G-Major 37

[TheMeInTeam]

I lost my autosave by accident when making a map for immortal U and play testing it, but I wasn't going to finish pre-1800s, so 1600 would be pretty good. My only submission so far is 1934, but I want to do some other gauntlets first now - I have a cheese idea or two for the gminor.

 

[oyzar]

Well as i said my game crashed twice so i won't be submitting. If 1600 AD is a good date or not that depends on the competivness of the competitors. In my game i had 13 cities when i got guilds in 290 AD. I started capturing the AI while the majority still didn't have feud in like 600 AD and with more and more capratches comming all the time i think i would have managed it before 1300 AD at least... I don't think any game where you don't warriorrush is going to be competitive. By turn 20 i had two cities(size 2 and 3), two workers and one of the cities a holy city(the other was on a stone plains hill so ready to build henge and mids). I oracled feud in my game in 640 AD or so... I built only warriors before 200 AD(i never researched hunting so could build them all the time) afterwards i built two chariots(to be upgraded with GG's) then just capratches.

 

[cabert]

In my best try (given up for lack of competitiveness) I got astro in 800 AD.
I guess there is no point in my strategy if you can just conquer the world before that...

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I'm seriously considering an approach where I speed oracle HBR and just spam keshiks. Probably use kublai...keep only very strong commerce cities, raze everything else, and then just settle spam backfill last second. Can it be done fast enough? You wouldn't even need guilds or the powerful cataphracts then, but you'd probably have to clear enough land for domination before 800 AD so that you don't run into anything too oppressive like maces or pikes, which would ruin keshiks' day. Prats could work but moving 1/2 the speed on quick would be painful. Numidians are a consideration too...weaker than keshiks but with a definite leader trait advantage, assuming one captures SH at some point.

 

[oyzar]

Certanly astro before 0 AD is possible... Read sgotm 6 for ideas on how to do it... warrior rush a capital or two, rex some more bulb your way to astro, oracle for col or machinery, bulb astro and/or optics rex the new continent in 1000 years or so, win...

 

[cabert]

Certanly astro before 0 AD is possible... Read sgotm 6 for ideas on how to do it... warrior rush a capital or two, rex some more bulb your way to astro, oracle for col or machinery, bulb astro and/or optics rex the new continent in 1000 years or so, win...

I oracled metal casting which is on the path to astro (while CoL isn't), I got pottery, writing (iron working too)from huts, have rexed energetically, but had bad luck getting 2 prophets instead of scientists. Quite some time lost

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I oracled metal casting which is on the path to astro (while CoL isn't), I got pottery, writing (iron working too)from huts, have rexed energetically, but had bad luck getting 2 prophets instead of scientists. Quite some time lost

I think CoL is to let you run tons of scientists off of caste.....

Edit: Again it may behoove a player going this route to actually delay doing this though, in order to secure sufficient land on his OWN continent so that domination is possible merely by settling the other. As optics can also be bulbed, Joao may have a large advantage here, as he could rip through about 10 % of his home continent, practically bottom out economically, bulb optics, and just SPAM SETTLERS AND CARRACKS. With barbs off, just spread them all over the place on the other continent and settled all cities the same turn. Probably lose everything to strike, but if you had henge you could probably get enough land......and HOPEFULLY pop .

 

[oyzar]

The idea is that caste + mids is basically the fastest way you can research at this point in the game... Without caste you just won't generate GS' fast enough(we did this mistake in sgotm 6). Settlers don't disband due to strike so might be possible to continue the settler spamming(on the new continent) with joao... I have a hard time seeing joao beating justian though...

 

[TheMeInTeam]

On terra he certainly would. You can wreck an AI or two with pretty much anything on prince - and that's AFTER the warrior rush. Now...is that faster than just speed conquesting? Dunno. Results will tell us.

 

[ParadigmShifter]

What about Napoleon with a gunpowder beeline? 2 move, 9 strength charismatic units?

I'll still try the Ottoman's though I think again, jans and then cuirassiers sounds good to me.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

What about Napoleon with a gunpowder beeline? 2 move, 9 strength charismatic units?

I'll still try the Ottoman's though I think again, jans and then cuirassiers sounds good to me.

I'd LOVE to see it work. The problem is even if you get it @ 1 AD with some magic bulbing and take it off lib, you still only have about 600-800 years (which isn't a lot of game turns) on quick before all the AIs have longbows, and some will have them before this. One can oracle HBR and have a similar time frame (or just use prats/IW)...which offer similar windows.

Still, had quickly enough it seems pretty strong. Jans in particular are enticing although do note that they suck against longbows until the culture D is off, and there's no easy way of doing that FAST unless you maybe make spies and sell out on tech for EP point investment.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

MUCH better. I managed a 1770 AD finish. I'm kind of frustrated with these settings, so that's that.

...Hmm. The entire game took less than 2 hours :/. Micro indeed ^_^.

 

[billybgame]

MUCH better. I managed a 1770 AD finish. I'm kind of frustrated with these settings, so that's that.

...Hmm. The entire game took less than 2 hours :/. Micro indeed ^_^.

Less than 2 hours for a 1770 AD, with a warmongering/domination game? You must share. Once I start this'll probably take me 20 hours.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Less than 2 hours for a 1770 AD, with a warmongering/domination game? You must share. Once I start this'll probably take me 20 hours.

