FTS-02 The Immortal One
- Thread starter Conroe
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mike p
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- Mar 2, 2005
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Looks like no one wanted to swap.
Pretty lackluster turns. We finished researching Artillery. I upgraded a catapult, but didn't want to blow through all of our cash so if we need more, just upgrade them.
Before that, we built a few catapults.
Our grenadier got to Greece, and lost at 71% against a longbowman on a hill. Which is good because our maceman was able to come in and clean up the mess to get to 10 xp. I made peace with Alex for 10 gold to make sure he didn't kill off the exposed maceman, and promoted him to lvl 4 next turn, which let us begin the Herioc Epic.
Hatty doesn't need our copper anymore, so I traded it to Saladin for horses, forgeting that we can't build knights without Iron and don't have military tradition.
It really sucks that Isabella and Alex both have surplus Iron, but neither one likes us much.
I was eight turns in before I realized we had a great engineer asleep. When I'm turning a save over and we have a specialist that might need to used right away, I always try to unfortify him so that the next player can't forget about him.
Research wise, we're 4 turns from Medicine, a hospital, and the Red Cross. Not sure if it's worth going to Environmentalism for another 6 health, since it will cost us about 32 beakers per turn. (7 commerce from the bonus trade route from Free Markets times the Bureaucracy bonus times our research bonuses.)
Pretty lackluster turns. We finished researching Artillery. I upgraded a catapult, but didn't want to blow through all of our cash so if we need more, just upgrade them.
Before that, we built a few catapults.
Our grenadier got to Greece, and lost at 71% against a longbowman on a hill. Which is good because our maceman was able to come in and clean up the mess to get to 10 xp. I made peace with Alex for 10 gold to make sure he didn't kill off the exposed maceman, and promoted him to lvl 4 next turn, which let us begin the Herioc Epic.
Hatty doesn't need our copper anymore, so I traded it to Saladin for horses, forgeting that we can't build knights without Iron and don't have military tradition.
It really sucks that Isabella and Alex both have surplus Iron, but neither one likes us much.
I was eight turns in before I realized we had a great engineer asleep. When I'm turning a save over and we have a specialist that might need to used right away, I always try to unfortify him so that the next player can't forget about him.
Research wise, we're 4 turns from Medicine, a hospital, and the Red Cross. Not sure if it's worth going to Environmentalism for another 6 health, since it will cost us about 32 beakers per turn. (7 commerce from the bonus trade route from Free Markets times the Bureaucracy bonus times our research bonuses.)
Attachments
IHT: Change working a coastal tile to working a lumbermill and change a scientist to work the copper mine. This reduces the HE to 2 turns, while still getting a great person in 1 turn. I cancel the copper for horses deal with saladin.
T1: We get a great artist in Berlin (15% chance). I merge him for the 3 gold and 3 beakers per turn.
T2: FDR asks us to cancel deals with french. No. Now Napoleon wants us to cancel deals with FDR. No. Heroic Epic completes, start an artillery.
T3: Artillery -> Artillery. Napoleon and Roosevelt sign a peace treaty. FDR is cautious and WFYHBTA. Sell Guilds to Isabella for 560 gold.
T4: Medicine comes in. I trade for steam power from Saladin. Don't particularly like this deal, but FDR is catching Saladin up in tech so he's not so much a runaway.
We have no coal dammit. Start Assembly line (for factory and pentagon). Maybe should have been railroad->combustion, but I think the AIs normally go for railroad before assembly line so we will hopefully be able to trade for it. Saladin has it but he wants artillery and medicine for it. I don't think so buddy.
T5: Alex asks us to cancel deals with Saladin. No. Artillery -> Hospital.
T7: Isabella starts a golden age.
T8: Hospital completes. Red Cross seems a lot of hammers and we want to strike with artillery before the AIs get infantry so I start another artillery now.
T10: Artillery -> Artillery.
