General discussion thread

[Thomas SG]

Sounds good. I've got a few questions though:
- Is the mod available as a zip? I prefer to avoid installers when I can.

No. But you can use the installer like a zip file. Just create a folder on your desktop or where ever you want and change the path of the installer to your custom folder. The installer doesn't touch the registry or something like that.

- Does the foreign culture from trade routes affect the area surrounding the city, or only the city tile itself?

The culture from trade routes is of the same type as culture from buildings. It affects only the city itself and not the area around it.

- I'd like to see how it was implemented. Is the source code available somewhere?

The CCV code is not public and should not become public.

 

[karadoc]

The culture from trade routes is of the same type as culture from buildings. It affects only the city itself and not the area around it.

I'm not sure that we understand each other on this. Ordinary culture from buildings and artists doesn't only add culture to the city, it adds culture to all the tiles within the city's cultural border. So, for example, if you capture a city in a foreign country, both the city and the tiles around the city will at first be 100% foreign and 0% yours, but as you build up culture in the city the tiles around the city will gradually become a higher percent yours.

I'm wondering if your foreign trade culture works in the same way. In particular, will the tiles outside the city be a non-zero percent foreign owned, or will it only affect the city itself?

If it really does work the same way as culture from buildings and such I'd expect it to affect the nearby tiles; but I'm just not sure if it works like that with foreign culture.

 

[Thomas SG]

If it really does work the same way as culture from buildings and such I'd expect it to affect the nearby tiles; but I'm just not sure if it works like that with foreign culture.

I must confess that I didn't know that near by city plots are affected by buildings too. But it works the same way. And yes I've tested it. You are absolutly right. Near by city plots are influenced by the trade route culture as well. I like it. So CTR is better than I expected it do be.

 

[SaiH]

Just one question regarding the migration: does migration from foreign cities have influence on the culture of a city?

 

[Thomas SG]

Just one question regarding the migration: does migration from foreign cities have influence on the culture of a city?

Yes of course.

 

[CellKu]

Thomas SG, as I was away for a few days, just a brief request for a little update: How are 4.30 and 5.00 coming along? I hope you are not busy playing Civ5?

And did you have a look at The Lopez new resource piling mod thread? If he is able to make the AI able to handle it well, that mod will overhaul of the game competely.

 

[gfurst]

How are 4.30 and 5.00 coming along? I hope you are not busy playing Civ5?

In my opinion CCV is kindy better than Civ5 (don't really didn't buy the game, didn't download the mod) KK
Anyway, i didn't download the mod because the download link seems to be not valid anymore, any chance to uploading it again or maybe updating it?

The CCV code is not public and should not become public.

Why the hell?? i was looking forward to use some of your features, did you mean you wish only to not make it public but send for those who ask for it, Or like, the code is closed and copyrighted (WTH)?

 

[CellKu]

While I like the concept, I think "building gold" right from the start is quite powerful as it is now.
Perhaps you could reduce its "efficiency" before currency (= not transfer all gold to the budget); and allow the transfer of the full amount of gold to your budget (= so that it can be used for the slider) only after currency has been researched.

 

[gfurst]

While I like the concept, I think "building gold" right from the start is quite powerful as it is now.
Perhaps you could reduce its "efficiency" before currency (= not transfer all gold to the budget); and allow the transfer of the full amount of gold to your budget (= so that it can be used for the slider) only after currency has been researched.

Was this supposed to be directed at me? gold, slider?
Well if so reply at the discussion thread, there is also a more detailed scheme of how i plan it to be.

 

[CellKu]

Was this supposed to be directed at me? gold, slider?
Well if so reply at the discussion thread, there is also a more detailed scheme of how i plan it to be.

Well, no. In that case I would have posted in your thread. I meant the concept that Thomas implemented which enables the player to build gold right from the start.

 

[Thomas SG]

In my opinion CCV is kindy better than Civ5 (don't really didn't buy the game, didn't download the mod) KK
Anyway, i didn't download the mod because the download link seems to be not valid anymore, any chance to uploading it again or maybe updating it?

Really? Not valid? I'll check it later... Damn.

Why the hell?? i was looking forward to use some of your features, did you mean you wish only to not make it public but send for those who ask for it, Or like, the code is closed and copyrighted (WTH)?

It's not copyrighted. But the code is not available for everybody, all other mods and modders. My work, my time, my decision.

 

[gfurst]

Sorry, i just checked and i've successfully downloaded the 4.29B version, dunno, maybe it was an error with rapidshare. Thanks

 

[CellKu]

Hi.
I'm very, very busy at the moment. My life is going crazy again. And it will stay so for a long time I fear. So expect nothing from me at the moment. I would like to but I cannot. Sorry.

