Friday's PAX talk (with overview)

[Carl5872]

Well, it can be very useful for reaching some resources that are on the other side of a mountain, the problem of a mountain biased civ like the Incas. As you said, the Andes!

Also imagine if there were one hill entirely surrounded by mountains... send a worker to build a terrace on that and get a ton of food.

 

[Carl5872]

Unremembered? The Ostrogoths?
There's also the Vandals, where we get the modern words vandal and vandalism.
Also, not everyone agrees that outside force was the death blow of the empire.

All this being said, while I'm indifferent to the Huns, they strike me as essentially what the Barbarians are supposed to represent - a destructive force that comes in and destroys a civilization.

Thanks for correcting me. Guess I shouldn't be throwing rocks out of my glass house. The Goths were a significant civilization as well.

I agree with you that Rome was already in decline, and internal corruption and decadence were significant factors to the fall of Rome, but I also still believe Attila did contribute significantly to the fall of Rome. Maybe its just I have a tremendous respect for Attila as a leader, not for the Huns as a civilization. Part of that is because he started with basically nothing, and untied the warriors of the steppe to span a large amount of territory and challenged the superpower of his time. I also consider that the other great leaders of other civilizations inherited great empires to begin with, and after many of their deaths/retirements, the empire marched on fine without them. After Attila died the Huns collapsed almost immediately. I know the very label "Hun Empire" may make some people laugh as there is no lasting cities wonders or culture, and maybe Empire or civilization is an improper term for the group known as Huns. Whatever you want to label it though, Attila WAS the Huns.

 

[Louis XXIV]

I also have problems with personal empires being represented. For me, whatever debate there is about the definition of a civ, something that solely exists through the force of will of one person shouldn't count. Like I said, beef up the barbarians and give them names like "Huns." It would make more sense.

I do think they'll be fun to play, mind you, I'm just saying they are literally what the barbarians were originally supposed to represent.