Gilad Shalit is free

[nivi]

You know that is totally irrelevant. The point you need to pay attention, is that the lack of media coverage of all of the Palestinian that was involved in the swap. Especially in English-language press and video coverages.

First of all, I do not know it is irrelevant, it was in the quoted text so I responded.

Fair warning, you will not like nor agree with that I am about to say.
Why you do not see any articles of the prisoners released in the deal?
1) You haven't looked hard enough.
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4136916,00.html
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4135644,00.html
Those are just 2 from a plethora of articles in English Israeli press. There are more in English Arab press.
2) Western news don't bother doing the research, it's far easier focusing on 1 guy, than it is focusing on a thousand.
3) News outlets talk about Israelis more than they do about Arabs in general, Yesterday, 24 Turk soldiers died in an attack on them, 8 protesters died in Syria, some more in Yemen, and even more in Lybia, but if god forbid, a couple of Israelis were killed in a rocket attack, it'd be the top story in the BBC middle east section.
4)Maybe, just maybe, they'd rather white wash it. I can't prove it and I won't try, I'm not even sure of it myself.

 

[Thoughtful Thug]

First of all, I do not know it is irrelevant, it was in the quoted text so I responded.

Fair warning, you will not like nor agree with that I am about to say.
Why you do not see any articles of the prisoners released in the deal?
1) You haven't looked hard enough.
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4136916,00.html
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4135644,00.html
Those are just 2 from a plethora of articles in English Israeli press. There are more in English Arab press.
2) Western news don't bother doing the research, it's far easier focusing on 1 guy, than it is focusing on a thousand.
3) News outlets talk about Israelis more than they do about Arabs in general, Yesterday, 24 Turk soldiers died in an attack on them, 8 protesters died in Syria, some more in Yemen, and even more in Lybia, but if god forbid, a couple of Israelis were killed in a rocket attack, it'd be the top story in the BBC middle east section.
4)Maybe, just maybe, they'd rather white wash it. I can't prove it and I won't try, I'm not even sure of it myself.

1) I have seen them, especially one of the two you have provided.
And yeah, I wouldn't be surprised to see more human faces to the story of some of the Palestinians involved in the swap in English Arab press.
2) I wouldn't go about saying Western news at all. If anything, it would take a lot of research to find out which side of the swap got the most media coverage in each individual nations that are all considered "West."
3 and 4) I was kinda referring to most of the Media back in the States. Which always has a pro-Israeli bias. Sorry I wasn't specific.

 

[nivi]

1) I have seen them, especially one of the two you have provided.
And yeah, I wouldn't be surprised to see more human faces to the story of some of the Palestinians involved in the swap in English Arab press.
2) I wouldn't go about saying Western news at all. If anything, it would take a lot of research to find out which side of the swap got the most media coverage in each individual nations that are all considered "West."
3 and 4) I was kinda referring to most of the Media back in the States. Which always has a pro-Israeli bias. Sorry I wasn't specific.

Sorry, I don't look at American press, way too US centric for my taste, I look at the BBC, Al-Jazeera and Maan for World, Arab and Palestinian news, respectively.
In the BBC for instance, these are the most popular Mid-east stories of the week:
Wednesday: Egyptian defends Shalit interview
Tuesday: Shalit back in Israel after swap
Monday: Israeli court backs Shalit deal
Sunday: Israel publishes prison swap list
Saturday: Deadly protests in Yemen capital

I can see a certain tilt...

 

[Formaldehyde]

can see a certain tilt...

Speaking of "certain tilt", are you really surprised that the website of an Israeli newspaper heavily biased against Netenyahu is going into great detail about how some of those released actually are terrorists, and how Palestinians supposedly adore these other "un-people" as Noam Chomsky so eloquently put it?

