GOTM 17 Pre-Game Discussion

[Erkon]

Could someone please tell me what WFYABTA stands for? I get that it relates to tradability of techs. Maybe I am blind, but I scrolled back and forth an still couldn't figure it out.

We Fear You Are Becoming Too Advanced. Something the AI has as an excuse not to trade tech. This will occur when you have traded a lot, although it is not definite. I've experienced an AI dropping his WFYABTA-stance to "yeah, lets trade".

 

[Vynd]

Originally Posted by Erkon
In this game, the Challenger Class save is unfavourable if your aiming for a conquest victory... [LowtherCastle]But why? I'm curious how do you think that through?[LowtherCastle]

I can't say I follow Erkon and DaviddesJ's discussion about Alphabet etc., but it does seem to me that if you are trying for a fast Conquest your ideal is to have the AIs be backwards and isolated, so you can beat them through sheer firepower and smart tactics without having to develop advanced units. The same would seem to apply to Domination, but too a lesser extent.

Whereas if you're trying for a Space Race or Diplomatic win, especially the former, you're going to need to acquire a lot of technology. Smart trading with the AIs is essential to moving through the tech tree at top speed. And while the extra techs will give the AI a headstart, all that means is they will have more technologies to trade with you when you beeline your way to something they want.

Cultural victories also require a fair amount of research, at least the way most people play them, but not nearly as much as Space Race or Diplomatic. Still, I'm not so sure I agree with Erkon that the AI having a leg up on technology is a benefit for a Cultural player. As he pointed out it means the AIs are likely to beat you to the early religions. You might want to found those yourself when playing for Culture. They'll have something of an advantage when it comes to Confucianism, Judaism, and even Christianity, too. A Cultural game where you fail to found any of those five religions could be tough, especially on an island map where religions may not spread as easily on their own.

 

[Mastiff_of_Ar]

For what it's worth! I'm not the best worldbuilder...

 

[AgedOne]

For what it's worth! I'm not the best worldbuilder...

Arrgh! Is this map designed to depress us so much that when we see the real one we are pleasantly surprised!?

I've just started (only the first few moves so far) and I'll give it a try up to 500BC to get a feel for it.

My first impression is that it's a bit unkinder to the player than most of the randomly-generated trials that I've been looking at. However, none of mine are attempting to match the visible start location.

Thanks for your efforts tho. I find WorldBuilder a touch slow and frustrating to use, so I can appreciate the work.

 

[AlanH]

I have now released HOF-Mac-1.61.011 for the Mac players out there. The saves for GOTM 17 are set up to use this new version of the HoF Mod, which fixes a lot of bugs and adds some new features.

There's also a new version for Warlords, HOF-Mac-20.8.004, that will be used for WOTM 8.

Both versions are downloadable in the Mac forum thread.

 

[Mastiff_of_Ar]

Arrgh! Is this map designed to depress us so much that when we see the real one we are pleasantly surprised!?

Well, erm... I added a little land mass without adding any extra resources. Other than that, it's just how it loaded! It does seem kind of "worst case", but you never know, right?

 

[AgedOne]

... It does seem kind of "worst case", but you never know, right?

Quite right. It should be available on the 1st, shouldn't it? Well, in a few hours time we'll be looking at the actual one. I do feel that the GOTM authors like to add their own stamp to the map - something interesting here and there - something quirky (hopefully not cruel) to give us a problem or two to solve.

Anyway, I had a play through this map, and I was fairly awful. Me, not the map, take note. I think if I have got anything from this one it is to be far more careful than I was here about getting the most out of the meagre resources. I basically suffered from low food and low productivity. I failed to get the wonders I went for. Never built a big enough force to mount any early attacks. My only achievement was circumnavigation.
That won't win it for me!

 

[slowrider]

Following are the changes with HOF V1.61.010. The new "field of view" option is kind of neat ... it allows you to see more territory before you zoom out to space and I like that.


Upgrade from V1.61.010 to V1.61.011

Changes:
fixed - Changed code for unit movement on plot owner change, city flip and city capture to match the code in warlords
fixed - Changed code for Gifting transport with units in it to match the code in warlords
fixed - Bugfix for defensive pacts flipping state of permanent peace into permanent war
fixed - Added fix for loosing visibility from satelite tech when regenerating maps in Future ages
fixed - ALT-g regeneration not checking canRegenerate function
fixed - redundant HOF Warning message (possible cause of warning lagging from prior game)
fixed - Mod. Special Domestic Advisor: Production (Hammer) column not sort correctly
fixed - Exotic Foreign Advisor: rewrote Technology screen tech logic
fixed - MoreCiv4lerts Tech Trades one turn lag - Changed how Tech Trading alert was being trigger to get it to run after tech updates
fixed - MoreCiv4lerts Culture expansion message not display when culture would equal threshhold - change check to >=
fixed - Exotic Foreign Advisor: HolyCity check when Civ has No religion - (lustus code snippet)
fixed - "Delay for Upate" typo in HOF options
fixed - Autolog onChangeWar python error

added - Enhanced Unit Icons to show pending promo and unit actions - ruff_hi mod
added - Option to dynamically alter Field of View parameter (Gyathaar SDK change)
added - Additional autolog features from ruff_hi mod's version.
- Silent Option (default off) - start Autolog without prompt for name. use defualt named
- Default Log File Name (default off) - use Player Name (i.e. joe.txt) instead of "autolog.txt"
- Show IBT (default off) - inserts "IBT" comment at the end of human turn and prior to computer turns
- First Turn 1 (default off) - integrated turn count start number from Clock Text mod with Autolog
- Log Civics (default on)
- Log Attitude (default on)
added - Options Screen - increase screen size to accomadate new options (autolog, Civ4lerts, Unit icons, etc.)
added - ALT-A to manually check domination and tech trades

 

[slowrider]

For what it's worth! I'm not the best worldbuilder...

Looks good to me and thanks for the practice game. After the first few moves we should know how the island is laid out and your test game can easily be updated to reflect the actual conditions. I find it very helpful to practice the early game.

 

[AlanH]

Note: Some of the items from the above list rely on the Windows-only DLL, and are not available in the Mac version.

 

[Mastiff_of_Ar]

Looks good to me and thanks for the practice game. After the first few moves we should know how the island is laid out and your test game can easily be updated to reflect the actual conditions. I find it very helpful to practice the early game.

No problem... I'm always asking for other people to make them, so I make them every few games, too. Seems only fair.

 

[petritis]

We Fear You Are Becoming Too Advanced. Something the AI has as an excuse not to trade tech. This will occur when you have traded a lot, although it is not definite. I've experienced an AI dropping his WFYABTA-stance to "yeah, lets trade".

Thanks for the info.

One more thing, when do the GOTM's usually start?
Is it a manual thing that happens to make them available, or is it automatic in which case any idea when GMT they become available (I am wondering if I should stay up and wait for it, or go to bed and start tomorrow).

 

[DaviddesJ]

We Fear You Are Becoming Too Advanced. Something the AI has as an excuse not to trade tech. This will occur when you have traded a lot, although it is not definite. I've experienced an AI dropping his WFYABTA-stance to "yeah, lets trade".

It is "definite" in that the counter for each civ always increments when you make a trade after meeting it.

However, the counters will also randomly decrease over time, and this effect is not entirely predictable.

There are several threads on this, including a good recent one:

Wfyabta

 

[AlanH]

@petritis: Midnight server time ... if the Game Master gets the release page together in time.

The server's on UTC-4 currently.

 

[jesusin]

Thank you, DaviddesJ. I didn't know that.
Still wondering if it has some major implications, I can't seem to find any.