GOTM-02: Pre-Game discussion

[ainwood]

A quick question...

Which patch are we to use for IVotm 2?

I don't want to download and install the new one if we are to use the old one.

Thanks!

People must play in v1.52. Any playing in the original release or v109 will have their submissions rejected (although they probably won't load anyway).

 

[DaveMcW]

deleted (ainwood's too fast!)

 

[remconius]

Forests just outside your radius can be chopped for full shields. So moving east is not a problem, unless you are one of those tree-hugger types that leaves them uncut.

The optimal "explorers gambit" would be:
1. Settler SE, N
1. Warrior NE
2. Warrior NE
2. Settler can build in place, move-and-build, or walk north if the warrior sees fish.

But the start is so good, that I can't justify wasting a turn in hopes of making it just a little bit better.

I prefer to clean-cut as much as possible to get a boost early on that helps the entire game. However in this case it is our only source of some extra shields for quite a while. Could be useful to keep some forest for production in this case.

Btw, DaveMcW, how is your 4OTM1 going? Will it be the fastest victory?

 

[Nichelle]

Thanks for the quick answer and the link guys!

 

[Soul oWar]

Never played a l;ake map, but isn't city not ablt to build lighthouse and stuff when only connected to lake?

 

[Methos]

To the northeast of the settler is sea coast tile.

 

[Jason Fliegel]

To the northeast of the settler is sea coast tile.

Lake maps, by definition, have no sea coast. As a result, no lighthouses and no harbors.

 

[DaviddesJ]

Lake maps, by definition, have no sea coast. As a result, no lighthouses and no harbors.

I don't think this is true. The water to the northeast has only 1 food on it; it must be coast and not lake.

 

[DaviddesJ]

People must play in v1.52. Any playing in the original release or v109 will have their submissions rejected (although they probably won't load anyway).

I suggest you edit the opening post in this thread, to restate that 1.52 is required.

Of course, I assume it will be stated in the download announcement, too.

 

[DaviddesJ]

Almost all starts in civ4 look good.

That's not my experience. Perhaps it's because the game systematically gives worse starts at higher difficulty levels, but most of the random starts I get at Emperor look a lot worse than this one.

 

[Shillen]

That's not my experience. Perhaps it's because the game systematically gives worse starts at higher difficulty levels, but most of the random starts I get at Emperor look a lot worse than this one.

It's definitely true that you get worse starting locations on higher difficulties, but they're not much worse than this start. Just to check I started a bunch of games on emperor with the same map settings and I got a few better locations than this GOTM start while the rest were not quite as good but not bad at all. This start for gotm actually has a pretty big misfortune of starting near both tundra and desert. That's rare on a tropical lakes map.

 

[DaviddesJ]

It's definitely true that you get worse starting locations on higher difficulties, but they're not much worse than this start. Just to check I started a bunch of games on emperor with the same map settings and I got a few better locations than this GOTM start while the rest were not quite as good but not bad at all. This start for gotm actually has a pretty big misfortune of starting near both tundra and desert. That's rare on a tropical lakes map.

The big plus for this start is that you have the lakes and you're also on the coast, so you can build lighthouse and get 3f from the lakes. That's a lot better than having lakes but no coast so that you can only ever get 2f from them.

(I believe we'll be able to build lighthouse. If that's not true, as Jason Fliegel claims, then this isn't a good start at all.)

 

[KevinTMC]

Settling in place seems good to me, because my hunch is that the only useful tile to the north is the tundra forest. Moving north would encompass more non-useful tiles; moving south would leave more useful tiles unoccupied between my starting city and the icecap. And I think it's a fool's errand to try to find a better location laterally, since I'd be shocked if we were close to either the western or eastern edge of the map.

Also, this position is good for my modified tree-hugger strategy. I chop forests just outside my city radius as soon as possible--and I can see two such here. Then, if I am lucky, the multiple adjoining forests I preserve inside the city radius will spread back outside, and I can do more chopping, all without sacrificing the long-term shields, which will be especially precious for London in this game.

Last month was my first-ever GOTM and I enjoyed it a great dea. It left me chomping at the bit for this one, especially now that I know to install a logging mod beforehand so that I can write up a nice report to share. Any chance that you'd release it a few days early, for the benefit of those of us who've got extra free time to spend between Christmas and New Year's?

-- Kevin​

P.S. Clarification on how those tiles that appear to be coastal will behave on this Lakes map would be much appreciated.

 

[Jason Fliegel]

I don't think this is true. The water to the northeast has only 1 food on it; it must be coast and not lake.

You're right. That's weird. Every lake map I've played on (and granted, it's only been 2 or 3) has had no seas. I wonder if the GOTM staff modded this map -- or maybe my lake map games haven't been representative (or maybe this one isn't representative).

Anyway, sorry for spreading misinformation!

 

[pindicator]

Lake maps are mostly fresh water, but the larger "lakes" become 1f "sea" tiles. And larger is very much a relative term!

 

[DuncanIdaho v.1]

If Harkonnen comes out with a patch compatible with v1.52, can completed games be submitted when played with that patch? ...Assuming it happens within the next week or so, and doesn't affect any changes in rules, only game performance.

 

[Smirk]

The lake will extend the river. You may need sailing to connect it, though.

You don't need Sailing, it acts as a river as far as connecting is concerned. The finer point I don't know is whether a salt water lake acts the same as fresh water and rivers or as coast which does need Sailing. I'd assume the latter as it makes more sense programatically.

 

[Jove]

I'm glad to see it. Prince, fine. English, anytime.

With a start like this, I rather think the Pyramids + religion could come quite in handy. Holy City off a GP, gold like nutz, exploit chopping to get 1st settler in hammer heaven... culture victory?

 

[LeSphinx]

As I never played CIV4 Epic Game, what is the legendary culture needed for your 3 cities in order to win by culture ?

thanks in advance

 

[remconius]

Was rebuilding the map in the world builder to see what Londen would be like, when I realised there are three plains hills to the south of Londen. Good spot for the second city, to make up for lack of production in Londen.

The red arrows indicate the directions the AI could be coming from, assuming we are in the north middle. In my test game there was 4 AI near me: 11 tiles east, 14 west and about 20 SE and SW!! We'll probably have to expand to the SE and maybe W, as N and SW are poor terrain.There also seems to be coast to the N of the plains hill.

*edit* one more thing, those 4 forests provide 2 health... giving 6 base health. +2 from sheep and wheat. We just need happiness to compensate.