Oh dear, I notice this:
I guess we won't be attacking Saladin any time soon. Once Hatty gets MT we might want to sign a DP with her. We are at an important stage of the game. I am in favour of declaring war on FDR in the next turnset. If we raze his 3 border cities quickly our culture will envelop them and he can't resettle. That will certainly set his tech and production rate back, hopefully knocking him out of the space race. FDR is relatively peaceful and these AIs tend to stay in their cities and not counterattack so much. I'm sure Napoleon will help us in the war once their peace treaty runs out (3rd turn into next set). We could do with him getting Paris and Chatres back. Saladin will have to wait.
Here's the tech screen:
Saladin is probably researching democracy right now.
And our city:
T1: We get a great artist in Berlin (15% chance). I merge him for the 3 gold and 3 beakers per turn.
T2: FDR asks us to cancel deals with french. No. Now Napoleon wants us to cancel deals with FDR. No. Heroic Epic completes, start an artillery.
T3: Artillery -> Artillery. Napoleon and Roosevelt sign a peace treaty. FDR is cautious and WFYHBTA. Sell Guilds to Isabella for 560 gold.
T4: Medicine comes in. I trade for steam power from Saladin. Don't particularly like this deal, but FDR is catching Saladin up in tech so he's not so much a runaway.
We have no coal dammit. Start Assembly line (for factory and pentagon). Maybe should have been railroad->combustion, but I think the AIs normally go for railroad before assembly line so we will hopefully be able to trade for it. Saladin has it but he wants artillery and medicine for it. I don't think so buddy.
T5: Alex asks us to cancel deals with Saladin. No. Artillery -> Hospital.
T7: Isabella starts a golden age.
T8: Hospital completes. Red Cross seems a lot of hammers and we want to strike with artillery before the AIs get infantry so I start another artillery now.
T10: Artillery -> Artillery.
Oh dear, I notice this:
I guess we won't be attacking Saladin any time soon. Once Hatty gets MT we might want to sign a DP with her. We are at an important stage of the game. I am in favour of declaring war on FDR in the next turnset. If we raze his 3 border cities quickly our culture will envelop them and he can't resettle. That will certainly set his tech and production rate back, hopefully knocking him out of the space race. FDR is relatively peaceful and these AIs tend to stay in their cities and not counterattack so much. I'm sure Napoleon will help us in the war once their peace treaty runs out (3rd turn into next set). We could do with him getting Paris and Chatres back. Saladin will have to wait.
Here's the tech screen:
Saladin is probably researching democracy right now.
And our city:
mike p
King
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- Mar 2, 2005
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- 705
If there are any possibilities of getting Hatty to Declare on Napoleon or vice versa we should consider it. It will drag Saladin into the war and cancel his defensive pacts. Likewise if we can get FDR into war with Hatty or Napoleon.
Red Cross won't help with artillery anyway so if we're going for an artillery rush, then let's keep pumping out units. It would be nice to get the Red Cross done before assembly line, but it's not our highest priority.
Red Cross won't help with artillery anyway so if we're going for an artillery rush, then let's keep pumping out units. It would be nice to get the Red Cross done before assembly line, but it's not our highest priority.
I suggest you build artillery. What do others think about the next war? Mike brings up the excellent point that we can cancel all of Saladin's DPs by bribing Hatty and Napoleon to fight each other. They're bound to dislike each other having fought earlier in the game. If we can do this then we may want to take out Saladin before FDR. Saladin is the main threat in this game, and this is the only time when we will be militarity superior. However, the main downside to this is that Saladin's main cities are a long way away and we don't have a navy.
Hmm ... actually FDR looks a better target right now, at least until we get combustion and a decent navy. With enough artillery we can go on amphibious razing sprees against the arabians, this will work even if they have infantry.
BTW, we have enough gold to upgrade our cats to Arti, but not enough to upgrade all our muskets to rifles. We'll need a few rifles to defend against cavs, of which Washington has many. The cats we don't upgrade can be used for bombarding.
Hmm ... actually FDR looks a better target right now, at least until we get combustion and a decent navy. With enough artillery we can go on amphibious razing sprees against the arabians, this will work even if they have infantry.