Thanks for letting us know. Since your silence coincided with the release of Civ5, I feared you might have changed your mind and switched to Civ5. Good to know you are still around.

I've tried to implement a new unit support system to reduce the number of units in the later game. But as I told you this is not finished. Should I upload it anyway in next days (/weeks )?

Is this new support system inspired by TheLopez's modcomp? I read a post (I think from The_J) who warned that it brings back a Civ2 feature which was problematic. But I don't want to judge in advance, before I have seen your implementation of it. Btw, will it be optional?

What about the other features that appeared to work, but which you postponed for 4.30/5.00? Such as Lost Battles? Would it be possible to release a version with these features before adding new concepts such as the support system?

Finally, while playing Afforess AND mod a bit I found an interesting feature: barbs (in the beginning mostly archers and warriors) often come with galleys and land close to your cities (so they spawn in within the barb galleys). It was very realistic (like the Normans raiding the coastal villages) and made them a bigger threat. Would that be something for CCV, as well?

 

[CellKu]

Oh, and since you suggested it, I would be grateful for a fixed version. Or would you suggest that I should go back to 4.29A?

 

[Thomas SG]

Oh, and since you suggested it, I would be grateful for a fixed version. Or would you suggest that I should go back to 4.29A?

No. I've got 4.29C here. Try this first...

Thanks for letting us know. Since your silence coincided with the release of Civ5, I feared you might have changed your mind and switched to Civ5. Good to know you are still around.

I don't like the official Civ V. And what could I do with it at the moment? As far as I know we have no access to the DLL at the moment. No. I'll stay here for a very long time...

Is this new support system inspired by TheLopez's modcomp? I read a post (I think from The_J) who warned that it brings back a Civ2 feature which was problematic. But I don't want to judge in advance, before I have seen your implementation of it. Btw, will it be optional?

The most important at first - it is optional! And the balance seems to be quite well now. So give it a try.

And no. It has got nothing to do with what ever TheLopez has done. It's one of the unreleased features from my HDD.

So, what does the new Advanced Support do? The Advanced Support changes the 1 per unit and turn rule. This is one of the main problems of Civ IV, I think. That's the reason why you can support in the later game hundreds of units. That's the reason for endless stacks in Civ. That's the reason for slow turns in the later game. So, Advanced Support is my solution for this major problem.
The needed support is now individual for each unit type. So a warrior is still cheap with 1 and 2 per turn while a modern super carrier will need a support of 6 and 4. (A good smiley is missing here - = population point).

For each missing population point you will have to pay 1. So a super carrier may cost up to 10 in contrast to 1 in the BTS system. And that's just the carrier. The fighters are much more expensive as well. As a result a typical balanced empire seems to be able to support between 50 and 150 units (in all eras). At this point you may be asking for the AI. I've done some important changes. The AI auto games seemed fine to me. If not tell me and disable the feature. You can even do so in a running game.

What about the other features that appeared to work, but which you postponed for 4.30/5.00? Such as Lost Battles? Would it be possible to release a version with these features before adding new concepts such as the support system?

Lost Battles still suffers from ACO problems. And don't you like new concepts? Espcially if it is one that makes bigger maps valid or running the game much faster?
By the way I've added some new stuff. There are some new UUs like Stratofortress for America, V2 for Germany and a Dragoon for France. And I've added two new buttons to the interface. Those allow you to increase/decrease the current difficulty level when ever you want. What else? Oh! I've reworked the nuclear arsenal of CCV. We got now the tactical nuke (1), strategic missile (9), strategic ICBM (9), the strategic bomber fleet (9) and a new super strategic bomber (21) in CCV. I've also repaired the animations. The conventional ballistic missiles are still a bit buggy because they still cause a shock wave but that's not so sad. But sorry, the new AI pretargeting could not be finished for this release. I'm still working on it. Oh, and I've invented a new interception concept for missiles. Have a look at the pedia or unit help. Nukes can now only be intercepted by SDI while conventional ballistic missiles can be intercepted by SDI and anti aircraft units! Guided missiles of course can't be intercepted by SDI. But you can shoot them down with anti aircraft units. Oh, and I've also added the new promised precision bombing mission against cargo units outside of cities and improvements (ships in the open sea). So there is now for air units an equal mission to FSA Cargo against cargo units.

You see - nearly no changes.
(I had no crash while testing but for the case of errors there is also a debug DLL in the construction folder.)

Finally, while playing Afforess AND mod a bit I found an interesting feature: barbs (in the beginning mostly archers and warriors) often come with galleys and land close to your cities (so they spawn in within the barb galleys). It was very realistic (like the Normans raiding the coastal villages) and made them a bigger threat. Would that be something for CCV, as well?

