GK2- The Training Day Experiment

@ SolarKnight - nice job mapping the western end of what will someday be ours. I thought I'd post a little something for others to consider while I'm looking at your turnlog. We should probably give Sir Bugsy and/or Gengis a chance to adjust the player rotation... or see if there are some new players that would like to step in. (Lurking newbies - there's room!)

So while we wait for "the destructors" to check in, I thought I'd take a moment to share another one of those insights into "real" military stuff applied to civ war. Though this won't be as good as my "confirm or deny" post, if you pay attention, you will be qualified to give serve as a Military Intelligence officer in anybody's army by the time you finish reading this post.

Now, we already know from the F10 trick that France, Germany, Russia, and England are the other civs in this game. Now we examine all known information about the known world from the perspective of an intelligence officer.

When I used to get these briefings, we used to call this "big hand, little map".

Look at the map below, and imagine it blown up to the size of a poster, and plastered on your wall, with me standing slightly off to one side, saying the following:

"The latest intelligence indicates that while France, Germany, Russia, or England might be located in this area (wave hand over small circle) they are more likely located in this area." (wave hand over big circle).

big_hand_little_map.jpg
 
I would say that your conclusion is a very good one, unless there is a civ on an island to the south west, they should all be on the other continent to the east.
 
Not too shabby, i'll let bugsy shadow those turns due to me just walking in the door & needing to get unpacked, take a shower & a nap. But I'll be rereading the logs again & chiming in with some question in the next couple hours.:)
 
Welcome to the team! If you want to spend a couple days reading over things there's alot of tips & hints towards the begining game. I'll be editing things to make it alot easier to breeze through tommorow. We'll slot you into the rotation.:D

Replaying turns now.
 
Sorry for being a slacker. I was sick most of the weekend. I just got the save and I will post a review during lunch (about three hours from now.)

On the surface it looks like you did well SK. Don't even think about the difficulty level. Just handle each problem as it comes up and apply solutions based on your overall goals and strategy.

Getting back to the military intelligence issue, we still have one area where we haven't "confirmed or denyed" - east of Persia. That should be a scouting priority.

Welcome aboard Biny! :wavey: Never been to Indonesia, but I did sail through your waters - Straits of Mallacca

@ Gengis - How do you want to set the roster?
 
Thanks for the advice Bugsy, i just need to refine my micromanagement skills mostly i think. Then i should be in a much better shape totackle this kind of level.
 
Well I'll let bugs finish shadowing the turns then, since I'm up in like 3 other SGs upon my return.

As soon as bugsy posts his log, we'll set the roster & go from there. I plan on slotting the new people(yea, I said people) in quickly since everyone else has already played a couple turns.
 
Definitely need to now what is to the east of Persia. Next player should scout to the east.

Settler factory isn’t working the way it should, probably because the last BG hasn’t been mined. The mine completes next turn, and the factory should then be on autopilot. The citizen on the forest should be moved to the BG so that the extra shield is gained when the mine is completed. That way the city will grow the same turn the settler completes.

Grand River is set up nicely to grow and produce a worker next turn.

Why do you have two warriors just sitting in Niagara Falls? Same with a warrior in Allegheny. Those units could be up north of Tokyo running a block or down on one of the southern choke points. At a minimum they could be out suppressing barbs. We really don’t need MPs right now.

Lux could be lowered 10%, saving 2 gpt. That is without the two MP’s in Niagara.

Hopefully that Japanese warrior won’t attack the unguarded settler. A lot of people will escort a settler with a military unit. I can’t say that I will. Last night, playing Epic 40, I didn’t escort a settler on several occasions. My rule of thumb is to escort the settler if there is a good chance that he will run into a barb. In this situation the Japanese have probably taken care of any barb camps in our north. They love collecting that 25G.

Now let’s look at how we got to where we are now (Solar Knight’s entries will be noted with >>>…….. <<<:


>>> “Pre - Turn: Look at our situation. We are up Mysticisim on the zulus and persians. The Japanese are level.
We are 20 turns to researching Polytheism.
My Plan: 1) Once the settler comes in I will move it to position 4 on the dotmap to allow our units to get closer to japan.
2) I will try to get the worker factory going.
3) If i get a unit in time, I will move it south towards the choke to block the persians.”<<<

This sounds reasonable.