Things I do that take experience to use properly but cut a lot (and I mean a LOT) of time:

- Automation of workers once key improvements are done and worker turns are less tight (in a game like this you steal so many just by attacking normally!). Early on turns are tight though so I had to micro them...especially on the earliest attack routes.
- In line with the above - using the governor button will affect what improvements workers make. You can actually specialize cities considerably with just automation. I know it isn't perfectly optimal, but I have patience limits, and with tons of workers it's not bad.
- City queuing and unit looping - this makes it so you don't have to get a popup, think about what to build every time, and figure out where that city was and what it was doing. Commerce cities get the commerce multipliers (and I pick the order but still order 5-6 buildings), production cities, on this map, get a forge, a barracks, a stable (using mounted), and them alt click on the unit to produce it indefinitely.
- Waypoints...A godsend. You don't have to touch units until they're all clumped somewhere. Eventually I was waging wars in 2 directions and waypointing troops to either side to save time.

On top of physical tools/tactics, there's a mental decision making process that varies from player to player. I'm on the fast end of the spectrum both here and in school, preferring not to delay decisions. Really though, on this type of format you want to win as fast as possible, and since I went the attack route the only decision was "who is it best to attack next?". Well, at first that would be civs without longbows. After everyone had those, I'd pick on nations that either couldn't make maces or knights yet, or were too small to mobilize meaningful resistance. Once I finally got some strong units myself (and tons of them!), I was able to steamroll the last civ or two and settle to fill in the cracks to nudge just barely over the threshold without having to take on the last 2 civs (master and vassal). Point is, a lot of decision making analysis can be done fast or slow too...and for each person their speed doing this depends on a lot of factors. If you do the above physical speed tips it should speed you up considerably though.

 

[billybgame]

Things I do that take experience to use properly but cut a lot (and I mean a LOT) of time:

- Automation of workers once key improvements are done and worker turns are less tight (in a game like this you steal so many just by attacking normally!). Early on turns are tight though so I had to micro them...especially on the earliest attack routes.
- In line with the above - using the governor button will affect what improvements workers make. You can actually specialize cities considerably with just automation. I know it isn't perfectly optimal, but I have patience limits, and with tons of workers it's not bad.
- City queuing and unit looping - this makes it so you don't have to get a popup, think about what to build every time, and figure out where that city was and what it was doing. Commerce cities get the commerce multipliers (and I pick the order but still order 5-6 buildings), production cities, on this map, get a forge, a barracks, a stable (using mounted), and them alt click on the unit to produce it indefinitely.
- Waypoints...A godsend. You don't have to touch units until they're all clumped somewhere. Eventually I was waging wars in 2 directions and waypointing troops to either side to save time.

On top of physical tools/tactics, there's a mental decision making process that varies from player to player. I'm on the fast end of the spectrum both here and in school, preferring not to delay decisions. Really though, on this type of format you want to win as fast as possible, and since I went the attack route the only decision was "who is it best to attack next?". Well, at first that would be civs without longbows. After everyone had those, I'd pick on nations that either couldn't make maces or knights yet, or were too small to mobilize meaningful resistance. Once I finally got some strong units myself (and tons of them!), I was able to steamroll the last civ or two and settle to fill in the cracks to nudge just barely over the threshold without having to take on the last 2 civs (master and vassal). Point is, a lot of decision making analysis can be done fast or slow too...and for each person their speed doing this depends on a lot of factors. If you do the above physical speed tips it should speed you up considerably though.

Yeah, I have to admit I NEVER use any automation or governors. The AI seems so stupid in many ways, I just don't trust it. For instance the Great People it chooses. And, taking production squares away leaving 1 food or stagnancy, for Great People. Instead of governors, I feel I need to hawk things all the time, just to make sure the AI's not screwing up my plans.

I wish I could get to the way you play, but not so far. Maybe I'll tinker with it some more, though.

 

[unclethrill]

I tried this last night on a 17 civ Pangaea as Lizzy. Had 2 gems and 2 corn + iron. Second city had horses and pigs. Third had 3 gems. I was beelining for Redcoats and turtling until then. Problem was Louis decided I should pay tribute and I disagreed (not a good idea with 1 warrior for 3 cities).

Long story short, he attacked and took 1 city then a second while I recaptured the first. I ended up in a stalemate with him since I had better units but he had tons of units. All the fighting that I wasn't ready for cost me the speed in research I needed and at 800ad, I was in a deadlock with Louis holding one of his cities (total of 4) and no real way to get to any VC much less a Dom.

Thinking that Lizzy may not be the best for this. Nappy may work out as said earlier. Gonna try Lizzy one more time since I have a bunch of MF starts with her.

 

[oyzar]

Not warrior rushing someone is a huge mistake on this difficulty, idealy you want at least 5 production at size 1 to do that though...

 

[unclethrill]

This one is going much better. Warrior rushed 1 and took a holy capital then SW rushed 2 more. Turn 75 and 3 off the board

 

[oyzar]

If you are going to play the english i think victoria is way better than lizzy though... Imperialistic is so good when rexing... Though i have a hard time seeing redcoats being faster at taking down the AI compared to caprtaches.

 

[unclethrill]

If you are going to play the english i think victoria is way better than lizzy though... Imperialistic is so good when rexing... Though i have a hard time seeing redcoats being faster at taking down the AI compared to caprtaches.

It made sense at 3AM when I was running MF. Can't say I disagree with you on that point though.

On quick speed with a map this big, it seems to me that most UU as not really that good. Even at prince, a good bit of luck is needed in the battles to get a decent time.