Yes of course. Do you know how it is done?

 

[CellKu]

Wow, that is a ton of new stuff!! I am speechless!

No. I've got 4.29C here. Try this first...

Oh, definitely. You can be sure of that!

I don't like the official Civ V. And what could I do with it at the moment? As far as I know we have no access to the DLL at the moment. No. I'll stay here for a very long time...

Good to know! Me, too!

The most important at first - it is optional! And the balance seems to be quite well now. So give it a try.

I will. The way you describe it, sounds really good! That is something Civ4 should have implemented from the beginning. I always wondered why the no. of units is not tight to the size of the population in any respect. So, I am really looking forward to testing this feature!!

Lost Battles still suffers from ACO problems. And don't you like new concepts? Espcially if it is one that makes bigger maps valid or running the game much faster?

Too bad regarding Lost Battles. But I do understand that you want to get rid of the ACO problems first. And - just to make sure - I do like the new concepts! Now, after learning more about them I am certain of that!

By the way I've added some new stuff. There are some new UUs like Stratofortress for America, V2 for Germany and a Dragoon for France. And I've added two new buttons to the interface. Those allow you to increase/decrease the current difficulty level when ever you want. What else? Oh! I've reworked the nuclear arsenal of CCV. We got now the tactical nuke (1), strategic missile (9), strategic ICBM (9), the strategic bomber fleet (9) and a new super strategic bomber (21) in CCV. I've also repaired the animations. The conventional ballistic missiles are still a bit buggy because they still cause a shock wave but that's not so sad. But sorry, the new AI pretargeting could not be finished for this release. I'm still working on it. Oh, and I've invented a new interception concept for missiles. Have a look at the pedia or unit help. Nukes can now only be intercepted by SDI while conventional ballistic missiles can be intercepted by SDI and anti aircraft units! Guided missiles of course can't be intercepted by SDI. But you can shoot them down with anti aircraft units. Oh, and I've also added the new promised precision bombing mission against cargo units outside of cities and improvements (ships in the open sea). So there is now for air units an equal mission to FSA Cargo against cargo units.

Regarding barbs landing from galleys: Maybe Afforess can give you a helping hand there. I came across that feature just last week when playing his AND mod. AFAIK the source of his mod is open to the public (he offered that volunteers could grab it and develop it further because he moved to Civ5 - he will only release patches for his last version).

Btw, I don't remember, have you brought the espionage system together with revolutions, as well? I saw in Afforess AND mod that spies are able to increase the chances of revolt in a foreign city. But these interconnections will probably have to wait until you focus on enhancing the espionage system.

 

[CellKu]

Oh, I forgot: Would it be possible to implement a button - perhaps in the city screen - that allows you to abandon a city (after it asks you whether you really want to do that - to ensure the player hasn't hit the button accidentally)?
(Sometimes I conquer a city from the AI which seems good at first, but when I conquer the next city I realise that it would be better to get rid of both and found a city in between.)

 

[Thomas SG]

Regarding barbs landing from galleys: Maybe Afforess can give you a helping hand there. I came across that feature just last week when playing his AND mod. AFAIK the source of his mod is open to the public (he offered that volunteers could grab it and develop it further because he moved to Civ5 - he will only release patches for his last version).

Is it a game option? Or is it a new feature? I've got an older code of AND here. If it's new I may find it by comparision. Any idea?

Btw, I don't remember, have you brought the espionage system together with revolutions, as well? I saw in Afforess AND mod that spies are able to increase the chances of revolt in a foreign city. But these interconnections will probably have to wait until you focus on enhancing the espionage system.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Espionage system? It's the same as in RevDCM + the sleep function until maximum effect for spies.

 

[CellKu]

Is it a game option? Or is it a new feature? I've got an older code of AND here. If it's new I may find it by comparision. Any idea?

I don't think it is a game option. At least I couldn't find anything - neither in the "Custom Game" menu nor later within the game. I had checked only the barb options which I knew from your mod (except Barbarian world). So I think Afforess just changed the way barbs spawn (btw. some of them did spawn on land, not all of them in galleys). But I am not 100% sure.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Espionage system? It's the same as in RevDCM + the sleep function until maximum effect for spies.

Sorry, for being unclear. I meant new spy missions which are targeted towards revolts. I attach two pics for clarification:

Spoiler :

And:

Spoiler :

 

[CellKu]

Sorry, one more thing: How do I pillage roads while leaving an improvement which is on the same tile untouched? I couldn't find that button (only the usual pillage button where I destroy the improvement first and only then the road).