>>>IBT: We don't lose the threatened scout, the barb is killed by the Mongols. The problem now is we have a barb warrior incoming towards Niagra.
There are two options here, move a unit from the capital, or whip a warrior in Niagra. I'm half tempted to whip the warrior as i don't really want to mess up the settler factory, but i'll leave it for the team to decide.<<<

No Mongols in this game. That was a Zulu dude. :D

>>>Turn 1 2110 BC: Reg warrior from capital to Niagra, lux to 20% thanks scoutsout - worker builds road. - scout N onto hill. - rescued scout S then SW.
scout in persia SE then S. <<<

That was excellent head work asking for help from your teammates. I would have built the mine first since getting the shield was a higher priority than getting the extra commerce from the road.

You should check F1 here and bump your lux to 20%. I assume you did since the settler built on time.

>> Turn 2 : Niagra Falls: Warrior -> Warrior - Worker NW to next floodplain.
Scout N to next hill. - Scout W. - Scout SW then W. <<<

Since you have two warriors now in Niagara, I would have attacked with one of them.

With the scout in Persia, I would have moved him w-w. But I can see the benefit of moving him to the coast. It is a judgment call.

>>>Turn 3: The barb dies, another appears. Salamanca: Settler -> Settler<<<

When I saw the second barb come up from the south I would have sent a warrior out in that direction. Well he would be subject to attack next turn, you might say> The barb would be attacking across the river. Don’t know what you did with your scouts, your settler, or your worker. AAAAHHH I see. You combined turns 3 & 4 together.

>>>Turn 4: Will move the settler to position 4, it should arrive there next turn.
Worker builds road. - Scout N to mountain. - Scout W then S (emergency move south as it was right next to a barb camp. - Scout in persia W then N. <<<

That’s why I put the year numbers in my turn log. Again, I would have irrigated first and then built the road. This isn’t a formula. You just need to decide what you want to have more. In the last two cases, I wanted shields/food over gold. Sometimes you want the road for travel purposes. You can also drop your lux to 0% here.

>>>IBT: See Japanese Settler pair move south into zulu territory, zulu archer kills barb in camp, doesn't destroy camp .

Turn 5: Worker (capital) builds mine. - Scout W then W. - Scout NE then NE.
Scout in persia. W then NE. - Settler arrives on position 4. <<<

You could have MM, your settler factory here to get an extra food so you have five extra. If you had the mine completed, your settler factory would now be on autopilot. The scout in Persia could have gone w=>w and learned six more tiles of information. You would normally bump your lux to 10% here to keep from rioting since the capitol grew.

X-man, Shaka and Tokugawa have discovered Iron Working this turn.

>>>Turn 6: Scout NW onto hill, barb camp is no more.
Persian scout W. - Allegheny founded on position 4 of the dotmap. set to warrior.
Scout SW then W. <<<
How about the other two scouts?

>>IBT: A persian warrior appears south of Grand river. Could be bad, could be nothing. There will be a second warrior in Grand River next turn just in time.

Turn 7: Trade IW for Mysticism with the X - man (persia for the newbies out there) - Niagara worker build irrigation. - Scout N then NW - Persian Scout W then N. - Scout W then W. <<<

I wouldn’t have sweat having the Persian approaching. What I would be bummed about is having a unit get past the check point. Once I get a tech like IW, I always look to see where it is. You do that next turn. More importantly, does X-man have it? - Yes Does Japan have it? – No Does Shaka? – Yes I always do Ctrl-Shift-M just in case a resource is under a city.

>>Turn 8: Salamanca:Settler -> Settler. - Niagra: Warrior -> Worker.
Grand River: Warrior -> Worker (next player veto if you want.) (Warrior is being sent south to block the chokepoint. NOT on goto order.)
We have iron but Allegheny will need a temple to get it, so im moving a warrior from niagra to allegheny then switching allegheny to temple.
Settler sent to Allegheny so that it can be moved up towards the japanese.
Scout W. - Scout NW. - Persian Scout N then N. <<<<

The horse is out of the barn but at least we can keep part of the herd in. Why do you need the warrior in Allegheny? Put those warriors out where they can be of use. Don’t know where these scouts are now.

>>> Turn 9: The Zulu begin the Oracle. There is that wonder you were talking about scoutsout - Everyone is even on tech now. we have 14 turns to go to get mysticism at current rate. (until the lux is dropped again.) - Persia scout E then NE. - Scout E then E. - Scout Ne then E.

Actually you are researching Poly, but minor point. Lux should be at 10% right now.

