G-Minor 21

[Harbourboy]

I'm having a shocker on this game. It should be easy on Prince but I'm not applying the right tactics. From the above comments, I am making far too many wonders (Stonehenge, Oracle, Pyramids, Great Library, Parthenon, and Sistine). I figured that they would all be useful, but you're saying they're not.

 

[Shoot the Moon]

Ya, in my first game (fourth place currently, don't remember the date as it was awful), I only built Parthenon. I think Pyramids would have helped my time, but beyond that I cannot think of a wonder that would have helped.

 

[erikthecelt]

I think the Pyramids is a must for the civics. After Liberalism you can shut down science and cash rush the cathedrals. I built Parthenon and Sistine Chapel as well because I had a ton of food and ran a lot of artists after I finished teching to Liberalism. Build Sistine & Parthenon if you are running artists, don't build it if you run cottages. Leave the wonders to the AI, it slows them down.
I also built the Spiral Minaret in a non culture city so that I could continue teching slowly after I shut down the science slider. Took about 35 turns for Chemistry. I farmed over my cottages after Liberalism and ran about 7 or 8 artists in three cities.

 

[Harbourboy]

Yes, isn't Pyramids essential for being able to go into the "cash-buy" phase of cathedral building without having to research all the way to get universal suffrage?

 

[jesusin]

I'm having a shocker on this game. It should be easy on Prince but I'm not applying the right tactics. From the above comments, I am making far too many wonders (Stonehenge, Oracle, Pyramids, Great Library, Parthenon, and Sistine). I figured that they would all be useful, but you're saying they're not.

I can understand the marginal utility of every WW mentioned, but GLib. GLib doesn’t help your research much (6bpt, 12 if running Repr) and it contamines your GP pool. You don’t want scientist so late in the game. The main use of GLib is to add 8GPPpt and 3 sources of scientists, so you don’t want it this game.

I got Liberalism first though as usual on Prince, with just one Great Scientist for an Academy during Education research.

If you were so close to finishing researching, maybe it would have been better to lightbulb the rest of Education (or Philo if you didn't already had it).

I just finished a game where I farmed the heck out of my cities.

Nice to see someone disagreeing.
I still think you would get a better result if you cottaged all over. If we were Philo and not Financial, I would be playing the same strategy as you, aiming for 20 GA, cottaging only the capital.

Yes, isn't Pyramids essential for being able to go into the "cash-buy" phase of cathedral building without having to research all the way to get universal suffrage?

I am not playing a cash-buy phase. I look at it this way: artist are not the way to go. Cottage all over, work the mines. Pacifism is half useful as I am running so few artist, run OR instead, saving the hammers of the monasteries and adding a 25% production. Caste System is devaluated. Run slavery instead, helping production further. With the hammers I save from not building the Pyramids, I build settlers (or Axes convertible to cities) for a quicker expansion.
Of course I could be very wrong. We will see. I would be glad if erikthecelt decided to try this strategy once. He would play with the same level of expertise as the farm-the-heck game he mentioned, so the results would be really comparable.

 

[Harbourboy]

How the heck do you build all those cathedrals in time without a cash buy phase? Everyone else seems to play a much easier version of the game than me!

 

[jesusin]

How the heck do you build all those cathedrals in time without a cash buy phase? Everyone else seems to play a much easier version of the game than me!

I have tried to explain before. I play a hammer oriented game. I run slavery and OR most of the time.


Why aren't you getting better results? I don't know, I haven't seen your games. If you posted a couple of screenshots of one of your games I am sure you would receive a lot of feedback. People are really nice in this forum.

I will dare to mention two possibilities, but I could be quite off the mark:
- Lack of focus. For example, you seem to pursue all WW just for the sake of it.
- There could be a fundamental mistake in the basics of your game. Maybe it is city placement. Maybe you build too much infrastructure in your cities. Or too little. Maybe your techpath is erratic. Maybe you whip too much ot too little. Maybe you build the wrong improvements. Maybe you build too many or too few cities...

 

[WastinTime]

The other problem with GA strategy is that this is not Quick speed. GA's are more powerful on Quick. Hammer/cottage is the way to go. I also skip rush buying. It takes too many turns to generate cash. Once you have a few cathedrals up you want to run 100% culture slider.

 

[mrfurious]

Is there any way to increase the odds of attracting a religion? (short of capturing a city)
I have a nice game going, founded 5 religions. However, everyone else on the continent has Buddhism as their state religion (the one I didn't found).

 

[erikthecelt]

Is there any way to increase the odds of attracting a religion? (short of capturing a city)
I have a nice game going, founded 5 religions. However, everyone else on the continent has Buddhism as their state religion (the one I didn't found).

You could try building a city close and don't connect it to your road/river trade route system. Connect it to one of the other civ's and check the trade routes. Eventually it could attract a religion.
Conquest is much easier

 

[erikthecelt]

Nice to see someone disagreeing.
I still think you would get a better result if you cottaged all over. If we were Philo and not Financial, I would be playing the same strategy as you, aiming for 20 GA, cottaging only the capital.

