Getting started on unit creation...

[Dutch Canuck]

Hello, I recently downloaded Python and Blender, as well as Firaxian info on unit creation. I know that I still need 3DMax 7.0, I want to save that for the final steps on getting a unit ready for the game. My initial challenge is "where do I start" in order to master the modelling. I am keen to make units and learn and develop 3D skills in the process, but when I consider there are XML files, DDS files, TGA files and other data files, then I am not clear where to start or what all those extensions signify...

Firstly, I'd like to know how all the different file types interrelate - what do they do with each other? What's the big picture (as it relates to units in Civ 4)?

Next, once I have a unit concept in my head/in note form, what SW do I open first to get started? I assume Blender - but maybe I'm missing something beforehand.

I am a quick learner once I have my bearings, and I am not a total newb with computing, but when everything is unfamiliar/new I am stumped. I have poked around the various tutorials - which are great - but I still "can't see the forest for the trees" as they say... So if anyone who knows direct me to a good starting point that would save some time and confusion, that would be a great help!

PS: I'll pay back later by sharing my new cool new units!

PPS: Happy Saint Patrick's Day!!!

 

[HourlyDaily]

Can't help you with an answer yet but I feel I am more or less in the same place as yourself. And there would be plenty out there in the same.

The questions you've asked are good ones because there isn't a true overall tutorial out there that I've read. There are good tutorials for getting down to the nitty gritty like the Firaxis 3DMax pdf, but not for explaining things to people who need to know where to understand the relationships. So you make less mistakes at the start.

I'd like to see this thread pinned at some stage.

 

[Gaias]

Well considering the relative new territory of unit making in Civ4 (and only a few modellers making units as of yet), it maybe many months before anyone has a good, firm understanding of the 3ds max exporter. Then you have to get one that is articulated enough in making a tutorial, that is willing to share their experience (which I have no doubt their will be), for those that do not understand.

Then again, with the blender plugin still very much under development, most of what is required to make a fully functioning unit for Civ4 is as of yet improbable. It will be many months before all needed functions are completed for said plugin, and even more months for others to accumulated enough knowledge of the plugin to be able to impart what is need to learn.

 

[Thasis]

How much does it cost for 3dsmax?

 

[Dual]

How much does it cost for 3dsmax?

A lot. Though you can get a discount if you're a college student.

You can also download a 30 day free trial here: http://www.softpedia.com/get/Multimedia/Graphic/Graphic-Editors/3D-Studio-Max.shtml Which is what I've been using.

 

[Dual]

Firstly, I'd like to know how all the different file types interrelate - what do they do with each other? What's the big picture (as it relates to units in Civ 4)?

The basic lowdown is that the differnt files work together to place a unit in the game. The XML files contain all the game info aout a unit: All the text displayed in game, what you can use the unit for in the game, and behind the scene instructions telling Civ4 were to find the unit's 3D model and other art.

The actual 3D model of the unit is stored in a .nif file that, using the Civ4 plugin, can be created from a 3DsMax scene.

The "skin" for the unit (the art that is placed on the models) is stored in .dds files. These are just a special kind of image file, like jpegs or bmps. The .tga files are also art files; the city icons are stored in a couple of those types of files.

And Python files contain programing code that tells the game how to act under particular circumstances. For example, a few lines of code that tells the game to play a movie when the player creates a Great Wonder.

I'm not very good at writing tutorials, and am still learning myself, so for starters I'd recommend checking out some of the tutorials already written about unit creation. Like these:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=139721

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=156760

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=161099

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=163585

And my advice would be to just dive in and start playing with all the files. You'll learn fast what does and doesn't work when you start changing the XML and stuff.

 

[Rabbit, White]

While I understand your predicament Dutch Canuck, writing an all inclusive tutorial that covers all the aspects of unit creation is a very daunting task and it's unlikely that someone will do it.

My best advice would be to start small - go in and simply duplicate an existing unit and create a new one out of it. Go over it's various properties, make a completely new unit class or make it a unique unit, assign it to a certain tech and so on. Once you done that to a couple of units you pretty much got the hang of it and any extra details you will learn when you need to. If you want something a bit more "challenging" then add one of the new units created by nautil or sharick to the game so that they use animations, as well as give them an all new button.

