Getting Started

[Seek]

Both recent BCD versions are named v10. However, it looks like Thal did some reorganizing and split up buildings.xml in the most recent. The BCD Food.xml file I was referencing lives in the buildings folder along with the other new files. The granary yield changes and the Aqueduct def are there. I would assume he broke things up for clarity.

You're right, I didn't look through those files very closely. I tried a modern start with just BCD enabled and there are definitely a couple of bugs: I could build the Baths of Trajan NW immediately but the Aqueduct is not available to build. Also, although the Smokehouse should (according to the Food.xml) have the same effect as previously the only resource I got extra food from was fishes. Sheep, Deer and Cows were the same as vanilla.

I also noticed that Thal buffed the Armory to 20xp and the Military Acad to 25xp.
[EDIT: Culture buildings buffed as well.]

Not sure about this, but for new wonder icons, wouldn't you create an icontextureatlas entry and then change the iconatlas tag? If so, it looks like that got moved to BCD National Wonder.xml from buildings.xml.

I'm having a heck of a time getting the art to work, last night with v9 it worked, but when I loaded it up today it didn't. Arg.

 

[alpaca]

Cities are probably a bit too hard to take for the AI, but they feel just right for this human player.

I'm actually having a similar problem myself at the moment. I buffed city defenses, too, but now the AI rarely captures cities anymore. I think the cure is worse than the disease in this case, so I'll probably go back to a balance closer to vanilla for cities. The problem is, if it's difficult for the player it's all but impossible for the AI.

Another problem with high city defenses is that it makes turtling the best strategy, which isn't that interesting to be frank, and quite easy.

 

[Txurce]

I'm actually having a similar problem myself at the moment. I buffed city defenses, too, but now the AI rarely captures cities anymore. I think the cure is worse than the disease in this case, so I'll probably go back to a balance closer to vanilla for cities. The problem is, if it's difficult for the player it's all but impossible for the AI.

Another problem with high city defenses is that it makes turtling the best strategy, which isn't that interesting to be frank, and quite easy.

After playing maybe six games apiece at Emperor and Immortal level with the new mods, I found that there is very little movement in AI size on Emperor, and about right tilting toward the low on Immortal (one or two big civs, and some eliminations). I'm not sure how the higher production creates this change, since it's not mainly early rushes.

Thal was never happy with the modding limits on this issue. For me the ideal balance would be difficulty taking a walled city, without it being too difficult for the AI.

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by turtling, but I just wrote about my own version of it on Immortal in the Strategy section.

And I'll try out your mod on my next new game.

 

[Yps]

The mod is great but since I use it, I cannot annex puppet cities anymore (and no, I am not in the strategic view). Like clicking on an puppet city in the strategic view, I just enter the city via left-click instead of getting the option pop-up. I wonder if I am the only one having this problem.

 

[Txurce]

The mod is great but since I use it, I cannot annex puppet cities anymore (and no, I am not in the strategic view). Like clicking on an puppet city in the strategic view, I just enter the city via left-click instead of getting the option pop-up. I wonder if I am the only one having this problem.

I haven't experienced this problem. Have you tried disabling some or all of the mods, to see if you can isolate the problem?

 

[Txurce]

Okay, emergency! I'm now playing with BCD v9, and still can't trade for coal. Has anyone had this problem, and then resolved it?

 

[bryanw1995]

not only can I not trade for coal, it doesn't show up in the resources panel. VERY annoying, I had to invade songhai the other day to take his coal!!! probably should have just whacked him out completely when I invaded him in the classical era...

 

[Txurce]

not only can I not trade for coal, it doesn't show up in the resources panel. VERY annoying, I had to invade songhai the other day to take his coal!!! probably should have just whacked him out completely when I invaded him in the classical era...

Mine shows on the panel, but no one has it to trade. The nearest coal to me are Songhai allies, but he is the big fish on my continent, and I don't think it's worth starting Armageddon to speed up the building of my spaceship parts!

 

[gruven]

The mod is great but since I use it, I cannot annex puppet cities anymore (and no, I am not in the strategic view). Like clicking on an puppet city in the strategic view, I just enter the city via left-click instead of getting the option pop-up. I wonder if I am the only one having this problem.

That was a problem with Copasetic UI Tweaks after the patch. It was fixed in BCD several weeks ago though so make sure everything is up to date with your mods.

 

[Yps]

That was a problem with Copasetic UI Tweaks after the patch. It was fixed in BCD several weeks ago though so make sure everything is up to date with your mods.

That was the problem, thanks! After deactivating it, everything worked fine again. The reason is that I got the mods via mod-browsing in Civilization where only v2 of UI Tweaks is available. Nevertheless, after downloading v3 from civfanatics and activating it in Civ V, the culture info on the city banner vanished.

 

[Thalassicus]

I've added awesome new icons made by Seek for the Agra Fort and Baths of Trajan.

City strength:
I've reduced defensive building down from 200% to 150% in 1.4.3dev.