I'll put the major on hold and give it a try. (I usually only get time for one game a week so I might not make it). I'll report in as I go. It was a sweat map though, 9 AI on one continent and Catherine all alone on an island.

This was the first time I used the spreadsheet once I hit culture build phase so it was handy juggling builds at the end.

Do you build troops in your other cities or just pile up gold to buy techs from the AI in the culture phase?

 

[AAA]

I have been using (god help me! ) a warrior rush. I can usually take two capitals before archers appear.

My best date has been 1607.
And since I'm out of town in three hours, it will be my best try.

 

[killercane]

I have been using (god help me! ) a warrior rush. I can usually take two capitals before archers appear.

My best date has been 1607.
And since I'm out of town in three hours, it will be my best try.

This is my tactic as well! They usually only have 2 warriors in the capital until very late, and they dont produce workers fast enough for merely stealing. I figure it is the most cost beneficial way to go.

 

[Harbourboy]

My 11th attempt at this looks like being successful, but unlikely to be a date much earlier than 1900AD, which would make it worse than my Monarch culture game.

Still doing something wrong in the early game because whilst I won the race to Liberalism, this did not happen until 1250AD, whereas you guys are talking about reaching this mark over 700 years earlier.

 

[Thrallia]

Currently, I'm playing a pretty good game, for me at least.

I picked Frederick, Bismark, Elizabeth, Churchill, Washington, and Roosevelt for my opponents...peaceful, but no mysticism start for them.

I was able to grab Buddhism, Hinduism, and Judaism. I lost out on Christianity by 2 turns when Bismark popped a GP, and Taoism by 2 turns when Roosevelt popped a GS. I also lost out on Confuscianism by 5 turns(I went for IW first to clear jungles)

However, I've peacefully settled 6 cities, grabbed Confuscianism by religion spread, and all my neighbors are friendly with me. I could probably go diplomacy from here and get a pretty good date. Instead I'll try for a decent culture date as per the minor setup. I got Pyramids, but on reflection, it was a mistake because I've not used any specialists(representation) and I've decided to tech to democracy anyway for Emancipation. I got my initial cottages up very quickly, but was slow at clearing all the jungles, thus need Emancipation to provide faster towns and faster hammers.

Once I get there, I'll be good, and should finish in the 1700s. I'm making a profit at 90% science and have 4 cities producing more than 70 beakers per turn. Once I get my cathedrals going I should have a possible 4 legendary cities...I'll probably go with the more highly cottaged city over the Jewish holy city though.

Final thought is that I got Liberalism in about 1125AD, grabbed Nationalism with it, and only then did I research Drama...is that too late? I'm currently researching Constitution, then will research Democracy and shut off research for a cash-rushing phase...I've got a horrible area for hammers. My top city has 9 hammers at size 15.

 

[Harbourboy]

I got Liberalism in about 1125AD

Hallelujah. At least somebody else has the same Civ IV as me where Liberalism arrives around the 12th century rather than in prehistoric times.

 

[Moonsinger]

Hallelujah. At least somebody else has the same Civ IV as me where Liberalism arrives around the 12th century rather than in prehistoric times.

You weren't the only one. I too usually got Liberalism after 1000AD. For example, on the previous Major #12, I got Liberalism around 1280 AD.

 

[Harbourboy]

For example, on the previous Major #12, I got Liberalism around 1280 AD.

Ahem. Yes, but it looks like you used Liberalism to pop Computers! I use Liberalism to pop Nationalism or Printing Press.

Plus, you had somehow taken over 3 civilisations by turn 32! And 4 by turn 50!

In my game, I am lucky to have a worker, a warrior, a settler, and maybe half a barrack by turn 50.

The gulf between your game and my game is titanic.

 

[jesusin]

I'll put the major on hold and give it a try. (I usually only get time for one game a week so I might not make it).

Thank you, I appreciate it.
Same here, 12 hours is my usual time for a culture game on Quick, a week.

Do you build troops in your other cities or just pile up gold to buy techs from the AI in the culture phase?

In my only submitted game so far I started building units when Musa closed borders. If he hadn't, I wouldn't have built any troops in the AD years. When auxiliary cities have finished their work (1 temple of each religion and a theatre) they use 2 pop as artists (if there is a hope for a GA in that city) and production is converted into gold. I use that gold to pay me a 100% culture slider instead of a 90%. In the culture phase I don't need more techs. Well, I appreciate when AI are fast enough to discover Economics before the game ends, but my tech advantage Liberalism+Nationalism is usually enough to trade that far.

The other problem with GA strategy is that this is not Quick speed. GA's are more powerful on Quick. Hammer/cottage is the way to go. I also skip rush buying. It takes too many turns to generate cash. Once you have a few cathedrals up you want to run 100% culture slider.

It's nice to see you agreeing.

Just a little detail, you say GA's are more powerful on Quick, I am not sure I understand why. On Quick you need 25000 instead of the expected 33333. But that difference affects culture-built-through-commerce as much as GAs, so when comparing GAs to cottages it shouldn't be a factor, or should it?

 

[Harbourboy]

Finally managed to finish one at 1898 AD. I wonder if I should bother trying to beat that score?