BTW, we have enough gold to upgrade our cats to Arti, but not enough to upgrade all our muskets to rifles. We'll need a few rifles to defend against cavs, of which Washington has many. The cats we don't upgrade can be used for bombarding.
i will only post a brief summary as i dont hav long
ok quite an uneventful turnset we built one mre artiller hermitage nd ironworks plus i changed 2 environmentlism as we cud then build the ironworks nd grow i also discovered military tradition nd assembly line
ok quite an uneventful turnset we built one mre artiller hermitage nd ironworks plus i changed 2 environmentlism as we cud then build the ironworks nd grow i also discovered military tradition nd assembly line
Got it.
My initial thoughts, without looking at the save yet, is that since we have Assembly Line now is to start building the Pentagon. However, that may not be practical if we are about to go to war with FDR and we've only built 1 arty.
@adamlan: If you have a free moment, could you post a more detailed report? There are a couple of points that are not clear for me.
My initial thoughts, without looking at the save yet, is that since we have Assembly Line now is to start building the Pentagon. However, that may not be practical if we are about to go to war with FDR and we've only built 1 arty.
@adamlan: If you have a free moment, could you post a more detailed report? There are a couple of points that are not clear for me.
A few points:
(1) Ironworks is useless as we have neither iron or coal. +0% production for 700 hammers? Yes it lets us employ engineers but it adds +2 unhealthiness.
(2) Environmentalism when we were only at -1 health deficit? You think the anarchy and loss of a trade route was worth it? Oh I see, you were planning to build ironworks.
(3) We are building Wall Street which is rather poor while running 100% science. Yes it helps specialist and trade route income, but hardly justifies the cost of 600 hammers when we are building up for war.
(4) We built hermitage when there's no chance of flipping the american cities. The next border pop is at legendary culture - not going to happen before the game finishes even with hermitage. Furthermore, if we had built more artillery instead we could have razed the cities by now.
(1) Ironworks is useless as we have neither iron or coal. +0% production for 700 hammers? Yes it lets us employ engineers but it adds +2 unhealthiness.
(2) Environmentalism when we were only at -1 health deficit? You think the anarchy and loss of a trade route was worth it? Oh I see, you were planning to build ironworks.
(3) We are building Wall Street which is rather poor while running 100% science. Yes it helps specialist and trade route income, but hardly justifies the cost of 600 hammers when we are building up for war.
(4) We built hermitage when there's no chance of flipping the american cities. The next border pop is at legendary culture - not going to happen before the game finishes even with hermitage. Furthermore, if we had built more artillery instead we could have razed the cities by now.
mike p
King
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- Mar 2, 2005
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I agree with soooo.
We really need to get everyone on the same page here going forward. It sounds like from that turnset we built two and a half fairly useless National Wonders and researched Military Tradition, without even having horses for cavalry.
I don't want to sound too harsh here, but if you don't have time write up more than a line and a half of turn summaries, or think through what you're doing, you probably should have asked for a skip. I don't mind it if people make mistakes or try something bold and fail (I do both quite frequently, after all!) but from your very sparse report, it seems like an almost totally wasted turnset. We can't go slack on Immortal!
We really need to get everyone on the same page here going forward. It sounds like from that turnset we built two and a half fairly useless National Wonders and researched Military Tradition, without even having horses for cavalry.
I don't want to sound too harsh here, but if you don't have time write up more than a line and a half of turn summaries, or think through what you're doing, you probably should have asked for a skip. I don't mind it if people make mistakes or try something bold and fail (I do both quite frequently, after all!) but from your very sparse report, it seems like an almost totally wasted turnset. We can't go slack on Immortal!
Well, I've had a chance to look at the save. The earlier suggestion of getting Hatty, Napoleon, or Roosevelt into a war isn't going to be possible. We still have the option of declaring on Roosevelt; however, he has 3 fully loaded Transports stationed in Philadelphia.
I think we have enough troops to take out Philly, but it will take most of our entire army to do so. I'm pretty certain FDR has some Cavalry stationed at Harappan. My guess is they will be sent charging in for some major pillaging. However, if we are able to capture some Workers, we should be able to quickly rebuild.
I'm thinking the plan should be to turn research off for a couple of turns. Then spend 2 or 3 turns upgrading everything to Artillery / Infantry and get our forces into position. In my 10 turns, I should be able to raze both Philly and Harappan, leaving Atlanta for the next person.