A study conducted by Moran Rada with the Israeli Democracy Institute showed that Yedioth Ahronoth's coverage of the 2009 Israeli legislative election was biased in favor of Kadima and its leader Tzipi Livni in most editorial decisions and that the paper chooses to play down events that don't help to promote a positive image for her, while on the other hand, touting and inflating events that help promote Livni and her party.[7] Oren Frisco reached a similar conclusion after the 2009 Knesset elections, writing that throughout the campaign, Yediot Ahronoth was biased against Benjamin Netanyahu.[8]

And perhaps you should read more US media. Not only are they US-centric to a great degree, they rarely, if ever, find fault with the obvious double standards at work here. As Noam pointed out, the inherent racism is so profound.

But at least Noam agrees with you in the sense that the stories of all those who were being held on trumped-up or even nonexistent charges certainly weren't mentioned much in the press, instead of the story of Gilad Shalit which received the vast majority of the attention. And neither was the torture used to gain many of those supposed confessions.

 

[nivi]

Speaking of "certain tilt", are you really surprised that the website of an Israeli newspaper heavily biased against Netenyahu is going into great detail about how some of those released actually are terrorists, and how Palestinians supposedly adore these other "un-people" as Noam Chomsky so eloquently put it?

I would think that is the duty of every newspaper to do so, regardless of tilt. Newspapers are the watchdogs of democracy, it is far preferable they criticize the government than praise it


And perhaps you should read more US media. Not only are they US-centric to a great degree, they rarely, if ever, find fault with the obvious double standards at work here. As Noam pointed out, the inherent racism is so profound.

No thanks, US media by and large, IMHO, to be blunt, sucks.

But at least Noam agrees with you in the sense that the stories of all those who were being held on trumped-up or even nonexistent charges certainly weren't mentioned much in the press, instead of the story of Gilad Shalit which received the vast majority of the attention. And neither was the torture used to gain many of those supposed confessions.

I assume you know Israeli law, and know that the supreme court ruling that torture is only allowed on a "ticking time bomb", as in a person who has knowledge of an ongoing terror mission, that is currently happening. So, if you make an accusation that "many" of those "supposed" confessions were in fact achieved by torture, you would at least back this up by numbers. There were nearly 500 released, can you tell me how many, if any were tortured? Can you even tell me how many actually confessed?
Here's a couple of links to get you started, although i'm fairly certain you are familiar with them.
http://www.btselem.org/hebrew
http://www.stoptorture.org.il/en

 

[Formaldehyde]

I assume you know that supposed law is quite frequently ignored by Israeli criminals masquerading as the Shin Bet with absolutely nothing happening to them as a result of their heinous crimes.

Israeli government report admits systematic torture of Palestinians

Israel torturing Palestinian child prisoners

Haaraetz: Rights groups: Shin Bet torturing jailed Palestinians

YnetNews:Former prisoners reveal torture in Palestinian prisons

 

[nivi]

I assume you know that supposed law is quite frequently ignored by Israeli criminals masquerading as the Shin Bet.

Israeli government report admits systematic torture of Palestinians

Israel torturing Palestinian child prisoners

Haaraetz: Rights groups: Shin Bet torturing jailed Palestinians

YnetNews:Former prisoners reveal torture in Palestinian prisons

[/url]

You have found 2 pre-supreme court ruling, 73 cases in over hundreds of thousands of prisoners , and 1 article of Palestinian torturing Palestinians, kudos, I am still waiting to hear re:confessions.

Edit: and 1 of the ever so neutral and as unbiased as you are, PalestineMonitor.

 

[Formaldehyde]

No, there are literally hundreds of sources which corroborate this travesty which continues to be completely ignored by the Israeli government:

Palestine Monitor:

“Israel is the sole country in the world to have legalized the use of torture”

B’Tselem, The Israeli Information Center for Human Rights

Since the beginning of the Occupation in 1967, over 650,000 Palestinians have been arrested by Israel. Almost 95% of them have been subjected to some form of torture or cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment.

Since 1967, over 105 documented torture techniques have been used by Israel. At least 66 Palestinians have been tortured to death.

To date, no Israeli official has ever been charged and sentenced for torture-related crimes.