>>> Turn 10: Scout in persia N then NE. - Settler 1 E from Allegheny to avoid a jap warrior, probably just a scout. - Scout NE - Scout NW then N.<<<

By adjusting the slider, I was able to come up with 391G at the end of my turns as opposed to 376G at the end of Solar Knight’s turns. That’s 15G that might make a difference in a trade some time. Nuff said.

Think about why you are doing something and when you have a choice, think about your options. Don’t just do something because that’s the way you’ve always done it.

With the iron, do you need the temple right away or will you get it with a future city? Need to check that on the dot map.
 
Thanks for the analysis Bugsy, all ill say is that i was a bit panicky still due to coursework, but i didnt want to hold up the game any further, I accept my critisism it is very fair.

Thanks :)
 
Since a couple of our new teammates claim to be pretty new to the game, I thought I'd put together a little crash course on the mechanics of micromanaging. ("MM" in the turnlogs) If this is basic stuff you guys already know, I apologize in advance if you find this insulting ... if this stuff is new to you, download the latest save and play with some of the things I'm about to show you.

As we've discussed earlier in the thread, our settler factory needs 2 things: +5 food per turn (fpt) and 30 shields every 4 turns. Let's take a look at our city.

01_TDG_Mouse_Hover.jpg


The next screenshot shows what Sir Bugsy saw when he said "Settler factory isn’t working the way it should...The citizen on the forest should be moved to the BG ..." Notice that the city is only producing 4 surplus food per turn (+4fpt). By hovering the mouse pointer over the food/shields/gold symbol on the forest, a citizen is "highlighted".

02__TDG_MM_1.jpg


By "clicking" on our forest tile, we have taken her off the tile, and created an entertainer. (We don't really need an entertainer, this is just what happens. Notice that the food (and shields) drop even lower.

03_TDG_MM_2.jpg


To complete our MM, we click on the "BG" (Bonus Grassland) tile that our worker is presently mining. This re-tasks our entertainer to work that tile. Note that the city is now producing +5fpt...and how quickly will it complete our next settler?

04__TDG_MM_3.jpg


If you already knew all this, I hope you're not still reading.... but if this stuff is a little bit new to you, download SolarKnight's save, open up the game, and play around with the city. Set the build queue to Temple, and see how quickly you can build it by MM the citizens to high-shield tiles. Set the queue back to Settler, and get it back to +5fpt. Later in the game, we might be able to squeeze a unit out one turn faster with a little mircomanagement...
 
Very nice Scouts! I'm gonna play with CF's list a bit, and update it & post some question about where we're going from here.
 
Well got the list posted. binyo66 check out the 2nd post, it has the hilights of what we've done so far so you don't have to wade through 30 pages.

Questions coming next followed by an edit to the list in the next day or two.
 
alerum68- Welcome aboard. Our roster is now closed(we may have 1 more person joining us that PMed me yesterday). Check out the first 2 posts of the thread for background info, then download the save & jump right into the discussion. Me & Bugsy will hammer out a new roster today.


Q1. Niagra Falls: worker finishes his job in 1(but still has movement if you want to change him. What changes would you make?
Niagra_Falls.JPG





Q2. The settler: Where’s he headed? You waiting on an escort(from where)? Why or why not? What does your location bring to our empite(why’d you chose that site)? Are you still going for RCP, how does that location effect the rest of the layout if so?

settler.JPG





Q3. Research: Does everyone having Myst affect our 40turn Poly gambit(due in 11)? Why or why not? What’s the next tech you’d like to research, how, and why?

Q4. Scouts: Our 2 scouts behind Zulu lines, what are you going to do with them?

Q5. Warriors: We have 1 to the south, 2 forted in Niagra Falls, and 1 in Grand River, Salamanca, and Allegheny. What are you doing with each?

Q6. Any Civ that you are particularly worried about, who & why?

Q7. For Solar Knight: Open the save, and what changes would you make without hitting a new turn? Everyone else can chime in after he answers.

[edit- sorry about the sloppy pics, I was in a rush.]
 
Originally posted by Gengis Khan

Q2. The settler: Where’s he headed? You waiting on an escort(from where)? Why or why not? What does your location bring to our empite(why’d you chose that site)? Are you still going for RCP, how does that location effect the rest of the layout if so?

[/B]

I wonder about that too.
 
Well who should I ask.;)

What's your ideas?
 
Hey Gengis, who's up next? Why don't we get that player's ideas? If you're going to slot one of the new guys, discussing next moves might help them make their moves a little more confidently... (I know some have been reluctant to joing for fear of "messing up"... as one who recently joined an SG in progress, I know how that feels...)
 
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