10 being team 11 and player in slot 11 being team 10)
    In all of these cases, the game successfully initialized.

    When this bug is triggered, the game "hangs" on the initialization screen, the progress bar remaining at the first stage (labeled "Initialisation" in French). The system monitor shows a >90% processor usage for BtS process (even after several minutes), but the memory usage remains stable.

    When this bug is triggered while in full screen mode, I am not able to minimize BtS window, and the system monitor window appears under BtS window, if it appears at all (I have to reset my computer).

    While in windowed mode, the system monitor window appears above the BtS window. Also, if I move the mouse cursor above BtS window's minimize-maximize-close buttons, they do not respond to click and do not even get highlighted.

    In every case, the music still plays fine.
  10. LlamaCat

    LlamaCat Emperor

    Dec 29, 2005
    The tile grid does not appear most of the game even with the button selected. I really need this to see what square my ships are sitting in because the space background blends together more than regular Earth terrain.

    Thanks! best mod in the history of mods...
  11. Will9

    Will9 Prince

    Apr 1, 2007
  12. Jon Shafer

    Jon Shafer Civilization 5 Designer

    Jul 14, 2002
    Thanks in advance for everyone's feedback and reports. I won't be able to respond to everyone but I'll try to make as many improvements to the next version as possible. :) I've already addressed a number of things that have been discovered and should hopefully take care of just about all the bugs for the next patch.

  13. Kranden

    Kranden War is the real diplomacy

    Jul 18, 2007
    why remove the great generals? I kinda like the idea of a star fleet captain on one of my capital ships. I have an Idea though. Each player starts the game with one fleet captain and he works like a regular warlord. However if he is killed in battle he can be ransomed by the enemy for money based on his level of experience. If you don't pay the ransom he will die and you will get a new one in 50 turns starting over at lvl 1

    One thing I would like to see is more civs available, Playing with only the max number doesn't feel epic enough and Its too weird having copies of the same civ.

    Building for each individual planet gets a bit tedious, perhaps instead increase the time per building based on the number of planets and apply the effect to all of them. Id like to see great people put into effect in the mod as well.

    This is the best mod that came with BTS and Great job on all the work you did.
  14. flamingzaroc121

    flamingzaroc121 Emperor

    Jul 7, 2006
    this maybe a complete n00b question, but how do u access the tutiroial (sp)
  15. mustafathered

    mustafathered Warlord

    Jan 1, 2006
    Thanks for this mod. I really enjoy it. Could you please include an expansion to this mod in the next Civ 4 expansion?

    Hmmm, maybe that's a bit too forward looking at this time. :p
  16. J-S

    J-S Crusader

    Apr 4, 2002
    look for it in Options, I beleive there should be a checkbox somewhere in there that reads "Show Tutorial" or something like that ;)
  17. Ricci

    Ricci Prince

    Jun 17, 2007
    I am certainly surprised nobody posted this calamity, i begin to feel i might be skipping something. When you play with more civs than the 8 default they of course repeat, well it's ok for a tremendous scenario like this, but when these repeated civs are refered to in the diplomacy screen you just can't tell which is which, as you only have the name to go. Same thing hapens in the core game with colonies, being there two american civilizations or two french, etc.
    I liked the scenarios very much (the ones i managed to see), creative and extensive work has been done.
  18. Kranden

    Kranden War is the real diplomacy

    Jul 18, 2007
    One thing i have noticed is that enemies tend to build alot of Anti-ship Missiles but don't really use them. I just lost 2 worlds to an advancing fleet of 20 Omega Capital ships about 10 random smaller ships with 20 of his missiles following his fleet. On the third world one more before my main I was able to fight him off and destroy 90% of his fleet with my own missiles Bombers and medium ships plus 4 or so capital ships only 2 which were omega. If he had used his missiles agaisnt my fleet I would have been destroyed. On Monarch difficulty BTW.

    Also Scouts on automated somtimes fly themselves into black holes and super novas lol! "Pilot!: OMG whats that big swirly thing thats sucking in all the light? Lets fly into it and find out!"
  19. Gatsby

    Gatsby King

    Jun 25, 2004
    I have CTD problems with a couple of the leaders (sorry I can't recall which ones) -whenever I meet them in-game or select them on the menu screen the game crashes to the desktop. Will this patch fix this problem?
  20. ZB2

    ZB2 New wave Ideology

    Aug 1, 2006
    the mod is much better than i had thought. the 'what happened to earth' had me thinking its a scenario with earth that must be found etc.. nice use of X and Y wrapping. any chance of a map script that can turn it off though?

    the [regular] Scout i think should have 2 movement, i have little incentive to build it due to its low movement.

    I think the build cost of Human Ascendency should be increased, as well as the United Planets wonder. Just ever so slightly for the latter.


    your going to remove the Great General? noooo :(

    about the Experience and Great Generals a star system with 6 planets (never started on a system with 7 or mythical 8) can build 28xp ships. with the Brotherhood (charistmatic) leader, combine the 28xp with a great general (48xp) you need fight one more battle for 49xp and its 7 promotions available :D

    the ultimate unit :)

    The um.. making a second building in the same system costs more than the orrigonal, and continues to increase in costs as how many you have built in the system so far... its really damned my quest for the ultimate military is destroyed by a 30 turn wait for the last +2 building haha

    Ai is crazy in building starbases to gobble up resources

    only bugs ive found are ones you listed in post 1.

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