We are 3 turns from completing Communism. I don't think we really need this tech right now. I guess the Kremlin would be nice, but we'd have to give up Representation. I'm thinking of switching to Electricity, which leaves the door open for either Industrialism or Computers next.
I'm also thinking of switching our production over to the Pentagon. I'd really like to have that 2nd promotion on new units. It will take 15 turns to build, though. If we keep the war with FDR short, though, we may not need any more troops right away. says crossing fingers
That's the plan, anyway. Thoughts? Suggestions? Comments?
I think we have enough troops to take out Philly, but it will take most of our entire army to do so. I'm pretty certain FDR has some Cavalry stationed at Harappan. My guess is they will be sent charging in for some major pillaging. However, if we are able to capture some Workers, we should be able to quickly rebuild.
I'm thinking the plan should be to turn research off for a couple of turns. Then spend 2 or 3 turns upgrading everything to Artillery / Infantry and get our forces into position. In my 10 turns, I should be able to raze both Philly and Harappan, leaving Atlanta for the next person.
We are 3 turns from completing Communism. I don't think we really need this tech right now. I guess the Kremlin would be nice, but we'd have to give up Representation. I'm thinking of switching to Electricity, which leaves the door open for either Industrialism or Computers next.
I'm also thinking of switching our production over to the Pentagon. I'd really like to have that 2nd promotion on new units. It will take 15 turns to build, though. If we keep the war with FDR short, though, we may not need any more troops right away. says crossing fingers
That's the plan, anyway. Thoughts? Suggestions? Comments?
Saladin has come to me asking for a Permanent Alliance. This is a pretty big decision that I think we should make as a team.
I've played 5 turns. We are currently at war with FDR. Things have gone our way for the moment. I'm running out of healthy troops, but it isn't anything our Medic (yes, we finally have one!) can't handle.
Saladin is by far the power leader. We have done pretty good, tech-wise, on our own, thus far. We have 2 monopoly techs: Assembly Line and Medicine. Saladin has Rocketry and Railroad, and I would assume he also has Combustion.
Hatshepsut has surpassed Roosevelt as the GNP leader. This would be an issue under a PA, since our tech costs will increase something like 50%.
Please cast your vote! I'm leaning towards accepting the deal but I wouldn't mind getting a win on our own, as well. Because of the earlier well-timed world wars, we have done remarkably well at this level.
I've played 5 turns. We are currently at war with FDR. Things have gone our way for the moment. I'm running out of healthy troops, but it isn't anything our Medic (yes, we finally have one!) can't handle.
Saladin is by far the power leader. We have done pretty good, tech-wise, on our own, thus far. We have 2 monopoly techs: Assembly Line and Medicine. Saladin has Rocketry and Railroad, and I would assume he also has Combustion.
Hatshepsut has surpassed Roosevelt as the GNP leader. This would be an issue under a PA, since our tech costs will increase something like 50%.
Please cast your vote! I'm leaning towards accepting the deal but I wouldn't mind getting a win on our own, as well. Because of the earlier well-timed world wars, we have done remarkably well at this level.
I'm not sure how to save the game without answering the popup. And I'm concerned that the invitation may not be valid after closing the dialog box. From everything I know about PAs, we should not be able to sign with Saladin -- he is the power leader, we have no DP, nor are we currently fighting a common enemy.Methos said:@Conroe: Can you post the save, please? I'd like to look at things before voting. I can't remember who is who...
I'm planning on just leaving my computer powered up with the game running until we decide if we want this PA or not. And hopefully, I won't have a power failure in the meantime.
You might try downloading adamlan's save.
I won't have a chance to look at adaman's save, so I'll also lean towards accepting the deal.
Edit: Why is the most powerful AI asking us for a PA? Are we considered powerful? Or is it because of our advances?
Edit #2: I'm not with it today. Common sense says you couldn't upload a save.
Edit: Why is the most powerful AI asking us for a PA? Are we considered powerful? Or is it because of our advances?
Edit #2: I'm not with it today. Common sense says you couldn't upload a save.
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