First Look: Scythia

[MAHRana]

I don't mind the inclusion of the Scythians--an interesting people, though we don't have a lot of good information about them. But I find it curious that, just like Civ V's Huns, other than some early conquering advantages the Scythians are going to play just like a normal, settled civ. The Scythians, obviously, were nomads who never built cities. Here's Herodotus talking about that:



In Civ VI, the Scythians are going to build cities and districts and so forth exactly like everyone else, just with a sprinkling of extra horse units. Maybe that's a good thing. Maybe any attempt to capture their nomadic lifestyle in gameplay would just be incompatible with Civ. But I'm surprised the developers didn't try to make that work, with some sort of mechanic that let them move cities around and live off the land, or something like that. That could have been very interesting.

Yeah what i was trying to say, im hoping for it with the Mongols, they did something different with Venice in Civ V but hopefully they go hardcore for the Mongols

 

[Josephias]

I was noticing that too. Hope it's temporary while they move toward a final build. Compared to Cleo, Vicky, and Cathy she looks kind of robotic. But maybe they just haven't "rounded off" the animations yet (is that thing)?

I also noticed part of the animation is not as fluid as in previous leaders, and I think it is both due to there are some glitches to polish in the animation, and that they have given Tamrys a more martial stance than other leaders, so some of her movements are more brusque. When se switches to "peaceful mode", we se soft movements (altough maybe not as bombastic as in other leaders, too).

 

[blackcatatonic]

She is like ghenghis khan in civ 5. If you actually stay friendlly with ghenghis he will NOT BACKSTAB YOU he has a high loyalty rating.

However if you cross his path he will dow or if he decides your land is his youre screwed by forward settling him or starting next to him.

never had problems with khan most loyal leader in civ 5 however likes to warmonger result everyone hates him especially if he kills city states

Sounds good to me. Genghis is one of my most reliable BFFs*

* until he starts getting his Keshik on with my city states

 

[leif erikson]

Moderator Action: Thread closed for review by Staff.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[leif erikson]

Moderator Action: This thread is now open for discussion of the inclusion of Sythia in Civ6 and how they affect game play. Please do not stray into discussion of Mongols again.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Deggial]

Regarding Scythia's unit spam: The standard horsemen will be online fast, this is true. But their numbers will be limited by the availability of horses just as for all other civs.
The Saka horse archers won't be limited in the same way, but I am wondering about their upgrade path. Will they have one at all? If they are a dead end, the Scythians will have a huge unit advantage early in the game that will not translate into the next aera.

I am not saying that the UU is useless at all, as early advantages tend to snowball. But maybe the ability to produce two units at once is more balanced than it seems at the first look.

 

[stealth_nsk]

Regarding Scythia's unit spam: The standard horsemen will be online fast, this is true. But their numbers will be limited by the availability of horses just as for all other civs.
The Saka horse archers won't be limited in the same way, but I am wondering about their upgrade path. Will they have one at all? If they are a dead end, the Scythians will have a huge unit advantage early in the game that will not translate into the next aera.

I am not saying that the UU is useless at all, as early advantages tend to snowball. But maybe the ability to produce two units at once is more balanced than it seems at the first look.

Yes, it's great point. Most logically it upgrades to Knights, but in any case Horses are their limit. So, the Scythians are still mostly early-game power.

Also, we don't know how promotions are carried from ranged to melee units on upgrade - it was a huge issue in Civ5. Well, we don't know how promotions are carried on upgrade even within the same unit class, to be honest.

 

[nunor]

I don't know if anyone mentioned it already, but finally a decent background picture.

 

[TeraHammer]

I worry for multiplayer balance, in particular with Scythia.

There is so much focus on nation's unique traits that it gives era bound specific imba bonusses.

Scythia looks like a powerhouse early, but if you start a renaissance game, she completely falls off. With a warmongering late-civ it will be the opposite.

I miss civ4 where traits were effective in any era, making you play fine with random civs on any map. Now (maybe since civ5) civ bonusses appear to be way more era-bound. I fear, depending on the multiplayer settings, games to see the same civs all the time, or banning imba civs for the applicable era.

 

[stealth_nsk]

I miss civ4 where traits were effective in any era, making you play fine with random civs on any map.

And thus being totally boring. You have to sacrifice balance on weird setups if you want to make interesting and unique civs.

 

[moysturfurmer]

I worry for multiplayer balance, in particular with Scythia.

There is so much focus on nation's unique traits that it gives era bound specific imba bonusses.

Scythia looks like a powerhouse early, but if you start a renaissance game, she completely falls off. With a warmongering late-civ it will be the opposite.