Coal trading:
This should be fixed in 1.4.3; Ironclads require Coal again. Can't solve the real bug yet (which exists in the c++) so this is temporary until we get the full SDK.

@simonjphillips
I have no idea what might be causing that for you, unfortunately. No one else has reported such an issue, and I don't run into it myself.

BCD files not taking effect:
I fixed the problem in 1.4.3. I'd put the cost change for the Smokehouse under its entry in Building_Flavors by accident, instead of Buildings. If Civ encounters an error in xml/sql files it simply ignores the whole file without giving an error message.

 

[heinous_hat]

BCD files not taking effect:
I fixed the problem in 1.4.3. I'd put the cost change for the Smokehouse under its entry in Building_Flavors by accident, instead of Buildings. If Civ encounters an error in xml/sql files it simply ignores the whole file without giving an error message.

Ah ha. That was it

 

[Txurce]

I will probably get one game in with 1.4.3, and will comment on how it affects city capture. With the prior patch I have been able to play a lux-REX strategy on Immortal where I have won several consecutive space races regardless of how many cities (4-9) by having 1) strong city defenses and 2) using chariot archers.

No one has commented on the buffed chariots, but I think their 4 range and ability to move after firing may be OP. I keep them well into the Renaissance, by which time they are heavily promoted. I always have mixed feelings about upgrading them to knights, since they are pretty devastating en masse to take cities or pick off city attackers.

 

[heinous_hat]

No one has commented on the buffed chariots, but I think their 4 range and ability to move after firing may be OP. I keep them well into the Renaissance, by which time they are heavily promoted. I always have mixed feelings about upgrading them to knights, since they are pretty devastating en masse to take cities or pick off city attackers.

I used them last game primarily to distract defenders away from my approaching army. They were definitely fun and effective in that role. Possibly OP, but then they were awful before and I never built them.

 

[Txurce]

I used them last game primarily to distract defenders away from my approaching army. They were definitely fun and effective in that role. Possibly OP, but then they were awful before and I never built them.

Exactly. They have gone from no-shows to all-stars. Try them as siege units with their retreat ability. They work even against walls when experienced and in teams.

They're probably no more OP than horses, though, and I like all mounted units having the same ability (to retreat after fighting). The new mod lowers range units' strength vs cities, so that may balance things even more.

 

[Varanid]

I still don't have coal showing up on the resource bar. I'll go double check all my mods I guess.

 

[maxben]

Hey guys, I searched through this thread and I think no one has mentioned my issue:
Even after building a courthouse occupied cities stay occupied.
This is particularly an issue because I like to play with huge cities so my unhappiness shoots through the roof!

 

[Thalassicus]

The capability for chariots to move after attacking is rather fun (and I've seen the AI use it) so if I were to reduce their power it would likely be to leave them out of the general range-damage buff (7 -> back to 6). The way I look at it, chariots are a safer but slower way to kill things compared to horsemen (which deal much more damage but take damage in return).

@Varanid
Did you try it with the 1.4.3 test development version? (bottom of the first post)

@maxben
That's an odd issue I've never seen. What mods exactly are you using, and could you provide a savegame file so I can do some testing?

 

[Tomice]

Oh, I postet about chariots in the "Combat" thread, not realizing there's an ongoing discussion here. I'll quote myself:

Hi Thal!

I'm sorry if this has been discussed before, but have you ever compared chariots and archers directly?

Cost:
While Chariots need horses, this is rarely a problem. IMO, chariots can be considered cheaper (90 vs 105 on epic). Furthermore, stables can boost chariot production, I think? Or are they archery units in this regard?

Tech:
The wheel + animal husbandry are more versatile than archery, making me often want to choose wheel before archery - although it's two techs vs one. The two paths merge very soon, anyway. I wouldn't say the shorter tech path to archers is a real advantage.

Mobility:
Chariots lose much of their advantage on rough terrain, but with move after attack I'd still say chariots are way more mobile.

Attack:
They should be perfectly equal with 7 each.

Defense:
Archers have one point more and receive terrain bonus. I'm not sure if chariots are affected by the negative modifier on open terrain. I'm also not sure how garrisoning works in detail.


SUMMARY:
I'd say the chariot's mobilty bonus is often more worthy than the better defense of archers. IMHO, the cheaper cost of chariots is not justified. I'd make archers cheaper or even switch the costs.

Oh, and thx for making chariots so awesome and fun to play with!

On another topic, the patch is announced for this week, as well as new DLC. Are you going to provide a new version of your mod soon? There's surprisingly little talk about the patch yet. I really hope you find the time!

Do you have any plans yet what you'll do about some of the controversial differences between the patch and your mod?

I'm thinking about:

- national wonders
- happiness buildings
- scientist slots
- defensive buildings
- aqueducts (cities grow faster now anyway)
- upgrade paths
- and many more...

 

[Varanid]

any ideas on incoming changes.
Also, thanks for the mods; they're very beneficial to the game! History will long remember your greatness