Python is only needed if you want to create units with new functions, and it's a whole big topic all by itself. Unless you already have specific ideas in mind that you know you'll need python for then skip it for now.

As for the 3d unit creation, there are two approaches - one is to modify existing units, and the other is to create completely new ones. I recommend starting with the first approach even if ultimately you want to make all new units, because you will need to familiarize yourself with the NIF viewer in any case (check out the tutorial in my sig). Another plus of starting with this approach, is that if you're new to 3d modeling you'll be able to start making simple objects and getting nice reaults by adding these to the units.

As for making units froms scratch you will obviously need to learn 3d modeling and there are many tutorials for that on sites like 3d buzz, 3d total, 3d cafe, 3d links, and many more that you can google.

Like Dual says, just dive right in, you might get a bit of water in your nose but you won't drown.

 

[Dutch Canuck]

The basic lowdown is that the differnt files work together to place a unit in the game. The XML files contain all the game info aout a unit: All the text displayed in game, what you can use the unit for in the game, and behind the scene instructions telling Civ4 were to find the unit's 3D model and other art.

The actual 3D model of the unit is stored in a .nif file that, using the Civ4 plugin, can be created from a 3DsMax scene.

The "skin" for the unit (the art that is placed on the models) is stored in .dds files. These are just a special kind of image file, like jpegs or bmps. The .tga files are also art files; the city icons are stored in a couple of those types of files.

And Python files contain programing code that tells the game how to act under particular circumstances. For example, a few lines of code that tells the game to play a movie when the player creates a Great Wonder.

I'm not very good at writing tutorials, and am still learning myself, so for starters I'd recommend checking out some of the tutorials already written about unit creation. Like these:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=139721

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=156760

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=161099

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=163585

And my advice would be to just dive in and start playing with all the files. You'll learn fast what does and doesn't work when you start changing the XML and stuff.

Thank you for the above remarks on files! This is the kind of knowledge I was hoping someone would share. It's a good beginning for me towards an understanding of what is involved.

 

[Dutch Canuck]

While I understand your predicament Dutch Canuck, writing an all inclusive tutorial that covers all the aspects of unit creation is a very daunting task and it's unlikely that someone will do it.

My best advice would be to start small - go in and simply duplicate an existing unit and create a new one out of it. Go over it's various properties, make a completely new unit class or make it a unique unit, assign it to a certain tech and so on. Once you done that to a couple of units you pretty much got the hang of it and any extra details you will learn when you need to. If you want something a bit more "challenging" then add one of the new units created by nautil or sharick to the game so that they use animations, as well as give them an all new button.

Python is only needed if you want to create units with new functions, and it's a whole big topic all by itself. Unless you already have specific ideas in mind that you know you'll need python for then skip it for now.

As for the 3d unit creation, there are two approaches - one is to modify existing units, and the other is to create completely new ones. I recommend starting with the first approach even if ultimately you want to make all new units, because you will need to familiarize yourself with the NIF viewer in any case (check out the tutorial in my sig). Another plus of starting with this approach, is that if you're new to 3d modeling you'll be able to start making simple objects and getting nice reaults by adding these to the units.

As for making units froms scratch you will obviously need to learn 3d modeling and there are many tutorials for that on sites like 3d buzz, 3d total, 3d cafe, 3d links, and many more that you can google.

Like Dual says, just dive right in, you might get a bit of water in your nose but you won't drown.

Thank you for the advice. I'm impressed with your work on the units, and I can see your point regarding working with what is already given. I am inclined to do the same - that's in fact how I learned to manipulate text files and graphics in Civ III: toy with copies of the originals in order to reach that "Ah-hah! I get it!" stage - lots of trial and error

I agree with the idea that an all inclusive tutorial may be pragmatically impossible, but I am looking for a tutorial in the form of a guide (something with some key definitions of relevant terminology and concepts, complemented with links to other contributors' tutorials and websites featuring the "gory details"). I'd offer to do it myself but my knowledge base at present isn't adequate; on the other hand I am making notes on my experience and I could make a general guide to getting started on unit creation over the next month or so... I've had water up my nose before let's do it again! lol

PS: I may have missed another thread of the last week or so that covers my concerns. Without further ado I'll review the sticky threads here again to be sure of my information.