I miss civ4 where traits were effective in any era, making you play fine with random civs on any map. Now (maybe since civ5) civ bonusses appear to be way more era-bound. I fear, depending on the multiplayer settings, games to see the same civs all the time, or banning imba civs for the applicable era.

Scythia can still squirt out faith super easy. Also bonus against wounded & healing per turn. Civ4 traits can fly a kite.

 

[Xen]

Yeah, I think Skythia is going to rock.

 

[Nightsong]

I'm personally planning on playing Scythia as an early warmonger with the goal of pumping out faith while warring with neighbors to prevent them from getting faith going. Then later down the road try for a religious victory through the religious combat system that Civ VI is looking to include. If all else fails I can always fall back on the warmongering path and just nuke my enemies.

 

[masda_gib]

I am wondering how horse resources will be handled with Scythias unique trait of getting two units when building one.
Horsemen cost 2 horse afaik. When scythia builds a horseman does it require:
1) 2 horses to build but then uses 4 when the unit is there (possibly getting missing resource malus),
2) 2 horses to build and use only 2 horses for 2 units (so one unit is resource free),
3) 4 horses to build and use 4 horses while the units are there?

If 3) then scythia can't buil a horseman if they have say 3 horses. 8)

 

[stealth_nsk]

I am wondering how horse resources will be handled with Scythias unique trait of getting two units when building one.
Horsemen cost 2 horse afaik. When scythia builds a horseman does it require:
1) 2 horses to build but then uses 4 when the unit is there (possibly getting missing resource malus),
2) 2 horses to build and use only 2 horses for 2 units (so one unit is resource free),
3) 4 horses to build and use 4 horses while the units are there?

If 3) then scythia can't buil a horseman if they have say 3 horses. 8)

Most logical solution will be for each Horseman to eat 1 Horse. If you have only one Horse available, the Twin isn't born.

But of course we don't have the info yet.

 

[CaiusDrewart]

The Scythians did have some cities and settlements. The fact that they exported 63,000 tons of grain per year to Athens in the 5th century BC indicates that they were somewhat settled. They weren't strictly nomadic.

While it may be correct to say that the Scythians weren't 100% nomadic, and practiced agriculture and formed settlements to some degree, I don't think this statistic about the sale of grain is evidence for that. We only know this because of a remark in a speech of Demosthenes, and he merely says that Athens imports the grain from "the Bosporus"--an area where Greeks (who influenced and were influenced by Scythians) had long lived. There's no reason to think Demosthenes was talking about the Scythians.

 

[stealth_nsk]

While it may be correct to say that the Scythians weren't 100% nomadic, and practiced agriculture and formed settlements to some degree, I don't think this statistic about the sale of grain is evidence for that. We only know this because of a remark in a speech of Demosthenes, and he merely says that Athens imports the grain from "the Bosporus"--an area where Greeks (who influenced and were influenced by Scythians) had long lived. There's no reason to think Demosthenes was talking about the Scythians.

Scythians built cities. We know about Scythian Neapolis, for example, it was quite large.

 

[CaiusDrewart]

Scythians built cities. We know about Scythian Neapolis, for example, it was quite large.

Yes, in areas where they were living around, heavily influenced by, and quite possibly intermingling with Greeks (note e.g. the Greek architecture within the site you mention)

 

[DCParry]

As for the pronunciation question asked earlier, Scythia, like most words first attested in Greek, actually comes into English through Latin (which is evidenced by the common use of the c as opposed to k). The differences in pronunciation (Skythia vs. Sithya)is due to British vs. English conventions. British conventions almost always treat c in Latinate terms as soft, so we say Caesar and not Kaesar (although all c's in Latin were actually hard). For the most part this makes not a lot of difference because American English follows a lot of the traditional pronunciations, but deviates (a Brit says Sipio, which a Yank says Scipio).

So, that is why you sometimes get the soft c and the hard c in Scythia. Either is correct enough.

 

[Krajzen]

I worry for multiplayer balance, in particular with Scythia.

There is so much focus on nation's unique traits that it gives era bound specific imba bonusses.

Scythia looks like a powerhouse early, but if you start a renaissance game, she completely falls off. With a warmongering late-civ it will be the opposite.

I miss civ4 where traits were effective in any era, making you play fine with random civs on any map. Now (maybe since civ5) civ bonusses appear to be way more era-bound. I fear, depending on the multiplayer settings, games to see the same civs all the time, or banning imba civs for the applicable era.

In renaissance Scythia is still going to have bonus damage and auto healing for armies, being automatically better on the battlefield, plus religious advantage.