Gee, thanks, Gibbon

[Baron Von Noob]

For my first game as the Sidar, I naturally went for the Council of Esus religion.

My neighbors were all Council of Esus fellow members, with attitudes ranging from cautious to friendly.
Most of the surviving nations of Erebus were neutral or evil, with only the Bannor still holding the "good alignement", and they were being attacked by the Illians, Sheaim and Infernals. Also, Hell Terrain was starting to spread through neutral territories...

Since my own country was doing pretty well, I thought now would be the time to use Gibbon Goethia's "impersonate leader" ability. The Illians were really crushing the Bannor, so my goal was to get them to send their armies out of Bannor territory, towards strong Barbarian units to get weakened. It worked out pretty well, giving the Bannor time to strenghten up against their other enemies, so I was quite happy with the result.

Except... That when I got back to playing the Sidar, the AI had sent most of my city defense units to attack Abashi (champions and longbowmen mostly, this was mid-game), and considered that catapults and adepts were the best way to protect my border cities. The neutral Clan of Embers found it to be a good occasion to invade, and half my empire was lost to the Clan in the about 10 turns I was spending in Illian territory.

Lorewise, I'm guessing it's the crazy agriculture advisor who pops up in that early-game event who's been given the keys to my empire, cause nobody else would act so stupidly !

So, except if you're alone on a continent, is there any way the AI can't f*** up your game when you're impersonating another leader ?

 

[mimic]

I've never tried the spell myself exactly for those reasons, I wouldn't trust the AI to run my empire.

 

[wilboman]

I think that is the great weakness of the spell, really.

 

[Baron Von Noob]

Could there be a way to tweak the AI so that it stays in city defense mode and doesn't change building chains that are already set ?
I don't even mind too much about a war declaration while I'm not in command, but seeing all my strongest defensive units just ambling about in the countryside towards a dragon they have no chance of killing whatsoever while puny little Clan goblins take over my big cities was too much to bare.

 

[Ajidica]

What would be nice with that spell is to turn the game into a 'hotseat' form. Where you control both your original civ and the other civ. I don't know how hard that is to code, and might be quite alot for only one unit.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Yeah, I've ben requesting a Hotseat type game for quite a while. I've used Impersonate Leader 2 or 3 times just to test it, and have always found my empire seemed was messed up more than the AI's

 

[Darksaber1]

I used Impersonate Leader once. NEVER AGAIN! The AI had for an unknown reason caused all my cities to grow into unhealthyness, My units were every were, it had replaced improvements, and I was lossing money because the AI started pumping out units, and I never build that many units. And I think it wrecked my diplomacy. I quit as soon as I saw what it had done. A Hotseat style game would be great, and was infact what I was expecting.

 

[MetalMilitia-]

im guessing you meant Acheron and not Abashi...

Anyway, i think ihve posted this before, but the ai should not go for a raid on the dragon hoard when it has no actual chance of making even the slightest dent.

Ihve seen Acheron attracting loads of units that are then unable to attack and just sit there for ages.

 

[smjjames]

yea, when I heard of how bad using that particular spell was, I decided never to use it.

IMO Gibbon should have a different ability as this is broken beyond broken as far as the AI goes. So unless it's changed to a 'hotseat' type game as some have said, it should be ditched and give Gibbon something else.

Gibbon can actually make a pretty good archmage, although he is not the best (that goes to Govannon, I think?), he can be pretty powerful when used in certain ways.

MetalMilitia, maybe that could be posted in the community request: AI issues thread? I'm sure it's common knowledge though.

 

[Darksaber1]

Hemah is also pretty good (was better when he could summon 8 meteors), and Chalid has Pillar of fire, but Itend to find Govannon best (if just for his training abilities).
Edit: Well actually, comparing Govannon is rather pointless anyway, since only the Amurite(sp?) get him, but anyway...

 

[reveler]

Also the idea that I have to give up my civilisation is wrong as Gibbon does the impersonating not Perpentach or whoever is my leader at that time. The better choice would either be to get the nation as allied or to be able to play them both. The second one perhaps with more restrictions.

 

[Baron Von Noob]

im guessing you meant Acheron and not Abashi...

Yup, I always get my dragons mixed up.

 

[Fafnir13]

Never used the ability, so I've always wondered how it works exactly. Could you take control, delete every last unit they have, and declare war on the world?
And how does it work in multiplayer? Is it just set to not be available or do the players trade?

 

[Baron Von Noob]

In solo mode, diplomatic interactions are blocked, and you can't disband units.
You can pillage your own improvements though, and I even had one of the "xxx rightfully wants to join -civ- " popups for a border city. Also, I managed to ruin the economy so badly that units were being disbanded due to lack of funds.

 

[cabbagemeister]

Yeah, I thought the point of Impersonate Leader was to take an AI empire and screw it up as much as possible. It wouldn't be right for the AI you switch with to be forced to play as conservatively and defensively as possible. I always think of it as a "who can best run an empire into the ground" contest.

Of course it's still not worth using from a mechanics standpoint because there are a bunch of other empires which are NOT being screwed up, and you'll lose ground to them. But it's great fun from a flavor perspective. I don't think it should be changed.

 

[sylvanllewelyn]

How many turns to I get to screw up someone else's empire? If it's loaded with towns, however, it might take a while.

 

[kumquatelvis]

Worked pretty well me. I took control of my neighbor (the Hippus). As the Hippus I declared war on both the Sheam and my original empire. Then ALL of the Hippus units went to Sheam lands to participate in a city burning rampage. Since my real empire was at war it didn't waste time doing weird stuff, but rather marched units into the completely empty Hippus cities. Once the effect wore off I had half of the huge Hippus empire, and the Hippus had lost a ton of units fighting the Sheam (Catapults? Mages? What nonsense. Attack those walls my mounted pawns...er, soldiers).

 

[rocklikeafool]

I had a game tonight where I used Gibbon's impersonate leader. It went ok. I took control of the Calabim. But the annoyin thing was my old civ, the Svaltafar, had a Great Prophet pop up. And I had no decision in how they used it. So, 5 turns later, I can't use the damn unit cuz they burned it for a Golden Age. Not the worst thing in the world. But annoyin nonetheless since I rarely use GPs for Golden Ages. I prefer to have the Bone Palace start a Golden Age. And, any events that allow that too are bonus. Jus how I use Golden Ages.

 

[Halancar]

Gibbon can actually make a pretty good archmage, although he is not the best (that goes to Govannon, I think?), he can be pretty powerful when used in certain ways.

The best thing is probably that he is a very early archmage. Probably your first unit capable of learning Vitalize, for instance.

But as for the impersonate leader thing, I wouldn't touch it. Well, maybe, if I was playing an island nation and controlled all of my island, which would limit the AI ability to mess things up... and I would disband all my workers first. And there was only one other nation in a position to hurt me, and that would be the one I took control of...

Nah, rebuilding the damage to my nation is still too much work for not enough fun ruining an AI nation. If I want to do that, I'll just declare war !

 

[rocklikeafool]

I think usin him as an Archmage is much better anyway. Specially now that I've used his impersonate leader ability.