Israel justifies torture by designating the Palestinian Territories as being under ‘exceptional circumstances’. But this is a direct violation of the 1984 Convention Against Torture, ratified by Israel in 1991. Article 2(2) states that ‘no exceptional circumstances whatsoever... may be invoked as a justification of torture’.

The right of every person not to be subjected to torture or cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment is one of the few human rights that are considered absolute. It is forbidden to balance this right against other rights and values, or suspend or restrict this right, under any circumstances.

Link to video.

Defense of the Children International: Israeli military continues to torture Palestinian children

oday, DCI/PS is releasing two case studies to draw attention to the continuing plight of Palestinian children, in particular, the 700 Palestinian children who are arrested, interrogated and often abused by the Israeli military and police each year.

In one case, Israeli interrogators beat 15-year-old Ibrahim S. over the course of several hours. Ibrahim was then threatened with sexual assault for the purpose of extracting his confession. The accusation, which Ibrahim kept denying, was that he had thrown stones at the Israeli army when it invaded his village the day before. A Military Court accepted Ibrahim’s confession and he was imprisoned in Israel for five months.

In the second case, 14-year-old Mohammad E. was standing with a group of friends near the Wall which passes close to his village near Ramallah. Mohammad was suddenly grabbed by four men in plain clothes who proceeded to hit him about the head with the butts of their guns whilst spraying his face with tear gas. Bleeding from wounds sustained during his arrest Mohammad was coerced into signing papers written in Hebrew in which he confessed to throwing stones at the Wall. An Israeli Military Court accepted this confession and sentenced Mohammad to four and-a-half months’ imprisonment.

“Palestinian children like Mohammad and Ibrahim are routinely exposed to physical and psychological abuse, amounting to cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment and punishment, and sometimes torture during arrest, interrogation and imprisonment,” said George Abu Al Zulof, DCI/PS General Director. “Unfortunately, these cases are not isolated incidents as Palestinian children are systematically subjected to such abuses by the Israeli military authorities”, he said.

Use of torture on 17-year-old boy by Israeli security service

 

[nivi]

Forma, if you are going to edit a post, then do it, but don't later re edit it, post another one, and make me look like an...

 

[Formaldehyde]

How is merely documenting Israeli government atrocities "biased"? Are all organizations which had done so, such as HRW and Amnesty International, biased? Or is it just the Palestine Monitor?

The Palestine Monitor is an organization that advocates for the Palestinian people, and publicizes conditions in the Gaza and West Bank. Topics featured by the Palestine Monitor include poverty, torture, the apartheid wall, checkpoints, refugees, and East Jerusalem.

It was created in the immediate aftermath of the Al-Aqsa Intifada in 2000,[1] as a Palestinian civil society undertaking, monitored by volunteers, to disseminate information on events on the ground.[2] They employ a constantly updated email list, which grew from 50 to 13,000 in two years, to inform people over the internet of events regarding the West Bank. [3] Its target audience consists of other NGOs, academia and the press.[4]

They track Palestinian fatalities during the ongoing conflict on a fact sheet.[5]

Do you consider Ynet News to be biased?

 

[nivi]

How is merely documenting Israeli government atrocities "biased"?

The Palestine Monitor is an organization that advocates for the Palestinian people

10chars.

 

[Formaldehyde]

Ah. So any Israeli source is also just as "biased".

 

[nivi]

Ah. So any Israeli source is also just as "biased".

With a mission statement of being an advocate of the Israeli cause? Of course.

 

[Ajidica]

Is B'Tselem or Amira Hass biased against Israel?

 

[Formaldehyde]

With a mission statement of being an advocate of the Israeli cause? Of course.

I would hardly call documenting the facts and being an advocate of a group of people who are being tortured and abused being a "cause".

And what "bias" were you accusing me of earlier? Reading and considering the facts from both sides?

Edit: and 1 of the ever so neutral and as unbiased as you are, PalestineMonitor.

Do you think any of these facts they presented in this article are false? Do you have any evidence they are?

Is B'Tselem or Amira Hass biased against Israel?

Not to mention Haaretz and dozens of other Israeli sources and groups.